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C-Record hub questions

Old 06-24-20, 10:54 PM
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C-Record hub questions

I'm overhauling a front C-Record hub. When cones are adjusted properly and dustcaps are off, they spin very smoothly with no resistance, but when I add the dustcaps there is a noticeable addition of resistance. It's strange - it's not that they feel rough like a dirty bearing, they just seem to give more resistance than I'd expect. I've done this in the past and don't remember this happening... A couple of questions:

1) Is this normal?

2) Should the hub dustcaps rotate with the hubshell, or remain "stuck" to the axle? I'm guessing the former...

Any tips appreciated!
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Old 06-24-20, 11:37 PM
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Never had C-Record hubs, but have had very similar dust cap issues when the cap is not perfectly round around the cone or the axle is a tiny bit bent.
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Old 06-25-20, 01:29 PM
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Dustcaps should stay with the hub. I've had some C-Record ones that were worn, and spun with the axle. Are the cones original in yours?
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Old 06-25-20, 03:40 PM
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Sometimes you can distort dust caps when prying with off and that can cause this symptom, as can a bent axle. C-Record hubs had a dedicated dust cap removal tool.
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Old 06-25-20, 05:15 PM
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Originally Posted by T-Mar View Post
C-Record hubs had a dedicated dust cap removal tool.
Of course they did.
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Old 06-25-20, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by T-Mar View Post
...C-Record hubs had a dedicated dust cap removal tool.
Originally Posted by P!N20 View Post
Of course they did.
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Old 06-25-20, 07:44 PM
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Damn, even their dust cover extractors look desirable.

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Old 06-25-20, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by P!N20 View Post
Damn, even their dust cover extractors look desirable.


Which is why I still have one, even though I have no more C-Record hubs.
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Old 06-25-20, 08:24 PM
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Has anyone ever made a Youtube video of overhauling a vintage Campy hub?

I have searched in the past and found lots of videos on the new stuff but nothing on the vintage stuff.

Gotta be an audience for this, right?
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Old 06-25-20, 08:59 PM
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Thanks for the input, everyone. I won't be able to dig into these again until the weekend, but this has been helpful. I've gathered that there should be no increase in friction with the dust caps attached.

I believe the cones are stock.

The dust caps do stay with the hubshell as they should.

I'll check the axle too.
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Old 06-25-20, 10:14 PM
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Originally Posted by jet sanchEz View Post
Has anyone ever made a Youtube video of overhauling a vintage Campy hub?

I have searched in the past and found lots of videos on the new stuff but nothing on the vintage stuff.

Gotta be an audience for this, right?
That's because the old hubs were simpler than the new ones. I learned how to do it by... taking a hub apart and putting it back together. This was back before Youtube, the internet, Dodge minivans, CD's, etc. etc.

Park Tool has good step-by-step instructions: https://www.parktool.com/blog/repair...and-adjustment
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Old 06-27-20, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by delicious View Post
. . .
1) Is this normal?
. . .
Any tips appreciated!
I think yes, in the sense that, like people, materials normally get more decrepit, not less, as they age.

I've got one of these bought new way back when, The seals from the get-go always dragged on the cones a bit but my recollection is that the rub was so slight it didn't slow the wheel down much, even if it felt "sticky" in the fingers. With the wheel clamped in the fork it would drift to a stop almost as expected, except that the final few degrees were more abrupt than with the unsealed Nuovo Record hubs we loved so much (and still do.) As it happened the hub was mounted on my rando bike which stopped getting much use once my wife and I got seriously into tandeming -- to this day most of our long rides are deux. So I was a bit surprised, on getting the old Mariposa ready for a century last summer, at how sticky the front hub seemed. It doesn't bind exactly, there just seems to be more drag than I remembered when it was new. As expected there is more starting friction than there is sliding friction. With the seals off, it spins perfectly, like yours does. The cones are adjusted so that the very slight play is taken up when the QR is clamped on spacers to mimic the dropouts. I doubt if the drag is enough to slow me down any more than age already has but I agree it just doesn't seem right.

Your post reminds me that I had planned to pop the seals off and try to increase the bore with emery cloth until the seal material no longer wipes the cones. Could it be that the sealing surface, which feels like some sort of elastomer, has expanded or roughened with age and encroaches more on the cones now? I don't think anything is bent. As you know, the dust cap is a rigid chunk of material, not the thin discs of metal used on other hubs which, yes, can easily be deformed during removal. I suppose if I rode the bike for a few thousand km the cones would wear their way into the sealing material and the problem would solve itself.

The other quirk with these hubs is that you can't get at the cones to adjust them with the seals in place. Even the locknuts are partially buried in the seal. (I always thought of C-Record as "more show than go" and this was one reason.) I cheat by dripping oil into them through the oil hole and try to avoid removing the seals for any reason, since I don't have the removal tool. So far I've had good luck prying them off gently with a broad blunt-edged tool that is nearly as thick as the gap between seal and hub -- not a screwdriver which will chip the seal. Reinstall by placing a socket big enough to clear the locknut over the axle end and tap gently and squarely home with the other end of the axle supported on a hard surface like a vice jaw. I don't know how many times you can do this before something breaks, so oil, not grease, is what this hub gets. (It was only the unusual resistance encountered during inspection that caused me to suspect the worst and remove the seals for a closer look.)
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Old 06-27-20, 08:45 PM
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Originally Posted by jet sanchEz View Post
Has anyone ever made a Youtube video of overhauling a vintage Campy hub?

I have searched in the past and found lots of videos on the new stuff but nothing on the vintage stuff.

Gotta be an audience for this, right?
Tom Cuthbertson's Anybody's Bike Book did it for me, back when a "10-speed" meant 5 sprockets on a freewheel. Developing "thread sense" was, and is, the key skill for an amateur wrench.
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Old 06-27-20, 09:27 PM
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Originally Posted by conspiratemus1 View Post
I think yes, in the sense that, like people, materials normally get more decrepit, not less, as they age.

I've got one of these bought new way back when, The seals from the get-go always dragged on the cones a bit but my recollection is that the rub was so slight it didn't slow the wheel down much, even if it felt "sticky" in the fingers. With the wheel clamped in the fork it would drift to a stop almost as expected, except that the final few degrees were more abrupt than with the unsealed Nuovo Record hubs we loved so much (and still do.) As it happened the hub was mounted on my rando bike which stopped getting much use once my wife and I got seriously into tandeming -- to this day most of our long rides are deux. So I was a bit surprised, on getting the old Mariposa ready for a century last summer, at how sticky the front hub seemed. It doesn't bind exactly, there just seems to be more drag than I remembered when it was new. As expected there is more starting friction than there is sliding friction. With the seals off, it spins perfectly, like yours does. The cones are adjusted so that the very slight play is taken up when the QR is clamped on spacers to mimic the dropouts. I doubt if the drag is enough to slow me down any more than age already has but I agree it just doesn't seem right.

Your post reminds me that I had planned to pop the seals off and try to increase the bore with emery cloth until the seal material no longer wipes the cones. Could it be that the sealing surface, which feels like some sort of elastomer, has expanded or roughened with age and encroaches more on the cones now? I don't think anything is bent. As you know, the dust cap is a rigid chunk of material, not the thin discs of metal used on other hubs which, yes, can easily be deformed during removal. I suppose if I rode the bike for a few thousand km the cones would wear their way into the sealing material and the problem would solve itself.
This is exactly what I'm talking about, and it's also how I fixed it last night! It was clear when I was messing with it last night that the drag was a rubber-on-metal feel, rather than a metal-on-metal feel. I suspected that the rubber seal inside the dust cap was dragging just slightly on the cone/spacer/locknut and on inspecting it closely it was just slightly smaller in inner diameter than the inner diameter of the dust cap. So I took 80 grit sandpaper and removed a tenth or two of a millimeter off of the seal, and now the dustcaps add no additional drag.
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Old 06-27-20, 09:38 PM
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Originally Posted by delicious View Post
This is exactly what I'm talking about, and it's also how I fixed it last night! . . .
Oh yay! I'm delighted to hear that you were successful. I am definitely going to follow suit. 80 grit, yes, go big or go home, right?
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