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Vintage shoe repair

Old 07-22-20, 08:31 AM
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rosefarts
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Vintage shoe repair

The old pair of Nike's that I got are coming unbonded. Aside from that, they're a 9/10, having only been worn a few times almost 35 years ago. I had this happen to a pair of old ice climbing boots too. Stiff shank + time + flexible upper. It's bound to happen eventually.

I talked to the guy that does my climbing shoes, he said his glue won't bond it. I think it would but he warranties all his work and you know the story.

Barge cement? Local cobbler, Rocky Mountain Resole?

They're near perfect fit for me, and in super condition, so I'd love to keep them.
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Old 07-22-20, 08:32 AM
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Old 07-22-20, 09:15 AM
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Not the first time I have seen this. Happens to Nikes as well as other brands. When those shoes were made, some pretty nasty solvents were used to clean the sole and the upper before the glue was applied. The solvent allowed the glue to penetrate a bit into the very dissimilar materials in the sole and upper giving a bond that seems to have lasted a bit longer than the length of time that Nike expected the shoes might be worn.
You might try a hot melt glue gun in the afflicted area..hot melt glue was first used in shoes and is still used in a lot of footwear. The results might not be pretty but will work for a while. But as other parts of the upper degrade, the bond between the glue and the upper will fail as the fabric comes apart, albeit on a very micro level.
I feel your pain. Had a pair of older cycling shoes of another brand. Put them on after they had sat for a few years. Went to pull the laces tight and the entire upper split a long a seam. Diamonds might be forever but synthetic leather is not.
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Old 07-22-20, 09:29 AM
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Shoe Goo could be your best bet. Barge might work too. Depends on the material. If I had to make a WAG I'd bet on Shoe goo.

Best option would be to try a small test spot with both types of adhesive, and see what adheres best.
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Old 07-22-20, 10:45 AM
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Not cheap, 3M Windoweld.
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Old 07-22-20, 11:03 AM
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I'm going to be out of town for the next few days but will revisit this on Monday.

I'm starting to think a combo of short screws, similar to those used to attach bindings to skis on the thick side and rivets on the thinner. Set it all up with barge cement prior.
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Old 07-22-20, 11:34 AM
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Shoe Goo
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Old 07-22-20, 12:35 PM
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as much as I use Shoe Goo and contact cement, I suggest consulting a professional!

I had a very similar failure in some old Duegi shoes and went to the local cobbler (shoe repair shop). These folks have experience and a supply of adhesives. They will know how to prep the surfaces, how much adhesive to apply, how to apply it, and then will be able to clamp it properly until it sets.

I think I paid $15 or so, and the shoe has held up fine (it's been a couple of years since). Seems like a good investment in shoes that can't be replaced.

Steve in Peoria
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Old 07-22-20, 01:10 PM
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Originally Posted by steelbikeguy View Post
as much as I use Shoe Goo and contact cement, I suggest consulting a professional!

I had a very similar failure in some old Duegi shoes and went to the local cobbler (shoe repair shop). These folks have experience and a supply of adhesives. They will know how to prep the surfaces, how much adhesive to apply, how to apply it, and then will be able to clamp it properly until it sets.

I think I paid $15 or so, and the shoe has held up fine (it's been a couple of years since). Seems like a good investment in shoes that can't be replaced.

Steve in Peoria
+1 this. I had my Nike shoes separate from their soles. The local cobbler shop fixed them up, good as new, for under $15.
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Old 07-22-20, 09:14 PM
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I'd use contact cement or barge glue. Is shoe goo strong enough?
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Old 07-22-20, 09:47 PM
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Shoe Goo is quite strong enough and is very adherent to surfaces.

One key is its ability to stretch. This stretch spreads the forces over the maximum possible surface area minimizing the probability of failure.

As always, good surface prep is key - clean the surfaces.
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Old 07-22-20, 10:40 PM
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This is a job for 3M 5200. $20 a grease gun tube. White or a lot more expensive in black. Sets up with time and humidity. A working time of hours. Takes several days (at least). Very messy to work with and hard to clean up. With a properly clan surface, it bonds. It lasts. The bonds last. White shouldn't be too hard to find. Call West Marine for black. (I bet the 3M website will connect you.)

Boatbuilders used it (and probably still do) to glue fiberglass decks down to the molded-in flanges on fiberglass hulls. The procedure was - hold the deck in the air above the hull. Go around the flange and lay a nice snake of plenty of 5200. Lower the deck and insert the bolts from the outside (every 6-8" or every rail extrusion bolt hole). Go inside the boat, clean up, start the washers and nuts, tighten systematically and clean up as you go. Clean up some more. (Clean up - acetone barely touches the stuff. Epoxy and lacquer thinner or the like works far better. Have good outside air. The 5200 itself isn't very aromatic.) Once it sets up , it is a a very firm rubber-like. Any lumps under your foot are there for good. Likewise under straps.

5200 will do the job but you will have to think out the approach carefully or you will have a nightmare of a mess on your hands. Once it sets up, you've got what you got. There's no going back. Think permanent. It won't be any different in 30 years. The key (I think, not having your shoe in my hand nor having stopped and thought while not typing (typing and thinking are a lot harder for me than walking and chewing gum) is going to be getting a nice, even properly thick coat, then keeping the bond firmly and evenly pressed together. Maybe stuff the inside with socks or dried beans or ... then wrapping the outside up tightly with say duct tape. Come back in an hour, tweak if need be, then - leave it until next week..The deed is done. Now, good job or poor, it will outlast the rest of the shoe.

Think ahead of time what else might want the 5200 treatment, You'll barely be touching the tube you paid so much for and you have a only a few days while the tube is usable once opened.

Ben
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Old 07-24-20, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by steelbikeguy View Post
as much as I use Shoe Goo and contact cement, I suggest consulting a professional!

I had a very similar failure in some old Duegi shoes and went to the local cobbler (shoe repair shop). These folks have experience and a supply of adhesives. They will know how to prep the surfaces, how much adhesive to apply, how to apply it, and then will be able to clamp it properly until it sets.

I think I paid $15 or so, and the shoe has held up fine (it's been a couple of years since). Seems like a good investment in shoes that can't be replaced.

Steve in Peoria
+1
Many cobblers are craftsmen, and they have adapted to the changes in shoe tech.
Some of them can fix almost anything footworn, including bike shoes.
I've had them put new pads on the toes and heels that are 10x better than the original ones.

I wouldn't buy or wear a new Nike product, but that's a different matter.
I wears what I already gots...
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Old 07-24-20, 09:41 AM
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Liquid Nails. Used on a pair of Duegis 10 years ago. Still going strong.
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Old 07-24-20, 01:13 PM
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I have had good results using tire glue, as well as Shoe Goo. To be clear, I don't mean at the same time.
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Old 07-24-20, 01:32 PM
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Super glue

I the method at "Retread-Running-Shoes-With-Upcycled-Bike-Tire" on the Instructables.Com site and found it very satisfactory. He uses Boot-fix, a premium superglue. It's worked well for me.

I've also used Shoe Goo in the past (24hr cure time) with good results. 5200 would be all right if you didn't mind the cost and 7 day cure time. It actually is pretty easy to clean up uncured material with thinner.

BTW, what's this "barge glue" y'all speak of?
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Old 07-24-20, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr. Spadoni View Post
When those shoes were made, some pretty nasty solvents were used to clean the sole and the upper before the glue was applied. The solvent allowed the glue to penetrate a bit into the very dissimilar materials in the sole and upper giving a bond that seems to have lasted a bit longer than the length of time that Nike expected the shoes might be worn....
So what solvents are used now? Do they make the shoes less durable because the are less nasty? Genuinely curious...
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Old 07-24-20, 05:50 PM
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Originally Posted by 79pmooney View Post
This is a job for 3M 5200. $20 a grease gun tube
I'm sure it will work. But if a local cobbler can do it for less, why not go that route?
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Old 07-24-20, 07:17 PM
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Originally Posted by 79pmooney View Post
This is a job for 3M 5200. $20 a grease gun tube. White or a lot more expensive in black. Sets up with time and humidity. A working time of hours. Takes several days (at least). Very messy to work with and hard to clean up. With a properly clan surface, it bonds. It lasts. The bonds last. White shouldn't be too hard to find. Call West Marine for black. (I bet the 3M website will connect you.)

Boatbuilders used it (and probably still do) to glue fiberglass decks down to the molded-in flanges on fiberglass hulls. The procedure was - hold the deck in the air above the hull. Go around the flange and lay a nice snake of plenty of 5200. Lower the deck and insert the bolts from the outside (every 6-8" or every rail extrusion bolt hole). Go inside the boat, clean up, start the washers and nuts, tighten systematically and clean up as you go. Clean up some more. (Clean up - acetone barely touches the stuff. Epoxy and lacquer thinner or the like works far better. Have good outside air. The 5200 itself isn't very aromatic.) Once it sets up , it is a a very firm rubber-like. Any lumps under your foot are there for good. Likewise under straps.

5200 will do the job but you will have to think out the approach carefully or you will have a nightmare of a mess on your hands. Once it sets up, you've got what you got. There's no going back. Think permanent. It won't be any different in 30 years. The key (I think, not having your shoe in my hand nor having stopped and thought while not typing (typing and thinking are a lot harder for me than walking and chewing gum) is going to be getting a nice, even properly thick coat, then keeping the bond firmly and evenly pressed together. Maybe stuff the inside with socks or dried beans or ... then wrapping the outside up tightly with say duct tape. Come back in an hour, tweak if need be, then - leave it until next week..The deed is done. Now, good job or poor, it will outlast the rest of the shoe.

Think ahead of time what else might want the 5200 treatment, You'll barely be touching the tube you paid so much for and you have a only a few days while the tube is usable once opened.

Ben
I avoided mentioning 5200 as it is not good for all plastic materials. Need to read the tech info.
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Old 07-24-20, 08:22 PM
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Tubular tire glue. I used some recently on work boots.
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Old 07-24-20, 09:49 PM
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[QUOTE=robertorolfo;21605100]So what solvents are used now? Do they make the shoes less durable because the are less nasty? Genuinely curious...[/I am told by those I know who make shoes, and I live in a Portland, where you cant throw a shoe without hitting someone in the footwear biz( Nike, adidas, Columbia, Underamour, Columbia, Keen, Danner, etc, all have a presence here), that they went to water based solvents a few years ago. Still as strong, but much better for those who have to work with them. Exactly which ones, I dont know.
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Old 07-25-20, 07:20 AM
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The problem here is the rest of the sole is going to separate sooner or later. The entire sole needs to be reglued. You can try to separate the pieces yourself, I would leave that to a cobbler.

Is this one of the Italian made Nike’s? When Nike first entered bike shoes the product failed very quickly. Nike was surprised by how hard a bike shoe is used and stressed. After many iterations they gave up and contracted with one of the old line Italian cobblers. Those were limited availability and very high price. When they resumed making their own they had solved some problems but of course the shoes were not as good as the real thing.
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Old 07-25-20, 08:02 AM
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I'll look when I get home. They very well could be italian. They're about 1986. They have a coupe molded loops for the optional Velcro that would effectively hold the sole to the upper.

I'll take them to a local cobbler, but I don't know if they can do it. Like I said, the climbing shoe resole guy wouldn't do it. All he does is bond old sweaty shoes to new rubber, I trust he knows what he's doing.
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Old 07-25-20, 08:31 AM
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I dont know if Id compare bike shoes to climbing shoes. A lot more on the line there. Maybe slide down the cobbler technical scale a bit.
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Old 07-25-20, 08:39 AM
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Originally Posted by natterberry View Post
I dont know if Id compare bike shoes to climbing shoes. A lot more on the line there. Maybe slide down the cobbler technical scale a bit.
The difference is that a climbing shoe almost exclusively pushes down. The big deal is delamination at the edges.

A cycling shoe pulls on the upstroke and twists to release if used with clipless. These are currently set up with slotted cleats for DA 7400 pedals, so the forces would go through the strap, to the top of my foot.

These shoes along with everything I got in the Spectrum box, are very nice and in almost unused condition, so I would like to fix them.
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