Are there really any classic and or vintage rules?
07-29-20, 03:24 PM
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Are there really any classic and or vintage rules?
As the title states, are there really any rules for what we consider a classic or vintage bike? The reason I’m asking is I’m putting together a project bike. It is a 1999 Waterford. It was the last year for a full Reynolds 531 frame and fork for Waterford. That and the fact is a lugged frame wit a 1” fork. If you didn’t know most folks would say it’s a typical 80’s era bike. The only non vintage thing is no down tube bosses. But that’s isn’t a problem if you use barcon shifters.
Any opinions or suggestions for a proper group.
Any opinions or suggestions for a proper group.
07-29-20, 03:51 PM
#2
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 2,336
Mentioned: 35 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 767 Post(s)
Liked 1,890 Times
in
888 Posts
No rules. Build to suit and ride like the dickens.
For the era of manufacture, maybe 9-speed Ultegra or DA? Nice looking stuff, silver, five arm cranks, can go double or triple, and DA 7700 downtube shifters are quite nice.
For the era of manufacture, maybe 9-speed Ultegra or DA? Nice looking stuff, silver, five arm cranks, can go double or triple, and DA 7700 downtube shifters are quite nice.
Likes For BFisher:
07-29-20, 03:53 PM
#3
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,438
Bikes: my precious steel boys
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 438 Post(s)
Liked 603 Times
in
359 Posts
for 1999, I honestly like Record RD-00 a lot. The first one with carbon in it, and arguably marking their rise from the doldrums of the 90s. I think that's right when Ergopower levers got good too.
Likes For sheddle:
07-29-20, 04:02 PM
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Dayton, Ohio
Posts: 1,398
Bikes: Trek 720, Trek 620, Trek 520, Steel Schwinns, AD Puch, Kona, Nishiki Pro, All City Disc Spacehorse, Waterford
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 151 Post(s)
Liked 101 Times
in
52 Posts
Rule #1
Don't tell your wife or significant other how many or what it cost!!😄😄😄😄😄
Likes For jjames1452:
07-29-20, 04:13 PM
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 1,950
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 803 Post(s)
Liked 1,000 Times
in
482 Posts
Likes For polymorphself:
07-29-20, 04:24 PM
#6
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 16,931
Mentioned: 469 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3689 Post(s)
Liked 6,113 Times
in
2,442 Posts
Likes For nlerner:
07-29-20, 04:24 PM
#7
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: PDX
Posts: 13,513
Bikes: Merz x 5 + Specialized Merz Allez x 2, Strawberry/Newlands/DiNucci/Ti x3, Gordon, Fuso/Moulton x2, Bornstein, Paisley,1958-74 Paramounts x3, 3rensho, 74 Moto TC, 73-78 Raleigh Pro's x5, Marinoni x2, 1960 Cinelli SC, 1980 Bianchi SC, PX-10 X 2
Mentioned: 260 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4311 Post(s)
Liked 5,763 Times
in
3,357 Posts
As the title states, are there really any rules for what we consider a classic or vintage bike? The reason I’m asking is I’m putting together a project bike. It is a 1999 Waterford. It was the last year for a full Reynolds 531 frame and fork for Waterford. That and the fact is a lugged frame wit a 1” fork. If you didn’t know most folks would say it’s a typical 80’s era bike. The only non vintage thing is no down tube bosses. But that’s isn’t a problem if you use barcon shifters.
Any opinions or suggestions for a proper group.
Any opinions or suggestions for a proper group.
Short answer, no especially for this which is great.
All the things you mention put it squarely in the realm, checks all boxes for C+V regardless of when it was built.
I love it when this happens, so cool to keep the flame burning, retro, classic, vintage, tribute, et all, the foundation is rock solid.
As we all know, Waterford's Schwinn roots go back as far as most so its all good.
Make it so.
Here's one I just built with exactly all this in mind and modern group to boot.
The old and the new, the ying and the yang, the good, bad and the ugly, you decide.
Last edited by merziac; 07-29-20 at 04:30 PM.
Likes For merziac:
07-29-20, 04:26 PM
#8
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Upper Left, USA
Posts: 1,953
Mentioned: 50 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 634 Post(s)
Liked 444 Times
in
298 Posts
Here you go!
What does Classic & Vintage mean??
Define "Classic & Vintage"
What is a classic or vintage bike
What constitutes classic, or vintage?
What constitutes a Classic or Vintage (How old ???)
Define "Classic" and "Vintage" For Me
So what's the difference? Classic vs Vintage
Classic or Vintage?
What does Classic & Vintage mean??
Define "Classic & Vintage"
What is a classic or vintage bike
What constitutes classic, or vintage?
What constitutes a Classic or Vintage (How old ???)
Define "Classic" and "Vintage" For Me
So what's the difference? Classic vs Vintage
Classic or Vintage?
Likes For tricky:
07-29-20, 04:28 PM
#9
Death fork? Naaaah!!
"they're more like guidelines......"
Top
Top
__________________
You know it's going to be a good day when the stem and seatpost come right out.
(looking for a picture and not seeing it? Thank the Photobucket fiasco.PM me and I'll link it up.)
You know it's going to be a good day when the stem and seatpost come right out.
(looking for a picture and not seeing it? Thank the Photobucket fiasco.PM me and I'll link it up.)
Likes For top506:
07-29-20, 05:42 PM
#10
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: NW Burbs, Chicago
Posts: 11,996
Mentioned: 196 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2919 Post(s)
Liked 3,331 Times
in
1,294 Posts
1. Make your own rules.
2. Then break them.
2. Then break them.
Likes For iab:
07-29-20, 06:55 PM
#11
Senior Member
Rules? We don't need no stinkin rules...............
Seriously. The only rule about classic and vintage bikes is to get one for as little $ as possible. Put a ton of $ into it in order for it to be "perfect". Then, sell it for 1/2 what you have in it and, start all over again.
Seriously. The only rule about classic and vintage bikes is to get one for as little $ as possible. Put a ton of $ into it in order for it to be "perfect". Then, sell it for 1/2 what you have in it and, start all over again.
Likes For ramzilla:
07-29-20, 07:03 PM
#12
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: PDX
Posts: 13,513
Bikes: Merz x 5 + Specialized Merz Allez x 2, Strawberry/Newlands/DiNucci/Ti x3, Gordon, Fuso/Moulton x2, Bornstein, Paisley,1958-74 Paramounts x3, 3rensho, 74 Moto TC, 73-78 Raleigh Pro's x5, Marinoni x2, 1960 Cinelli SC, 1980 Bianchi SC, PX-10 X 2
Mentioned: 260 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4311 Post(s)
Liked 5,763 Times
in
3,357 Posts
Rules? We don't need no stinkin rules...............
Seriously. The only rule about classic and vintage bikes is to get one for as little $ as possible. Put a ton of $ into it in order for it to be "perfect". Then, sell it for 1/2 what you have in it and, start all over again.
Seriously. The only rule about classic and vintage bikes is to get one for as little $ as possible. Put a ton of $ into it in order for it to be "perfect". Then, sell it for 1/2 what you have in it and, start all over again.
Likes For merziac:
07-29-20, 07:07 PM
#13
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 4,525
Bikes: 82 Medici, 2011 Richard Sachs, 2011 Milwaukee Road
Mentioned: 52 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1863 Post(s)
Liked 1,791 Times
in
1,013 Posts
Your frame. Barcons are classic. That's good. Smallish compact cassette and if needed use small chain rings. Do not use a threadless stem adapter. Put non Aero brake levers on it and then 99% of folks will only see brake cables and bar end shifters and think it is truly C&V.
__________________
I don't do: disks, tubeless, e-shifting, or bead head nymphs.
I don't do: disks, tubeless, e-shifting, or bead head nymphs.
Likes For Classtime:
07-29-20, 07:10 PM
#14
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City of Angels
Posts: 5,117
Bikes: A few too many
Mentioned: 42 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1344 Post(s)
Liked 2,106 Times
in
1,152 Posts
07-29-20, 07:12 PM
#15
Senior Member
Only rule in C+V Club is nobody talks about C+V Club.
__________________
N = '96 Colnago C40, '04 Wilier Alpe D'Huez, '10 Colnago EPS, '85 Merckx Pro, '89 Merckx Century, '86 Tommasini Professional, '04 Teschner Aero FX Pro, '05 Alan Carbon Cross, '86 De Rosa Professional, '82 Colnago Super, '95 Gios Compact Pro, '95 Carrera Zeus, '84 Basso Gap, ‘89 Cinelli Supercorsa, ‘83 Bianchi Specialissima, ‘VO Randonneur, Ritchey Breakaway Steel, '84 Paletti Super Prestige, Heron Randonneur
N = '96 Colnago C40, '04 Wilier Alpe D'Huez, '10 Colnago EPS, '85 Merckx Pro, '89 Merckx Century, '86 Tommasini Professional, '04 Teschner Aero FX Pro, '05 Alan Carbon Cross, '86 De Rosa Professional, '82 Colnago Super, '95 Gios Compact Pro, '95 Carrera Zeus, '84 Basso Gap, ‘89 Cinelli Supercorsa, ‘83 Bianchi Specialissima, ‘VO Randonneur, Ritchey Breakaway Steel, '84 Paletti Super Prestige, Heron Randonneur
Likes For Spaghetti Legs:
07-29-20, 07:20 PM
#16
Phyllo-buster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 8,791
Bikes: roadsters, club bikes, fixed and classic
Mentioned: 131 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2274 Post(s)
Liked 1,980 Times
in
1,222 Posts
It's a classic Keeper of the Flame. Put what you want on it. Or what shows up... I know 9 speed ruled the market then but 8 speed Ergo was sublime.
Likes For clubman:
07-29-20, 07:22 PM
#17
Señor Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Hardy, VA
Posts: 17,872
Bikes: Mostly English - predominantly Raleighs
Mentioned: 69 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1468 Post(s)
Liked 1,006 Times
in
602 Posts
Don't stick pitchforks in other folks' babies.
It's ok to say you don't care for it, or suggest what you'd do different, or even suggest tactfully that they'd get more love in a different Forum, but don't say that their Viscount is a worthless piece of junk and that nobody with any sense would ever buy one. (just to pick a random example of what not to do)
The exception is Biopace. I still don't get that. 
p.s. Welcome to C&V
It's ok to say you don't care for it, or suggest what you'd do different, or even suggest tactfully that they'd get more love in a different Forum, but don't say that their Viscount is a worthless piece of junk and that nobody with any sense would ever buy one. (just to pick a random example of what not to do)
The exception is Biopace. I still don't get that.
p.s. Welcome to C&V
__________________
In search of what to search for.
In search of what to search for.
07-29-20, 07:27 PM
#18
Banned.
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 27,297
Mentioned: 34 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 378 Post(s)
Liked 1,407 Times
in
908 Posts
Ride what you want.
Want what you ride.
Stick to this rule, and be satisfied.
Like what you build.
Build what you like.
Just remember, it’s only a bike.
Oldish cool frames
Newish cool parts
Make going fast easy, for crotchety old farts.
You may ask now
But soon you will know..
It really don’t matter, as long as they go.
Want what you ride.
Stick to this rule, and be satisfied.
Like what you build.
Build what you like.
Just remember, it’s only a bike.
Oldish cool frames
Newish cool parts
Make going fast easy, for crotchety old farts.
You may ask now
But soon you will know..
It really don’t matter, as long as they go.
Likes For RobbieTunes:
Likes For RobbieTunes:
Likes For P!N20:
07-29-20, 07:43 PM
#21
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 23,233
Mentioned: 649 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4717 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3,020 Times
in
1,864 Posts
I can only think of one rule. When you post the photo of the completed project, make it's taken from the drive side. It's a little know fact that Team Cinzano's annoyance with Dave Stoller was actually due to his showing them the non-drive of his Masi.
Likes For T-Mar:
07-29-20, 07:43 PM
#22
Señor Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Hardy, VA
Posts: 17,872
Bikes: Mostly English - predominantly Raleighs
Mentioned: 69 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1468 Post(s)
Liked 1,006 Times
in
602 Posts
Some stuff I've gotten away with here:
a re-painted, re-imagined 1971 Raleigh Super Course 81 speed
"Gugified" 1972 Raleigh Competition that has become a 650B cantilever rando rig with 2 x 9 bar con gearing
1977 Raleigh Team Professional "Crayola" - repainted (my repaints all have had indisputably trashed paint) in 120 degree off color scheme, with the 753 frame inexplicably spread to accept a 2 x 9 brifter set-up.
199? Giant Iguana repainted and converted to drop bar rig with 2 x 10 gearing. It can go almost anywhere an old body can point it.
2000 Bob Jackson Arrowhead - as purchased circa 2010. It's the baby of the fleet has 2 x 9 brifters with full Campagnolo Daytona, and even a radially laced front wheel
I'm not even certain if the rims are alloy (but I suspect they are).
*important note - picture was taken midway through a ride where a saddle bolt got lost, and the position wouldn't hold. NOT the normal angle.
The folks here are the greatest group of people I've encountered - which is saying something, because my work colleagues are pretty danged awesome too. There's an occasional instance where someone may have had a bad day chased by one or two too many, but people are uniformly helpful and generous with their knowledge and advice.
a re-painted, re-imagined 1971 Raleigh Super Course 81 speed
"Gugified" 1972 Raleigh Competition that has become a 650B cantilever rando rig with 2 x 9 bar con gearing
1977 Raleigh Team Professional "Crayola" - repainted (my repaints all have had indisputably trashed paint) in 120 degree off color scheme, with the 753 frame inexplicably spread to accept a 2 x 9 brifter set-up.
199? Giant Iguana repainted and converted to drop bar rig with 2 x 10 gearing. It can go almost anywhere an old body can point it.
2000 Bob Jackson Arrowhead - as purchased circa 2010. It's the baby of the fleet has 2 x 9 brifters with full Campagnolo Daytona, and even a radially laced front wheel
I'm not even certain if the rims are alloy (but I suspect they are). *important note - picture was taken midway through a ride where a saddle bolt got lost, and the position wouldn't hold. NOT the normal angle.
The folks here are the greatest group of people I've encountered - which is saying something, because my work colleagues are pretty danged awesome too. There's an occasional instance where someone may have had a bad day chased by one or two too many, but people are uniformly helpful and generous with their knowledge and advice.
__________________
In search of what to search for.
In search of what to search for.
Last edited by USAZorro; 07-29-20 at 07:48 PM.
07-29-20, 08:16 PM
#23
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Dayton, Ohio
Posts: 1,398
Bikes: Trek 720, Trek 620, Trek 520, Steel Schwinns, AD Puch, Kona, Nishiki Pro, All City Disc Spacehorse, Waterford
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 151 Post(s)
Liked 101 Times
in
52 Posts
Kona Kapu
Kona Kapu
853 Steel
Cool lugs
9 speed Ultegra
and a Bio Pace crank
New and old blend.
Likes For jjames1452:
07-29-20, 09:22 PM
#24
Senior Member
Likes For joejack951:
07-29-20, 09:25 PM
#25
Master Parts Rearranger
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Portlandia's Kuiper Belt, OR
Posts: 4,572
Bikes: 1982 Trek 720 - 1985 Trek 620 - Other luminaries past and present
Mentioned: 216 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1511 Post(s)
Liked 1,840 Times
in
924 Posts
7,000+ posts and no intro picture on a Waterford? Bro! Why you holdin' out on us??? 
More seriously, 7700 or 7800 era Dura-Ace and some pretty wheels and call it a day. Classic good looks and modern convenience meets a frameset of the same thinking.
More seriously, 7700 or 7800 era Dura-Ace and some pretty wheels and call it a day. Classic good looks and modern convenience meets a frameset of the same thinking.
Likes For RiddleOfSteel:
