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Vintage or modern for serious touring?

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Vintage or modern for serious touring?

Old 10-13-20, 08:38 AM
  #51  
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Originally Posted by Duo View Post
wow, didn't know you can get 10 speed to work with DT shifting...next trick is to get the thing to do Index Shifting, but probably not?

eventually my brifters are gonna head south on my more 'modern bikes', so am interested either in bar ends or DT. perhaps some light at the end of this mechanical tunnel. hmmm.
Just search for Dura Ace 7800 downtube shifters...

They make 11 speed 7900 DT shifters as well...
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Old 10-13-20, 09:19 AM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by Duo View Post
i use old and new, but knowing the complexity of brifters internally doesn't give overwhelming confidence. in the end, it is to go in with the 'army you have'. when i buy a used bike, generally it stays with whatever the manufacturer happened to throw on the bike. currently my preference is for DT over brifters for reliability, but i doubt any newer used bikes or riders would have them or know what they were.

my wish for bike manufacturers would be to get away from electronics and complexity and back to simple bicycles for Every Man. bicycling for me is not about mechanics even though i can overhaul most of my bikes...it really is about bicycling. LOL.
While STI shifters are complex internally, they just arent delicate. People have em for decades. But sure, they are more complex than down tube or bar end shifters, so if you want to reduce the fear of something breaking no matter how small the odds, its a good idea to use bar end or down tube shifters.

As for wishing that brands would get away from electronics and complexity, at this point you have to actively look away from all the brands and bike options that are fully mechanical and are not complex.
There are tons of brands with bikes that I could buy off the shelf and work on without any more knowledge than whats needed to service a late 80s road bike. I guess there are front derailleurs that need a youtube video to know how to set up. So 4 min of watching someone else do it and you can do it too. Tons of bikes still just bolt together like they always have.
We now have bikes that you long for AND bikes that others long for. Its the best of both worlds for those who can see the landscape and dont only focus on whats different from what they like.
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Old 10-13-20, 09:52 AM
  #53  
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I don't think it makes a huge difference as far as frames go. But the moving parts on modern bikes have loads of advantages. Indexed shifting, disc (or V) brakes, freehubs... all are better on paper, but on the road make no difference... until they do. Kind of like the idea that an old steel frame is superior to a new aluminum one because the steel can be repaired more easily, but ignoring the fact that an old steel frame is much more likely to need repair. The exact same argument can be made about cable-actuated vs hydraulic discs. I wouldn't want to have to bleed a disc brake at a camp site, but the likelihood of that being required is very very slim. I have had to replace many cables in less than ideal conditions, though.

If one already has an older bike and wants to set it up for touring, there is no reason that this can't be done successfully, but if one is buying a new bike, doing so with the intent of upgrading after purchase makes less sense than just buying a modern bike. The more demanding the tour being planned, the bigger the advantages of a modern bike.
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Old 10-13-20, 10:13 AM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by John E View Post
Why do you say that? Barcons are super-reliable and trivial to repair on the road.
They're also in a place where my hands spend virtually no time so I can't think of one reason why I would want to constantly move my hands there just to use a shifter that isn't where my hands usually are.

Originally Posted by Duo View Post
barcons and DT shifters are stupid reliable and simple. my brifters are slick but would hate to deal with repair issues; been using DT this summer...sometimes they feel like an upgrade over brifters.
What repair issues, has this been an ongoing problem for you? I've been using brifters for the last 25 years and have never had a shifter fail.

Originally Posted by sloar View Post
My goal is across the country self supported. Mostly camping but a hotel every now and then is nice. I’d like to stick with roads. In 1998 I bought a new Trek 520 and rode from Indiana to Florida, horrible planning made it very unpleasant. This time around I’m taking my time and make sure I’m 100% squared away.
Don't still have it?
From my own touring I really like my modern bike, I've owned vintage bikes (weren't at the time) and would love to have a nice vintage DeRosa or Colnago for cruising the bike path or boardwalk but can't otherwise figure out the desire people have to jump on these antiques to have in place of a newer bike for modern heavy use.
If money were an issue I'd settle for a early 2000s trek 520 or equivalent and wouldn't see a problem with it but if I had the spending for new I'd totally go with cable disc brakes, modern heavy duty wheels and brifters All are at this point are time proven and reliable with advantages over older equipment; going down a big hill in the rain with a loaded bike I'd much rather have disc brakes, same with muddy seasonal highways which will have much more immediate stopping.

For my own touring bikes I went with XT hubs and 29er mtb rims. My wife wanted prettier and I've got Purple velocity Ailerons on the way, purple White Industry hubs and will build 3x 32h with single butted spokes which will be wheels that should be long term reliable. Wanted Kings but they stopped making violet and classic hubs though I'm still looking for a set as I'd prefer them and won't be building till Dec. Strong hubs, rims, and spokes to me make all the difference if you want a really reliable touring bike.

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Old 10-13-20, 10:42 AM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by sloar View Post
My goal is across the country self supported. Mostly camping but a hotel every now and then is nice. Iíd like to stick with roads. In 1998 I bought a new Trek 520 and rode from Indiana to Florida, horrible planning made it very unpleasant. This time around Iím taking my time and make sure Iím 100% squared away.
That's great Sloar, Your LHT should serve you well. It sounds like you're off to a good start.
Unless there is some glaring aspect you are missing from your current bike take the focus off of that and work on keeping inspired, developing your route plan, and hopefully finding a compatible ride partner or two.
You probably already have spent some time on the Adventure cycling website. Their maps are excellent.
Crazyguyonabike is a great place to get inspired and learn from others experiences.

Like nlerner said, your idea of how to ride it sounds similar to how I did it last year. Here is a link to my TRANSAM Field Notes in case you hadn't read it before.

Think about getting a GPS device (Garmin or similar..) that you can upload maps into. I wish I had done that when I was going through the Appalatians. Navigation became much easier as I travelled west from there.

Use your shorter overnight trips/tours to refine your set up and try to pare down what you need to bring with you. I am still working on that myself.

Good luck, I look forward to reading about your future adventures.

Matt
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Old 10-13-20, 11:12 AM
  #56  
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[QUOTE=northbend;21741420]That's great Sloar, Your LHT should serve you well. It sounds like you're off to a good start.
Unless there is some glaring aspect you are missing from your current bike take the focus off of that and work on keeping inspired, developing your route plan, and hopefully finding a compatible ride partner or two.
Thanks, I've got almost all the proper gear covered, I need to update my old panniers. When I took my first trip I did all the planning using road maps. I ended up making some horrible choices and it was a very unpleasant trip. Right now that's my main concern, I'm very happy with the Surly and it fits like a glove. I get bored easy and want to change thing up to often, I prefer vintage bikes and figured a vintage touring bike would suit me better. I need to just think of the Surly as a tool and use it for what it was intended for.
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Old 10-13-20, 11:19 AM
  #57  
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That LHT looks like it's almost ready to go. As a theoretical we can discuss vintage vs modern all day long, but as a practical matter I'll be another vote for hopping on the LHT and heading down the road...

On the theoretical matter of vintage vs modern: IMO this notion that vintage components are unreliable just isn't true. Some were, sure, but it could be argued that many vintage parts were more reliable than modern. No cell phones to rely on BITD. A typical quality touring bike build would have been equipped something like this: Sugino Mighty Tour crankset, Phil Wood BB and hubs, Super champion rims (36H front, 40H rear), Suntour derailleurs (VGT. BL or Cyclone), power shifters, Suntour Freewheel, Sedis chain, Mafac canti or Weinmann CP brakes, handlebar and stem by Nitto/SR/Cinelli/etc. What would anyone expect to go wrong vs a modern bike? There's much talk of modern alloys, but no specifics. I'm not aware of any major advances in aluminum alloys recently. I'd venture that most high end parts are still made from 6061 as most have been for decades.

Tires have gotten way better, for sure. Modern tubular steel racks also a good idea. (though custom builders have been making these forever)
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Old 10-13-20, 11:44 AM
  #58  
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...

@sloar, I just noticed your blue Surly. This may not be a "touring" bike, but I thought you would appreciate it...

...

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Old 10-13-20, 12:36 PM
  #59  
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Originally Posted by Russ Roth View Post
From my own touring I really like my modern bike, I've owned vintage bikes (weren't at the time) and would love to have a nice vintage DeRosa or Colnago for cruising the bike path or boardwalk but can't otherwise figure out the desire people have to jump on these antiques to have in place of a newer bike for modern heavy use.
You might want to take note of what forum you're posting in.

Pretty much everyone here 'jumps on their antiques for modern heavy use.'
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Old 10-13-20, 12:57 PM
  #60  
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Originally Posted by branko_76 View Post
...

@sloar, I just noticed your blue Surly. This may not be a "touring" bike, but I thought you would appreciate it...

...



Very nice!
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Old 10-13-20, 01:15 PM
  #61  
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I really haven't done any "touring"other than day trips. My goal is to ride the Oregon Coast in the next couple of years.Now that my social security starts in two weeks (FRA) I will have more flexibility in my schedule to allow for such a trip. I will probably take the Super Mondia with a slight modification to the gears and add some fenders and bags. The Mondia allows for nice wide tires and is a very comfy bike but still fairly light. I would start on the Washington end and do the coastal route to Brookings. My wife can sag for me and do meet ups at stopping time. I met a couple that did it and only got rained on once, lucky them! They raved about the trip and I saw some pictures, it truly looks spectacular. Joe
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Old 10-13-20, 01:20 PM
  #62  
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Originally Posted by branko_76 View Post
...

@sloar, I just noticed your blue Surly. This may not be a "touring" bike, but I thought you would appreciate it...

...

So this begs the bigger question... Do Marines not have extra duty chumps to do "area beautification" stuff like paint rocks, cut grass and paint rusty fences?
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Old 10-13-20, 02:09 PM
  #63  
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Originally Posted by The Golden Boy View Post
So this begs the bigger question... Do Marines not have extra duty chumps to do "area beautification" stuff like paint rocks, cut grass and paint rusty fences?
I remember being assigned to a "working party" more than once, picked up lots of cigarette butts, painted conex boxes but no, never painted any rocks...
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Old 10-13-20, 02:34 PM
  #64  
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Originally Posted by branko_76 View Post
...

@sloar, I just noticed your blue Surly. This may not be a "touring" bike, but I thought you would appreciate it...

...

Wow, that's a blast from the past. That bike is my very first 10-speed I ever bought. I got it new in 1968 using savings from my paper route job. Same color, same components (except the pedals), etc.
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Old 10-13-20, 07:09 PM
  #65  
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Originally Posted by branko_76 View Post
I remember being assigned to a "working party" more than once, picked up lots of cigarette butts, painted conex boxes but no, never painted any rocks...


No duds painting rocks?
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Old 10-13-20, 08:09 PM
  #66  
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Originally Posted by The Golden Boy View Post


No duds painting rocks?
Ive been on plenty working partyís. The Gunny was always walking around looking for bodies to work, everyone trying to hide. Iíve painted rocks, raked sand and a bunch of other unnecessary crap.
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Old 10-13-20, 09:34 PM
  #67  
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Originally Posted by The Golden Boy View Post
You might want to take note of what forum you're posting in.

Pretty much everyone here 'jumps on their antiques for modern heavy use.'
I saw where the question was posted, still doesn't make sense to me why people would jump on an antique to ride across the country with parts that while they have been long term reliable still have a finite life span that they may be approaching the edge of. I lived along the seaway trail and I can remember this one kid coming through a few years ago on his early 80s raleigh tourer; saw him on the road as I was driving home and he was walking with his friends due to 3 busted spokes. Offered to help as I have a small collection of spokes but quickly realized I couldn't as I had nothing to fit a 27" wheel. Also had to explain that the nearest bike shop was 15mi back the way he came over nothing but hills and that if he kept going forward the nearest shop was 45mi away and 2 counties over and this was in Upstate NY. Did offer them a ride but they decided they were close to their camp ground and they were going to crash for the night. Don't know what he ended up doing but it was a lousy spot to be stuck with wheels that couldn't turn in a bike. And its not like bike shops keep a nice selection of 27" wheels lying around either. For a tour, newer is better imo but that's cause I want to preempt things. I've busted 3 square taper BBs, snapped and bent freewheel hubs and in both cases don't consider myself a powerful person but can't say I've had the same trouble from thru axle or cassettes; I know which I prefer to tour with.
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Old 10-13-20, 09:44 PM
  #68  
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Originally Posted by Russ Roth View Post
I saw where the question was posted, still doesn't make sense to me why people would jump on an antique to ride across the country with parts that while they have been long term reliable still have a finite life span that they may be approaching the edge of.
Well, I donít know that anybody here is condoning touring on parts that are near the edge of their life. That has nothing to do with the original question posed and if asked most here would say ďreplace what looks worn out with something in safe shape (whether new or vintage).Ē
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Old 10-13-20, 10:07 PM
  #69  
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Originally Posted by Russ Roth View Post
I saw where the question was posted, still doesn't make sense to me why people would jump on an antique to ride across the country with parts that while they have been long term reliable still have a finite life span that they may be approaching the edge of. I lived along the seaway trail and I can remember this one kid coming through a few years ago on his early 80s raleigh tourer; saw him on the road as I was driving home and he was walking with his friends due to 3 busted spokes. Offered to help as I have a small collection of spokes but quickly realized I couldn't as I had nothing to fit a 27" wheel. Also had to explain that the nearest bike shop was 15mi back the way he came over nothing but hills and that if he kept going forward the nearest shop was 45mi away and 2 counties over and this was in Upstate NY. Did offer them a ride but they decided they were close to their camp ground and they were going to crash for the night. Don't know what he ended up doing but it was a lousy spot to be stuck with wheels that couldn't turn in a bike. And its not like bike shops keep a nice selection of 27" wheels lying around either. For a tour, newer is better imo but that's cause I want to preempt things. I've busted 3 square taper BBs, snapped and bent freewheel hubs and in both cases don't consider myself a powerful person but can't say I've had the same trouble from thru axle or cassettes; I know which I prefer to tour with.
The red Grand Prix I posted above is now 45 years old and after a compete overhaul, it is still running strong. How many of these modern bikes will still be around 45 years from now?
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Old 10-13-20, 10:31 PM
  #70  
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Originally Posted by branko_76 View Post
The red Grand Prix I posted above is now 45 years old and after a compete overhaul, it is still running strong. How many of these modern bikes will still be around 45 years from now?
Any one of them that hasnít been crashed.
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Old 10-13-20, 10:43 PM
  #71  
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You can have a sporty touring bike that is fun to ride unloaded with an old frame or a new frame. My gunnar crosshairs is great as a road bike. Many modern 'gravel bikes' 'cx bikes' make great sport touring rides.
Also new v old, I reckon the best modern advance for touring is a dynamo hub & led light. Not Discs or STI. Rather not have em.



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Old 10-13-20, 10:46 PM
  #72  
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Originally Posted by Russ Roth View Post
still doesn't make sense to me why people would jump on an antique to ride across the country
I can remember this one kid coming through a few years ago on his early 80s raleigh tourer
It's called being a kid and not having much money and going on an adventure
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Old 10-13-20, 11:22 PM
  #73  
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Originally Posted by Soody View Post
It's called being a kid and not having much money and going on an adventure
That I can understand, its the reason my first tour was done with a backpack and a seatpost rack, next trip was a cheap rack and cheap panniers. But the OP sounds like he's had/has newer and money doesn't sound to be an issue so why not newer?
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Old 10-13-20, 11:41 PM
  #74  
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Originally Posted by Russ Roth View Post
That I can understand, its the reason my first tour was done with a backpack and a seatpost rack, next trip was a cheap rack and cheap panniers. But the OP sounds like he's had/has newer and money doesn't sound to be an issue so why not newer?
basically yeah, fair, but sometimes old stuff (and new stuff) is just really charming and you like it, often it's arbitrary, but life's too short for bicycles that aren't nice in that way. There's probably room for making things more difficult for yourself and sometimes it is actually practical.
touring on 27" wheels though, sure, probably a bad idea.
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Old 10-13-20, 11:42 PM
  #75  
gorillimo
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My previous touring bike was a Ď73 Paramount. Loved it, but I have to say my current Surly Cross Check is every bit as good, maybe better.And cost about a third of what another Parameter would cost me. No rust problems, except modern equipment. Iím good!
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