Santy/Gitane?
 

In the mid-1970's brothers Elain and Guy Santy rode for team Gitane.
I would like to know if it was Gitane who made the frames with the Santy name on them.
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https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...83d503872f.jpg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...03949b517b.jpg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...0d8b36d704.jpg

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in about 1970 MICMO was able to pull away from Urago the highly respected constructeur Brouquis (do not know spelling; have only heard name) for the creation of the true team cycles.

possible he may have been the maker. have no hard information.

yours is the sort of excellent question best posed to Norris. if you are on the CR list you could do it there as well...

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That certainly looks like a MICMO swagged and crimped seat stay finish as found on both Gitanes and Geminianis in first half of 1960s. This finish was found on bikes a tier or two down from top...your frame doesn't have the Nervex Pros seen here so yours is likely at least two or three tiers down from top. This seat stay finish doesn't appear to extend into 70s; however, replaced by the swagged finish that was just bent over and brazed shut (search for Chas' late 60s into early 70s Gitane seat stay cap posts). That all said, your Stronglight 93 suggests later 60s/70s.

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...aa461e3ecf.jpg

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wrt seat stay treatment -

this seat stay design was employed by a number of french makers and is not in any way a MICMO signature item

two well known makers who used it extensively were Bertin and Urago

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1989Pre -

the image you provided of the complete frame is too dimly lit for readers to be able to see much detail. you would likely get more meaningful response with a better photo...;)

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juvela, I'm going to respectively disagree. True that both Bertin and Urago used a swagged and crimped seat stay finish but their versions used a completely different crimp that resulted in a pinched ridge that runs down the center of the seat stay finish. Here are a couple of Uragos (navy blue and dark blue...two different frames) and a couple of Bertins (medium blue and orange) and you can see how the seat stay finish has this distinctive pinched ridge down center. On MICMOs a single crimp creates a valley in center of the swagged finish...that all said, in looking at the seat stay cap of the bike in question, what I was seeing as a "valley" may in fact be a "pinched ridge" … so maybe I don't disagree with you on this particular bike …. better pictures would help!!! and if that is a crimped ridge, I would not think this is a Gitane.
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...ae5370cf23.png
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...6c72589b5b.png



https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...298271f53e.png
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1f52f45cf1.png

Thanks, people. I'm asking for a friend, so I will ask him to send some better photos.

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Thanks so much for your patient & thorough response Markeologist!

Most excellent information. :thumb:

My error in not being more careful; make far too many... :o

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1989Pre -

thank you for the reply

in the initial post it is unclear to me if the frameset shown is thought to be one used by one of the Santy brothers in the course of their career or if it is an example of production bicycles done with the Santy name

MICMO certainly produced bicycles with names of past champions such as Roger Riviere and Raphael Geminiani, among others

asking about this as the Santy name is new for me

perhaps when you next communicate with your friend you could get some clarification

thank you again ;)

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Yes, I have contacted him, Juvela, and he will reply shortly with better pics and some more info.

juvela, I'm one of those French bike fanatics, especially the higher end bikes from the 1960s. Since so many of these bikes used the same tube sets and lugs, I have spent years to identify traits that I think distinguish the various brands...and the seat stay cap finish is one such area. Can't say I'm always correct in identifying the maker of a particular bike but I am pretty good at being able to say "no, that bike was NOT made by a particular maker." On a side note, I see we both claim to be from "Alta California" … nice to meet you.

Santy bicycle
 

Thank you all for comments and information! A specially to member 1989Pre for helping me in my quest. I’ll post some additional photographs later on this evening but have already some remarks on the construction dates I’ve seen mentioned. Without knowing the provenance of the bike neater if the current headset, stem and crank are the original equipment but the frame and fork has Reynolds 531sl decals (launched in 1975! According to the Reynolds brochure of 78) ... to my opinion original (even disintegrated as the paint) yet possible applied many decades ago ... so I’m leaving this in to your hands what it should or could be, all information is welcome. Thank you all in advance. Greetings Dirk

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Hello Dirk,

Thank you very much for your post. :)

Minor note on chainset FWIW -

the Verot-Perrin model 93 was produced 1967-1977

it was revised in 1972 to add more material around the pedal hole so pre-'72 might be termed G1 or "early type" and '72 onward examples G2 or "late type"

in this image the drive side arm is early type and non-drive side arm is late type:

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...d361ec84c8.jpg

in 1977 it received a reworking to create what became the model 105

​​​​​​mention only in case it may be a dating aid...

thank you again for posting ;)

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Santy photographs
 

Can’t post photographs before 10 posts, neither a URL to my Facebook page Dirk Van de Cruys (Belgium)

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...two workarounds for the ten post requirement are to

a) post images to your member's album on your member's page

b) post images to a third party host and post the URL here in munged form (with a decoder text if you think it might be needed)


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Santy photographs
 

I’ll do that but now it’s bedtime for me ... wackupcall at 05:00 so 4,5 h sleep to go ...

Santy 4
 

Ok going to ad 7 more posts to reach 10 naming the parts ... and then the pictures ...

Santa 5
 

Campa drop-outs