Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

Avoiding eBay when paying for eBay goods?

Notices
Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

Avoiding eBay when paying for eBay goods?

Old 02-19-21, 01:17 PM
  #1  
bikemig 
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
bikemig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Middle Earth (aka IA)
Posts: 18,146

Bikes: A bunch of old bikes and a few new ones

Mentioned: 156 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4977 Post(s)
Liked 1,462 Times in 969 Posts
Avoiding eBay when paying for eBay goods?

I bid on and won an item I needed from a seller in Europe. I've communicated with the seller and AFAIK the seller seems like a very decent person. But the seller does not have his account linked with eBay and is asking that I pay directly via paypal (and thereby avoiding eBay).

I just don't think that's a good idea, right? My guess is that this has to be contrary to eBay's rules. Plus why would I want to lose any protection I might have from eBay by circumventing their payment system.

Also the seller wants the payment via paypal to be friends and family to avoid the fees. I don't like that either since I have zero protection if the goods aren't as pictured or if any other problem crops up.

Avoiding eBay for payment has to be a really bad idea, right? And doing friends and family for an international transaction via paypal seems like a really, really bad idea.
bikemig is online now  
Old 02-19-21, 01:25 PM
  #2  
ridelikeaturtle
Senior Member
 
ridelikeaturtle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Posts: 1,126

Bikes: Bianchi Ti Megatube; Colnago Competition; Planet-X EC-130E; Klein Pulse; Amp Research B4; Litespeed Catalyst; Fondriest Squadra Corse; Trek Y11

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 522 Post(s)
Liked 322 Times in 193 Posts
I would never circumvent any rules to accomodate a seller. If you sell on eBay, you do everything through eBay and use Paypal; if you use Paypal, you pay fees.

If there's a dispute, everything needs to be documented and correct.

If the seller doesn't like it, that's fine, they will probably be OK with relisting their item and trying to try it on with someone else. If it means you don't get the product you want, that's fine.

I've sold many things on eBay, and have communicated with buyers in other countries and negotiated a price (lowering a "buy it now" so including a shipping amount arrives at the negotiated price, for example), but it always must be paid for and completed within the system - always always always.
ridelikeaturtle is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 01:25 PM
  #3  
r0ckh0und 
Senior Member
 
r0ckh0und's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Plano, IL.
Posts: 1,477
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 90 Post(s)
Liked 75 Times in 49 Posts
I would avoid that like the plague.
__________________
They say I'm lazy but it takes all my time.
r0ckh0und is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 01:32 PM
  #4  
Narhay
Senior Member
 
Narhay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Toronto, ON, Canada
Posts: 3,503
Mentioned: 100 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 853 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 349 Times in 217 Posts
Originally Posted by bikemig View Post
I bid on and won an item I needed from a seller in Europe. I've communicated with the seller and AFAIK the seller seems like a very decent person. But the seller does not have his account linked with eBay and is asking that I pay directly via paypal (and thereby avoiding eBay).

I just don't think that's a good idea, right? My guess is that this has to be contrary to eBay's rules. Plus why would I want to lose any protection I might have from eBay by circumventing their payment system.

Also the seller wants the payment via paypal to be friends and family to avoid the fees. I don't like that either since I have zero protection if the goods aren't as pictured or if any other problem crops up.

Avoiding eBay for payment has to be a really bad idea, right? And doing friends and family for an international transaction via paypal seems like a really, really bad idea.
Friends and family and outside Ebay = no recourse if it doesnt get shipped or it arrives damaged or not as described. Theres only negative for you. The seller may be trying to honestly save a few pennies but you take all the risk for no gain.
Narhay is online now  
Likes For Narhay:
Old 02-19-21, 01:32 PM
  #5  
Kilroy1988 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Visalia, CA
Posts: 1,525
Mentioned: 29 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 648 Post(s)
Liked 440 Times in 216 Posts
European eBay sites often have different policies about payment methods than the US site. It's always good to ask questions before you bid. eBay is in the midst of severing it's relationship with PayPal as well, so things may be changing even more rapidly on other eBay sites.

I would refuse to pay via the "gift" option on any goods. That's simply against PayPal policy. I do it here in Bikeforums with other members all the time, but I wouldn't for eBay merchandise.

-Gregory
Kilroy1988 is offline  
Likes For Kilroy1988:
Old 02-19-21, 01:33 PM
  #6  
Phil_gretz
Journeyman Bike Commuter
 
Phil_gretz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Alexandria, VA
Posts: 6,419

Bikes: '71 Jeunet 640, '79 Peugeot PXN10LE, '88 Fuji Saratoga, '13 Motobecane Fantom29 HT, '16 Motobecane Turino Pro Disc, '16 Motobecane Gran Premio Elite, '18 Velobuild VB-R-022

Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1214 Post(s)
Liked 1,020 Times in 555 Posts
eBay owns PayPal as a separate operating entity. The OP is kidding himself.

I would check out using the eBay process. It protects you. Although the credit card linked to your PayPal account also protects you. Belt and suspenders?
Phil_gretz is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 01:33 PM
  #7  
noobinsf 
Senior Member
 
noobinsf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Oakland, CA
Posts: 2,362

Bikes: CURRENT: '82 Univega Competizione, '72 Motobecane Grand Record, '74 Campania Professional, '83 Mercian KOM Touring, '91 Univega Alpina Comp PAST: '72 Puch Bergmeister, '72ish Peugeot UO-8, '86 Univega Gran Premio, '85 Univega Viva Touring

Mentioned: 47 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 741 Post(s)
Liked 503 Times in 337 Posts
Does the seller have a lot of listings and positive feedback? I think ebay monitors communication for this sort of activity, and if the seller isn’t careful, he may find himself without an account before long. I would refuse any attempts to get you to do business outside of ebay. No way.
noobinsf is online now  
Likes For noobinsf:
Old 02-19-21, 01:39 PM
  #8  
bikemig 
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
bikemig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Middle Earth (aka IA)
Posts: 18,146

Bikes: A bunch of old bikes and a few new ones

Mentioned: 156 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4977 Post(s)
Liked 1,462 Times in 969 Posts
Originally Posted by Phil_gretz View Post
eBay owns PayPal as a separate operating entity. The OP is kidding himself.

I would check out using the eBay process. It protects you. Although the credit card linked to your PayPal account also protects you. Belt and suspenders?
Agreed about using the eBay process. I'm the OP and I hope I'm not kidding myself,

But yes the seller's request strikes me as odd. I understand his motivations but you pay to use the eBay system as it provides protection for sellers and buyers.
bikemig is online now  
Old 02-19-21, 01:40 PM
  #9  
Kilroy1988 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Visalia, CA
Posts: 1,525
Mentioned: 29 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 648 Post(s)
Liked 440 Times in 216 Posts
Originally Posted by Phil_gretz View Post
eBay owns PayPal as a separate operating entity....
Actually the companies split in 2015 and maintained a five year operating contract that has now expired. eBay is currently transitioning away from PayPal in favor of the same company that provides VenMo with it's direct deposit transactions.

-Gregory
Kilroy1988 is offline  
Likes For Kilroy1988:
Old 02-19-21, 02:34 PM
  #10  
Dylansbob 
2k miles from the midwest
 
Dylansbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Washington
Posts: 1,100

Bikes: Cinelli Hobootleg, Falcon San Remo, Benotto 2000 are the top 3 now

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 181 Post(s)
Liked 252 Times in 125 Posts
Side venting

I just got my first negative in 20yrs. Listed some Ringle bottle cages and had high bidder in Germany. I told him I wasn't shipping internationally right now and the auction stated that. Got mad and tried to get me to send it to a domestic address not attached to his account. I refused and he gave me a negative. I turned it over to ebay, but I doubt it'll get dropped.
Dylansbob is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 02:36 PM
  #11  
icemilkcoffee
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 508
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 295 Post(s)
Liked 204 Times in 133 Posts
As far as I know it is not a violation of Ebay policy to request a different payment method other than commercial Paypal. If the seller has good feedback I would not worry about it.
When I sold on Ebay some years ago, I used to request buyers make a direct cash deposit to my BofA bank account. That way nobody has to pay any extra fee.
icemilkcoffee is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 02:53 PM
  #12  
Ex Pres 
Cat 6
 
Ex Pres's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Mountain Brook, AL
Posts: 7,359
Mentioned: 24 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 445 Post(s)
Liked 92 Times in 64 Posts
Originally Posted by Dylansbob View Post
...................... I told him I wasn't shipping internationally right now and the auction stated that...............
Side Reply: I haven't sold on ebay in years, but you used to be able to not just state, but block foreign bidders (and zero feedback bidders, specific bidders, etc). Is that still the case?
Ex Pres is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 02:57 PM
  #13  
billridesbikes
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 169 Post(s)
Liked 248 Times in 151 Posts
In the early days of the Web when EBay was just getting started you would bid on an item and then contact the seller and promise to mail them a check and they would promise to mail you the item, sometimes even before cashing the check. Worked out pretty well until the scammers showed up in force.
billridesbikes is offline  
Likes For billridesbikes:
Old 02-19-21, 03:02 PM
  #14  
r0ckh0und 
Senior Member
 
r0ckh0und's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Plano, IL.
Posts: 1,477
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 90 Post(s)
Liked 75 Times in 49 Posts
Originally Posted by Dylansbob View Post
Side venting

I just got my first negative in 20yrs. Listed some Ringle bottle cages and had high bidder in Germany. I told him I wasn't shipping internationally right now and the auction stated that. Got mad and tried to get me to send it to a domestic address not attached to his account. I refused and he gave me a negative. I turned it over to ebay, but I doubt it'll get dropped.

I had a similar experience with a buyer from Saudi Arabia. They hit the BIN button, chose local pick up and paid. He insisted that I ship at my expense and when I cancelled the order he gave me a negative. Ebay would not drop it.
__________________
They say I'm lazy but it takes all my time.
r0ckh0und is offline  
Likes For r0ckh0und:
Old 02-19-21, 03:33 PM
  #15  
The Golden Boy 
Extraordinary Magnitude
 
The Golden Boy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Waukesha WI
Posts: 12,593

Bikes: 1978 Trek TX700; 1978/79 Trek 736; 1984 Specialized Stumpjumper Sport; 1984 Schwinn Voyageur SP; 1985 Trek 620; 1985 Trek 720; 1986 Trek 400 Elance; 1987 Schwinn High Sierra; 1990 Miyata 1000LT

Mentioned: 76 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2172 Post(s)
Liked 624 Times in 388 Posts
Originally Posted by r0ckh0und View Post
I had a similar experience with a buyer from Saudi Arabia. They hit the BIN button, chose local pick up and paid. He insisted that I ship at my expense and when I cancelled the order he gave me a negative. Ebay would not drop it.
That just goes to show there's dicks all around the world.

Originally Posted by billridesbikes View Post
In the early days of the Web when EBay was just getting started you would bid on an item and then contact the seller and promise to mail them a check and they would promise to mail you the item, sometimes even before cashing the check. Worked out pretty well until the scammers showed up in force.
Now you mention that- I remember paying by check...
__________________
*Recipient of the 2006 Time Magazine "Person Of The Year" Award*

Commence to jigglin’ huh?!?!

"But hey, always love to hear from opinionated amateurs." -says some guy to Mr. Marshall.
The Golden Boy is offline  
Likes For The Golden Boy:
Old 02-19-21, 03:40 PM
  #16  
iab
Senior Member
 
iab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: NW Burbs, Chicago
Posts: 10,661
Mentioned: 146 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2138 Post(s)
Liked 1,239 Times in 577 Posts
I would simply state that I prefer to play by ebay's rules. And if the seller's intent is to save on fees, I would offer to have them cancel the sale. I would leave no feedback and walk away.

There will always be more crap to buy, it's not worth to be upset by it.
iab is offline  
Likes For iab:
Old 02-19-21, 03:46 PM
  #17  
bikemig 
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
bikemig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Middle Earth (aka IA)
Posts: 18,146

Bikes: A bunch of old bikes and a few new ones

Mentioned: 156 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4977 Post(s)
Liked 1,462 Times in 969 Posts
Originally Posted by iab View Post
I would simply state that I prefer to play by ebay's rules. And if the seller's intent is to save on fees, I would offer to have them cancel the sale. I would leave no feedback and walk away.

There will always be more crap to buy, it's not worth to be upset by it.
Heck I'm not upset. It was a complete Stronglight P3 headset which I could really use for a Mercier 300 I'm rebuilding but no big deal. The P3 has a stack height of 34 mm which is lower than any other French threaded headset I can get my hands on (Velo orange is 41; I have a Campy NR french threaded headset but the stack height is 41).

I can figure out a different way to get that bike rolling again.

I've offered to cancel the sale and I'm waiting to hear from the seller. I suspect the seller will let me out. If not, I'll have eBay deal with it.

I do think it's a little flaky for the seller to try to operate outside of the eBay payment system and to try to get me to buy the item paypal friends and family especially for an international sale.

Last edited by bikemig; 02-19-21 at 03:51 PM.
bikemig is online now  
Likes For bikemig:
Old 02-19-21, 03:55 PM
  #18  
Trevtassie
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Down Under
Posts: 1,883

Bikes: A steel framed 26" off road tourer from a manufacturer who thinks they are cool. Giant Anthem. Trek 720 Multiroad pub bike. 10 kids bikes all under 20". Assorted waifs and unfinished projects.

Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 731 Post(s)
Liked 599 Times in 320 Posts
Nope, just nope. Friends and Family is just a nice name for Western Union style transactions. No protection.
Trevtassie is offline  
Likes For Trevtassie:
Old 02-19-21, 03:55 PM
  #19  
iab
Senior Member
 
iab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: NW Burbs, Chicago
Posts: 10,661
Mentioned: 146 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2138 Post(s)
Liked 1,239 Times in 577 Posts
Originally Posted by bikemig View Post
I've offered to cancel the sale and I'm waiting to hear from the seller. I suspect the seller will let me out. If not, I'll have eBay deal with it.
The seller needs to abide the rules or you will let them out of it. At least that's how I see it.

If I had a long term buying experience with the seller, I'd do a private sale, which this amounts to. But I don't put out on the first date.
iab is offline  
Likes For iab:
Old 02-19-21, 04:02 PM
  #20  
Hit Factor
Senior Member
 
Hit Factor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: SW Michigan, U.S.A.
Posts: 57

Bikes: Trek Checkpoint SL 5 Disc, Trek Marlin 7.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked 30 Times in 19 Posts
Originally Posted by Dylansbob View Post
Side venting

I just got my first negative in 20yrs. Listed some Ringle bottle cages and had high bidder in Germany. I told him I wasn't shipping internationally right now and the auction stated that. Got mad and tried to get me to send it to a domestic address not attached to his account. I refused and he gave me a negative. I turned it over to ebay, but I doubt it'll get dropped.
It should get removed. The buyer asked you to work outside of the process. Hopefully you reported the buyer when the request was made. I have found that calling eBay and getting a rep on the line works in my favor almost every time.
Hit Factor is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 04:05 PM
  #21  
Hit Factor
Senior Member
 
Hit Factor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: SW Michigan, U.S.A.
Posts: 57

Bikes: Trek Checkpoint SL 5 Disc, Trek Marlin 7.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked 30 Times in 19 Posts
Originally Posted by Ex Pres View Post
Side Reply: I haven't sold on ebay in years, but you used to be able to not just state, but block foreign bidders (and zero feedback bidders, specific bidders, etc). Is that still the case?
More or less, that's still an option.
Hit Factor is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 04:07 PM
  #22  
bark_eater 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Eastern Shore, MD
Posts: 1,216

Bikes: Road ready: 1993 Koga Miyata City Liner Touring Hybrid, 1989 Centurion Sport DLX, "I Blame GP" Bridgestone CB-1. Projects: Yea, I got a problem....

Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 417 Post(s)
Liked 159 Times in 118 Posts
The biggest problems I've had on ebay is with sellers who don't understand the contractual relationship involved when buying and selling on ebay, or they understand, but are trying to gain further advantage. The original posters seller is trying to avoid fees and force an assumption of risk to the buyer. That's a bunch of red flags. I've dealt with a bad international seller who kept on trying create some sort of alternative reality-based negotiations right up until ebay refunded my money, which he had stalled for as long as possible. And then the steady stream of emails shifted to get me to change my feed back. As a buyer the biggest risk seems to be sellers trying to earn a living at selling junk, so they cut corners when shipping. Most of the negative feed back I leave is commentary on bad shipping practices and shipping damages. The other thing to look out for is sellers that may or may not ship an item, and will keep your money until you take action or make a claim. I lost 20 minutes of my life recently to get $10 back from a seller who sold me an item, sent me tracking info. When it never showed I checked their listing and the item was up for a greater price. I called fedex and was told that the item was loaded on the truck but called back. I contacted the seller and ebay. The seller sent a blank response. I received a refund after the item I had bought was sold again. This was a big high volume reseller that I had bought similar items from for the same price's, and I had dent realy checked the feedback. Apparently this is their new thing for x percentage of their orders. I don't know if it's a nefarious plot, but the total of funds there taken for 2 weeks over the course of a year could be substantial.

Last edited by bark_eater; 02-19-21 at 05:17 PM.
bark_eater is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 05:42 PM
  #23  
niliraga 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 435

Bikes: 1970s Coppi/Fiorelli beater, 1973 Raleigh Competition, 1972 Bob Jackson, 1970 Cilo Sprint-X, 1985 Fuji Touring Series IV, 1969 Legnano Roma

Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 158 Post(s)
Liked 143 Times in 91 Posts
almost tempting to counter seller's request by saying you'll happily pay via alternate means, but only *after* you've successfully received the goods at your end.

Seller will then incredulously ask why on earth he should send it, when he has no assurances that you will pay.

to which you can reply "right. see how that feels?"


Originally Posted by bikemig View Post
Heck I'm not upset. It was a complete Stronglight P3 headset which I could really use for a Mercier 300 I'm rebuilding but no big deal. The P3 has a stack height of 34 mm which is lower than any other French threaded headset I can get my hands on (Velo orange is 41; I have a Campy NR french threaded headset but the stack height is 41).

I can figure out a different way to get that bike rolling again.

I've offered to cancel the sale and I'm waiting to hear from the seller. I suspect the seller will let me out. If not, I'll have eBay deal with it.

I do think it's a little flaky for the seller to try to operate outside of the eBay payment system and to try to get me to buy the item paypal friends and family especially for an international sale.
niliraga is online now  
Likes For niliraga:
Old 02-19-21, 08:48 PM
  #24  
gugie 
Dilberteur at large
 
gugie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 9,065

Bikes: It's complicated.

Mentioned: 991 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3182 Post(s)
Liked 1,421 Times in 726 Posts
Paypal Friends and Family is for Friends and Family.

I consider regular posters on BF to be in that group - reputation here is worth more than a few bucks. Friends of friends are included as well.
__________________
If someone tells you that you have enough bicycles and you don't need any more, stop talking to them. You don't need that kind of negativity in your life.
gugie is offline  
Old 02-19-21, 10:49 PM
  #25  
mstateglfr 
Sunshine
 
mstateglfr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Des Moines, IA
Posts: 12,340

Bikes: '18 class built steel roadbike, '19 Fairlight Secan, '88 Schwinn Premis , Black Mountain Cycles Monstercross V4, '89 Novara Trionfo

Mentioned: 97 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5060 Post(s)
Liked 2,375 Times in 1,390 Posts
Originally Posted by Kilroy1988 View Post
Actually the companies split in 2015 and maintained a five year operating contract that has now expired. eBay is currently transitioning away from PayPal in favor of the same company that provides VenMo with it's direct deposit transactions.

-Gregory
PayPal owns venmo. So ebay is moving away from PayPal, the company they used to own, and moving to a company PayPal owns.
mstateglfr is offline  
Likes For mstateglfr:

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.