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Dawes bicycle help identifying

Old 05-22-21, 05:38 PM
  #1  
CTony
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Dawes bicycle help identifying

Good evening,I happen to find this Dawes bike at a local shop for 20$ itís need a lot of work but i saved it from becoming yard art.Anyway I canít seem to find out any information.Iíll upload some photos.Thank You for your time.

Never seen chainring like this.It has a four speed freewheel single Hurts shifter

And these

Found these #

Maybe oil or grease zircon?


Aftermarket?
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Old 05-22-21, 05:45 PM
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I don't know anything about it, but that chainring is the coolest thing. I would have picked it up for twenty bucks just for the chainring.
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Old 05-22-21, 05:52 PM
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the raised numerals on the cycle's bottom bracket shell are a stock number from the manufacturer of the shell - Brampton

cycle likely to exhibit Brampton lugs, crown, headset, ends, etc as well

headset appears to be of the floating u-race design. these sets employ 1/8" ball. when you are ready to disassemble and repack invert the cycle and keep a container below the top of the steerer to collect the many small bits which may come tumbling out.


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Last edited by juvela; 05-22-21 at 05:56 PM. Reason: addition
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Old 05-22-21, 06:34 PM
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Thank you guys.Juvela can you put a date on bike?
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Old 05-22-21, 06:50 PM
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Cool, Dawes Cool...

Not much on Dawes due to the fire which wiped out all their records. BB indeed has an oil/ grease port. That would put it up to the early 60’s at least. That headbadge should be the dating clue.

Great, great save!
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Old 05-22-21, 07:06 PM
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Please post a photo of the whole bike.
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Old 05-22-21, 07:33 PM
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Originally Posted by CTony View Post
Thank you guys.Juvela can you put a date on bike?

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pedals appear to be Phillips Apollo

readers might be able to give additional information regarding the cycle with additional imagery to work with:

side view of complete machine taken from its own level

side view of head

side view of rear closeup on dropout

(no downangle pictures please)

machine may not be quite so early as some readers may suspect

when one gets far eno' back with Dawes the headplates are cloisonne - something not present here

-----
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Old 05-22-21, 07:55 PM
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There's a group on facebook you could ask at if you're not averse to facebook. Try searching for the Dawes Cycles Heritage group. I think most of their members are from the UK.
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Old 05-22-21, 08:35 PM
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There also used to be a Dawes marque expert with the Veteran Cycle Club who gave me good info 20 years ago about the early 60s Realmrider I had for a while. I think this is from before the mid-50s but I am not sure how much earlier.
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Old 05-22-21, 08:47 PM
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according to the Dawes Heritage timeline the machine's headplate is one which is not shown in the chronology. they have a gap between 1961 and 1963 in their chronology -

https://dawescycles.wordpress.com/po...adge-timeline/

its serial placement on the non-drive side of the seat lug began in 1926 and was employed until 1956 -

https://dawescycles.wordpress.com/po...mber-location/

[yes, a possible contradiction]

of the few catalogues available online the one with the closest plausible date for the cycle is from 1955 -

https://dawescycles.wordpress.com/po...955-catalogue/

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Last edited by juvela; 05-22-21 at 08:54 PM. Reason: addition
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Old 05-23-21, 12:37 PM
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Good Morning, added pic of Dawes

So Iím added few more photos let me know if anyone has more information to share.Than you. Bike being stripped.

No stamp on stem or bars

115 backspacing

Bike may have been painted found Blue

Brake handle has GB markings


Would this be stock wheel Rim stamped Arya 26x1 3/8 front has made in england
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Old 05-23-21, 12:49 PM
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4-speed freewheel should give you a reasonable latest date of manufacture. Sprockets look like ones for 1/8" chain. And while I'm no expert, the double threads on the left side of the rear wheel suggest a flip-flop configuration??
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Old 05-23-21, 01:12 PM
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unfortunate that the machine's original Freres Huret gear mech has been replaced

was looking forward to seeing it as a dating aid for the cycle

Brit shorthand for this type of rear hub is D/S, standing for double sided

headplate suggests bicycle may come from a brief transitional period
it most closely resembles the one DH states came into use in 1963

---

wonder if Arya marking on wheel rim is actually Araya

is front spacing 89mm?

---

suspect you will find shell width to be 68mm and threading of both steerer and shell to be 24TPI


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Last edited by juvela; 05-23-21 at 01:14 PM. Reason: punctuation
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Old 05-23-21, 02:00 PM
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Juvela correct on wheel my error.front spacing 91mm.I’m not sure what you mean in your last sentence.if the rear wheel is correct what was threaded on the side sorry to ask I’ve never own a flip flop hub i was told they are used with 120mm backspace.
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Old 05-23-21, 02:30 PM
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the unused threads on the (current) non-drive side of the rear hub are for a fixed cog as in a track/fixie cycle

the larger diameter threads are for the cog and the smaller diameter ones for its lockring

another name for this type of hub is a "training hub"

-----
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Old 05-24-21, 12:05 PM
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Debonair 1955

I believe your bike to be a 1955 Debonair. The lack of a bracket on the fork for a lamp counters my POV but there were some Dawes ala 1955 without said bracket- albeit not Debonairs.
The position of the serial number and the Brampton BB is very precise. The headset being Brampton would clinch pre-1955 as DOM.

Last edited by Johno59; 05-24-21 at 12:33 PM.
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Old 05-24-21, 02:38 PM
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thanks very much for this post

the subject cycle does exhibit some differences from the text and photo of the Debonair model in the 1955 catalogue

specification is for a three arm replaceable chainwheel while cycle's chainwheel is swaged to arm

three finishes are given in the text description, none of which is the cycle's dark green
catalogue image depicts a bicycle with a white head tube and white bands on seat tube which our example lacks

machine in catalogue photo shown fitted with Benelux gear while subject bicycle appears to have come with Huret gear set

machine in catalogue image is shown with open cable operation for the gear and a brazed on chainstay stop while subject cycle has no chainstay stop and shows covered cable all the way

cycle under consideration has a plate style fork crown which the bicycle in the catalogue photo lacks

our machine uses spring clips to hold rear brake cable to top tube while example in catalogue image has open cable operation with braze-on housing stops

fork ends of cycle under discussion differ from those shown in catalogue image

-----
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Old 05-25-21, 09:41 AM
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Perhaps earlier?

Originally Posted by juvela View Post
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thanks very much for this post

the subject cycle does exhibit some differences from the text and photo of the Debonair model in the 1955 catalogue

specification is for a three arm replaceable chainwheel while cycle's chainwheel is swaged to arm

three finishes are given in the text description, none of which is the cycle's dark green
catalogue image depicts a bicycle with a white head tube and white bands on seat tube which our example lacks

machine in catalogue photo shown fitted with Benelux gear while subject bicycle appears to have come with Huret gear set

machine in catalogue image is shown with open cable operation for the gear and a brazed on chainstay stop while subject cycle has no chainstay stop and shows covered cable all the way

cycle under consideration has a plate style fork crown which the bicycle in the catalogue photo lacks

our machine uses spring clips to hold rear brake cable to top tube while example in catalogue image has open cable operation with braze-on housing stops

fork ends of cycle under discussion differ from those shown in catalogue image

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All the Dawes from the 1955 catalogue have the pump mounted on the crossbar. You have to go back to the 1940s to view a pump on the downtube.
As you pointed out there are no braze on on the subject ala 1950s but the Dawes 1940 frames are clean. The 60s and 70s all have braze ons.
The flip flop wheel is also very 1940s, a hood over the fork crown is missing - a hood held down by the race of the bottom bearing headset another 1940s fashion- as is the flat shouldered crown itself.
Utility made ornate chainsets for most British marques, I doubt this one came new with that amazing chainset - it is absolutely fantastic.
The subject lugs are basic cutaways - the catalogs indicate that was 1940s and not 1950s.
The seatstays brazed at the seatpost cluster are not shaped or scalloped which IMHO leans away from the more modern Dawes frames.

Last edited by Johno59; 05-25-21 at 01:30 PM.
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