Question About Record 8 Speed Rear Derailleurs
08-26-21, 08:30 AM
#1
OldSchool
Thread Starter
Question About Record 8 Speed Rear Derailleurs
Having experienced this once, I am familiar with the occurrence of a hairline crack in the upper area of the mounting bolt housing on 8 speed Record rear derailleurs. In 1996 Campy came out with titanium components in the Record group. The rear derailleur, ergo shifters, and certain hub components were included in the first titanium issue. Specific to the rear derailleur, the catalog claimed weight savings and less friction between the moving parts (no mention of the metal fatigue at the mounting bolt housing). Did the introduction of the titanium rear derailleur also eliminate the metal fatigue associated with the hairline crack? Being wary of the crack problem which was fairly common, I was intending to use a Chorus RD. But then I came across this 1996 catalog and I was wondering if the titanium version of the Record RD would totally eliminate that possibility. Thanks for any information.
08-26-21, 10:09 AM
#2
Senior Member
I had an 8 speed Record RD w/ Ti hardware crack at the upper pivot / mounting bolt area. But I have a first generation, all alloy Record 9 Speed RD (Ti hardware) that is still going strong. Maybe you can look into whether those 9 speed RDs will work with an 8 speed set up?
Last edited by gearbasher; 08-26-21 at 11:36 AM.
08-26-21, 01:35 PM
#3
OldSchool
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by gearbasher
I had an 8 speed Record RD w/ Ti hardware crack at the upper pivot / mounting bolt area. But I have a first generation, all alloy Record 9 Speed RD (Ti hardware) that is still going strong. Maybe you can look into whether those 9 speed RDs will work with an 8 speed set up?
08-26-21, 01:45 PM
#4
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I had the '96 8 speed Chorus group. The titanium bolt was the only difference between it and Record. And no I don't believe they were compatible with 9 speed so a Chorus RD is your best choice.
Far and away the best road group I've ever owned, it never missed a shift over thousands of kms.
Far and away the best road group I've ever owned, it never missed a shift over thousands of kms.
08-26-21, 01:51 PM
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1991 Campy Record RD With Cracked Upper Pivot
Originally Posted by cpsqlrwn
Having experienced this once, I am familiar with the occurrence of a hairline crack in the upper area of the mounting bolt housing on 8 speed Record rear derailleurs. Specific to the rear derailleur, the catalog claimed weight savings and less friction between the moving parts (no mention of the metal fatigue at the mounting bolt housing). Did the introduction of the titanium rear derailleur also eliminate the metal fatigue associated with the hairline crack? Being wary of the crack problem which was fairly common....
I had an almost new 1991 Lemond TeamZ with an 8 speed Chorus gruppo that I sold. When I was packing it up to ship, I noticed a more than hair line crack across the top of the upper pivot on the RD!
It was in a position that was concealed by the shadows and reflections.
I sprung for an NOS one that I found on eBay because I couldn't sell a bike in that condition!
There is no excuse for this kind of crack to happen! POOR design and workmanship!
verktyg
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08-26-21, 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by clubman
I had the '96 8 speed Chorus group. The titanium bolt was the only difference between it and Record. And no I don't believe they were compatible with 9 speed so a Chorus RD is your best choice.
Far and away the best road group I've ever owned, it never missed a shift over thousands of kms.
Far and away the best road group I've ever owned, it never missed a shift over thousands of kms.
...great thing about Campy 8s and 9s ergo is that they were vertically compatible with every component base to premium without a hitch.
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1987 Crest Cannondale, 1987 Basso Gap, 1992 Rossin Performance EL, 1990ish Van Tuyl, 1980s Vanni Losa Cassani thingy, 1985 Trek 670, 1982 AD SLE, 2003 Pinarello Surprise, 1990ish MBK Atlantique, 1987 Peugeot Competition, 1987 Nishiki Tri-A, 1981? Faggin, 1996ish Cannondale M500, 1984 Mercian, 1982 AD SuperLeicht, 1985 Massi (model unknown), 1988 Daccordi Griffe (most not finished of course)...need to not buy any more.
08-26-21, 07:37 PM
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The split knuckles appear to be the result of an over-tight press-fitted sleeve/bushing, resulting in creep-yield failure of the knuckle.
Fatigue would be the cause if there were no bushing pressed into the knuckle.
It's very similar to how Campagnolo's pulleys would split, due to their prolonged tension stress of being a tight fit on the busing.
Unfortunately, both aluminum and plastic are much, much more vulnerable to creep-yield failure than is steel.
All of the 8 and 9s derailers having a conventional B-tension screw are interchangeable. With the introduction of their C9 chain, Campagnolo recommended it's use with the earlier 8s drivetrain.
Fatigue would be the cause if there were no bushing pressed into the knuckle.
It's very similar to how Campagnolo's pulleys would split, due to their prolonged tension stress of being a tight fit on the busing.
Unfortunately, both aluminum and plastic are much, much more vulnerable to creep-yield failure than is steel.
All of the 8 and 9s derailers having a conventional B-tension screw are interchangeable. With the introduction of their C9 chain, Campagnolo recommended it's use with the earlier 8s drivetrain.
Last edited by dddd; 08-26-21 at 07:40 PM.
08-27-21, 09:04 AM
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Originally Posted by dddd
The split knuckles appear to be the result of an over-tight press-fitted sleeve/bushing, resulting in creep-yield failure of the knuckle.
Fatigue would be the cause if there were no bushing pressed into the knuckle.
It's very similar to how Campagnolo's pulleys would split, due to their prolonged tension stress of being a tight fit on the busing.
Unfortunately, both aluminum and plastic are much, much more vulnerable to creep-yield failure than is steel.
All of the 8 and 9s derailers having a conventional B-tension screw are interchangeable. With the introduction of their C9 chain, Campagnolo recommended it's use with the earlier 8s drivetrain.
Fatigue would be the cause if there were no bushing pressed into the knuckle.
It's very similar to how Campagnolo's pulleys would split, due to their prolonged tension stress of being a tight fit on the busing.
Unfortunately, both aluminum and plastic are much, much more vulnerable to creep-yield failure than is steel.
All of the 8 and 9s derailers having a conventional B-tension screw are interchangeable. With the introduction of their C9 chain, Campagnolo recommended it's use with the earlier 8s drivetrain.
Dean
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08-27-21, 09:11 AM
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08-27-21, 04:43 PM
#10
OldSchool
Thread Starter
Thanks for all the responses and great information. I'll either go with an 8 speed Chorus RD or a pre 2000 9-speed Chorus or Record RD. I am assuming the 9-speed Record RD did not have the same crack issue as the 8-speed Record RD. If someone could absolutely confirm that the 9-speed Record is ok with regard to the upper mount bolt housing cracks, I would appreciate it. Otherwise I'll stick with Chorus.
08-28-21, 12:03 PM
#11
Newbie
I can confirm that a 9 speed derailleur can work with an 8 speed setup. When I ruined my Avanti 8 speed, I was offered a cheap 9 speed Daytona RD, and decided to take the chance. I had no problems with that setup.
08-28-21, 07:46 PM
#12
OldSchool
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by Highmass
I can confirm that a 9 speed derailleur can work with an 8 speed setup. When I ruined my Avanti 8 speed, I was offered a cheap 9 speed Daytona RD, and decided to take the chance. I had no problems with that setup.
08-29-21, 01:01 AM
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Originally Posted by cpsqlrwn
Thank you for your response. I am not concerned with whether a 9-speed Campy RD will work with 8-speed Campy ergo shifters. Pre 2001 9-speed Campy RDs will definitely work with Campy 8-speed drive trains. My only concern at this point is confirming whether pre 2001 Record 9-speed RDs have the same tendency tp produce hairline cracks as the 8-speed Record RDs. Thank you.
The mounting bolt for my 8-speed Chorus RD was tweaked (likely from a soft fall) and so I paid about $11 for a complete but cracked 9-speed Record RD on the bay, and harvested the bolt.
I expect the type of fall would make a difference, and this design doesn't handle certain impacts well.
