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22.2 quill stem adapter seems slightly to big - Trying to replace ITM quill stem

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22.2 quill stem adapter seems slightly to big - Trying to replace ITM quill stem

Old 09-13-21, 05:19 PM
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jonny7
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22.2 quill stem adapter seems slightly to big - Trying to replace ITM quill stem

Hello all, I want to put modern bars on a really nice steel bike I have. It has Columbus Thron tubing. I bought a 22.2 quill stem adapter thinking this was the only possible measure for me, but weirdly it seems just a little tight for my frame.

With my digital caliper, I noticed that the previously installed ITM stem had a diameter around 21.75 mm. Has this ever been a weird italian standard? With the help of grease I've managed to fit my new 22.2 (actually ~22.4) adapter into my headtube but it's clearly a little tight in there. It's not swaying left and right when even when the top bolt is loose. Is there any risk with this setup, besides seizing? Like could it put mean extra pressure on the head tube?

Thanks for your help!
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Old 09-14-21, 07:17 PM
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Not sure if this of any help. Tried to catch both stems in one photo.


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Old 09-14-21, 07:34 PM
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Unless youíre dealing with outdated standards like French or BMX steerers/head tubes, you can chalk it up to manufacturing tolerances. Do grease the section of the stem adapter that was inserted into the steerer, but unless you hammered it in, you donít have to worry about it being incompatible with the steerer.
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Old 09-14-21, 07:50 PM
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French runs 22.0, rare cases I've seen same on Swiss bikes
Careful when calipering stems, where on the stem you measure is important.
Obvious risk is seize and having to hammer out later, or cracking the steer tube

Curious more than anything: What's the measurement stamped into the ITM stem? 22.0? 22.2? Should have a measure.
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Old 09-14-21, 08:02 PM
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I guess it’s not been asked yet — what kind of bike is it?
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Old 09-14-21, 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by noobinsf View Post
Unless youíre dealing with outdated standards like French or BMX steerers/head tubes, you can chalk it up to manufacturing tolerances. Do grease the section of the stem adapter that was inserted into the steerer, but unless you hammered it in, you donít have to worry about it being incompatible with the steerer.
thank you!

Originally Posted by francophile View Post
French runs 22.0, rare cases I've seen same on Swiss bikes
Careful when calipering stems, where on the stem you measure is important.
Obvious risk is seize and having to hammer out later, or cracking the steer tube

Curious more than anything: What's the measurement stamped into the ITM stem? 22.0? 22.2? Should have a measure.
curious to learn! Where should one take the measure?

as for the ITM, I was looking for a measure but the only numbers I find are the length (120mm) and an unknown number (88? 98?)





Originally Posted by noobinsf View Post
I guess itís not been asked yet ó what kind of bike is it?
a Guru Strada, with Thron tubing.
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Old 09-14-21, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by jonny7 View Post
thank you!



curious to learn! Where should one take the measure?

as for the ITM, I was looking for a measure but the only numbers I find are the length (120mm) and an unknown number (88? 98?)







a Guru Strada, with Thron tubing.
I normally find taking the average from 1cm and 2cm from the tip of the quill, or mid-split on those which don't use a slant wedge is ideal.

I believe the stamping of size in this case is under the mass of corrosion on the stem. Maybe use some bronze wool to remove the corrosion Hopefully the rotational damage hasn't run through the markings, assuming it's there as I'd expect.
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Old 09-14-21, 08:53 PM
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Originally Posted by jonny7 View Post
thank you!



curious to learn! Where should one take the measure?

as for the ITM, I was looking for a measure but the only numbers I find are the length (120mm) and an unknown number (88? 98?)







a Guru Strada, with Thron tubing.
Gonna go out on a limb here and say the inside of the steerer tube should be cleaned up a bunch, from the looks of that stem it may be pretty nasty in there and could easily be mucking things up.

Or just grease the adapter and hope for the best.
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Old 09-15-21, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by merziac View Post
Gonna go out on a limb here and say the inside of the steerer tube should be cleaned up a bunch, from the looks of that stem it may be pretty nasty in there and could easily be mucking things up.
Most definitely! But I had a hard them to insert the quill right from the start -- had to rotate it quite a lot to put it in -- so there's probably more to it than just rust!
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Old 09-15-21, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by jonny7 View Post
Most definitely! But I had a hard them to insert the quill right from the start -- had to rotate it quite a lot to put it in -- so there's probably more to it than just rust!
Maybe, you would be surprised how little it can take, especially with a tight fit. I would get after it with some PB Blaster and very stout wire brush and file after that.
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Old 09-15-21, 06:02 PM
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Originally Posted by jonny7 View Post
Most definitely! But I had a hard them to insert the quill right from the start -- had to rotate it quite a lot to put it in -- so there's probably more to it than just rust!
That ITM stem is gnarly!

I had a similar issue with a seatpost recently. I was certain my Performance Blue Ridge took a 27.0 but a shop measured it and they said it's 27.2. After failing to insert a 27.2, I spent a long time cleaning the seat tube with degreaser, a wire brush and lots of paper towels. I also did many rounds of greasing the seatpost, installing, removing to clean it and repeat. Everything went from grungy to squeaky clean and sure enough, a 27.2 fits like a glove now.
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Old 09-15-21, 06:54 PM
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Originally Posted by tricky View Post
That ITM stem is gnarly!

I had a similar issue with a seatpost recently. I was certain my Performance Blue Ridge took a 27.0 but a shop measured it and they said it's 27.2. After failing to insert a 27.2, I spent a long time cleaning the seat tube with degreaser, a wire brush and lots of paper towels. I also did many rounds of greasing the seatpost, installing, removing to clean it and repeat. Everything went from grungy to squeaky clean and sure enough, a 27.2 fits like a glove now.
We really have to get down to brass tacks and realize how little 1-2, maybe 3/10's of a mm is, add nasty muck like this and it can even measure right and still be a no-go.

They can very much be a interference fit.

As you found out, the right size, clean, smooth ST, grease and voila, presto, perfect fit, amazing.

I've had several that were perfect, no grease, no go, proper grease and yep, fits like a glove.

Literally a very sticky wicket.
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Old 09-16-21, 10:17 AM
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Originally Posted by merziac View Post
We really have to get down to brass tacks and realize how little 1-2, maybe 3/10's of a mm is, add nasty muck like this and it can even measure right and still be a no-go.

They can very much be a interference fit.

As you found out, the right size, clean, smooth ST, grease and voila, presto, perfect fit, amazing.

I've had several that were perfect, no grease, no go, proper grease and yep, fits like a glove.

Literally a very sticky wicket.
Yup! Made me appreciate how clearances still matter on old bikes. I just assumed they were all loosey goosey by now.

All that to say, @jonny7 clean out the steerer tube really well (wire brush, degreaser, scotch brite pad on a stick, whatever), grease up the adapter, and insert, remove, and clean a few times until it works like it should. As long as there is no corrosion, it should look like smooth metal inside the steerer and not a bumpy, grungy mess.
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Old 09-16-21, 11:05 AM
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Word to the wise: Save the time and effort. clearing out tubes is a super-simple job. Just get a cylinder hone. They work wonders. I'd recommend going 600 grit in 7/8" and 1" to tackle most jobs you'll encounter. I prefer Flex Hone as far as products go. Avoid the cheapies on fleabay and Amazon. I ordered some many moons ago and haven't looked back.



Just wipe out any cake from your tube, slap it on a drill, insert, and pull the trigger for a couple of 2-3 second pulses and you're done. re-grease after and you're in business. Can also be used for longer durations to bore out a tube, but I only recommend if you know what you're doing!!

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Old 09-16-21, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by francophile View Post
Word to the wise: Save the time and effort. clearing out tubes is a super-simple job. Just get a cylinder hone. They work wonders. I'd recommend going 600 grit in 7/8" and 1" to tackle most jobs you'll encounter. I prefer Flex Hone as far as products go. Avoid the cheapies on fleabay and Amazon. I ordered some many moons ago and haven't looked back.



Just wipe out any cake from your tube, slap it on a drill, insert, and pull the trigger for a couple of 2-3 second pulses and you're done. re-grease after and you're in business. Can also be used for longer durations to bore out a tube, but I only recommend if you know what you're doing!!

Agreed, however, if you get the upper crust mucky layer(s) off first, the hone will do a much better job as well as last far longer.

They are made for a very final finish and even in the more aggressive grits are still meant to provide the end product.
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Old 09-16-21, 11:43 AM
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Originally Posted by merziac View Post
Agreed, however, if you get the upper crust mucky layer(s) off first, the hone will do a much better job as well as last far longer.

They are made for a very final finish and even in the more aggressive grits are still meant to provide the end product.
Definitely, I probably should've emphasized where I mentioned wiping the tube out first, but there's an automated option for that too.

Most $5 tire plugging kits at the auto parts stores come with a t-handle tool like this. It just so happens a red shop cloth can be woven through the eye. A little PB Blaster on the cloth and a dozen turns inside the tube will work wonders.

However, for S&G, I broke the plastic handle off so I could chuck it into my drill and automate that process too. It just so happens the steel rod is winged at the handle end so the rod doesn't spin in the handle.

Granted, you could also probably do the same with a rod, and I'd recommend to clean the BB shell after if extra gunky.
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Old 09-16-21, 12:03 PM
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Nah, you're good, the cake part was spot on.

I carry the tire plug kits in my cars with North Shore plugs, jump box/compressor and a can of flat fix, always have.

And just like my overstocked tool kit I carry on the bike, have very rarely needed any of it.

I usually zip tie the Scotch brite to a long screw driver and go at it.
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Old 09-16-21, 07:48 PM
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this forum never ceases to amaze me. thanks francophile merziac tricky !
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