Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

Alpine Cycles, pursuit/ lo pro frame. where to start?!

Notices
Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

Alpine Cycles, pursuit/ lo pro frame. where to start?!

Old 11-04-21, 09:47 PM
  #1  
Danger Diaz
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 34

Bikes: Cinelli Vigorelli Road, Cinelli SC Pista, Panasonic NJS track, Alpine Cycles lo-pro pursuit frame, others.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked 11 Times in 9 Posts
Alpine Cycles, pursuit/ lo pro frame. where to start?!

Hello, I’m new here. I bought this geared bike frame with the intention of converting it into a track bike after seeing the rear track dropouts. But after having someone guilt me into doing so to a nice original frame, he insisted that I search its history first.

It’s an Alpine Cycles, 53cm pursuit frame with a 24” front fork. A cable pass through and the rear brake mounts under. It has a Shimano headset and bb. The seller was no help on clues to its past so I’ve done some reading here and there. All I know is that Alpine Cycles was out of Washington D.C., and that this frame looks similar to a frame Fred Kelly build while working there. Mr Kelly then “hurt his back and couldn’t ride anymore”, “went into real estate/ became a realtor” and “may no longer be with us.”

My plan is to repaint it, add a rear disc wheel, a campy sheriff star in the front and give it 6 speeds. I already had some Cinelli LA84 uncut bullhorns.

If I knew it’s history then I could try to keep true to the original set up. It would also help to figure out what should I use for a rear brake?






Danger Diaz is offline  
Likes For Danger Diaz:
Old 11-04-21, 09:52 PM
  #2  
degan
Mote of Dust
 
degan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 895
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 112 Post(s)
Liked 60 Times in 40 Posts
"Rear disc wheel" threw me for a second, thinking you were going to have a disc brake mount added in the back! I love those era pursuit bikes. Back when it seemed bike makers just wanted to be wonky for S&Gs.
degan is offline  
Likes For degan:
Old 11-04-21, 11:02 PM
  #3  
thook
(rhymes with spook)
 
thook's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Winslow, AR
Posts: 2,784

Bikes: '83 univega gran turismo x2, '85 schwinn super le tour,'89 miyata triple cross, '91 GT tequesta, '90 yokota grizzly peak, '94 GT backwoods, '95'ish scott tampico, '98 bonty privateer, '93 mongoose crossway 625, '98 parkpre ariel, 2k'ish giant fcr3

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 914 Post(s)
Liked 733 Times in 540 Posts
it looks like a PO drilled out the rear brake bridge for a recessed caliper?

T-Mar ???
thook is offline  
Old 11-04-21, 11:12 PM
  #4  
billytwosheds 
Senior Member
 
billytwosheds's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Honolulu, HI
Posts: 1,038

Bikes: Peugeot, Legnano, Fuji, Zunow, De Rosa, Miyata, Bianchi, Pinarello, Specialized, Bridgestone

Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 316 Post(s)
Liked 171 Times in 86 Posts
Does it fit you?

That's a really neat frame, easily a conversation starter at any cycling gathering. Super cool.
billytwosheds is offline  
Old 11-04-21, 11:24 PM
  #5  
Danger Diaz
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 34

Bikes: Cinelli Vigorelli Road, Cinelli SC Pista, Panasonic NJS track, Alpine Cycles lo-pro pursuit frame, others.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked 11 Times in 9 Posts
Originally Posted by billytwosheds View Post
Does it fit you?

That's a really neat frame, easily a conversation starter at any cycling gathering. Super cool.
Thanks, and yes I ride 52-53cm
Danger Diaz is offline  
Old 11-05-21, 03:43 PM
  #6  
icemilkcoffee 
Senior Member
 
icemilkcoffee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,117
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 654 Post(s)
Liked 502 Times in 306 Posts
I typically ride around 54cm, but I ride a 62cm Lo-pro. Due to the sloping top tube you can get away with that. Whereas on that 53cm frame your handlebars will be very low. It will be very aggressive.
Anyways- this looks like an awesome project! What is the rear drop-out spacing?
icemilkcoffee is offline  
Old 11-05-21, 03:53 PM
  #7  
Danger Diaz
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 34

Bikes: Cinelli Vigorelli Road, Cinelli SC Pista, Panasonic NJS track, Alpine Cycles lo-pro pursuit frame, others.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked 11 Times in 9 Posts
Originally Posted by icemilkcoffee View Post
I typically ride around 54cm, but I ride a 62cm Lo-pro. Due to the sloping top tube you can get away with that. Whereas on that 53cm frame your handlebars will be very low. It will be very aggressive.
Anyways- this looks like an awesome project! What is the rear drop-out spacing?
i read it as 125mm but a friend said 126mm is standard size.
Danger Diaz is offline  
Old 11-05-21, 08:45 PM
  #8  
Danger Diaz
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 34

Bikes: Cinelli Vigorelli Road, Cinelli SC Pista, Panasonic NJS track, Alpine Cycles lo-pro pursuit frame, others.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked 11 Times in 9 Posts

inspiration!

hanging out.
Danger Diaz is offline  
Old 11-05-21, 10:45 PM
  #9  
icemilkcoffee 
Senior Member
 
icemilkcoffee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,117
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 654 Post(s)
Liked 502 Times in 306 Posts
Originally Posted by Danger Diaz View Post
i read it as 125mm but a friend said 126mm is standard size.
Good! That opens up a lot more possibilities than if it was 120mm.
what handlebars are those you’ve got on?
icemilkcoffee is offline  
Likes For icemilkcoffee:
Old 11-06-21, 07:48 AM
  #10  
Danger Diaz
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 34

Bikes: Cinelli Vigorelli Road, Cinelli SC Pista, Panasonic NJS track, Alpine Cycles lo-pro pursuit frame, others.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked 11 Times in 9 Posts
Originally Posted by icemilkcoffee View Post
what handlebars are those you’ve got on?
Cinelli LA84 bullhorns uncut, I also have a pair that’s had the last 2” cut off. I prefer these.
Danger Diaz is offline  
Old 11-06-21, 10:35 AM
  #11  
Reynolds 
Passista
 
Reynolds's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 7,355

Bikes: 1998 Pinarello Asolo, 1992 KHS Montaña pro, 1980 Raleigh DL-1, IGH Hybrid, IGH Utility

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 787 Post(s)
Liked 485 Times in 276 Posts
+1 on not modifying that frame!
Some more inspiration here:
Picture of Your Favorite Vintage Time Trial Bicycles and Why!
Reynolds is offline  
Likes For Reynolds:
Old 11-06-21, 11:59 PM
  #12  
Danger Diaz
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 34

Bikes: Cinelli Vigorelli Road, Cinelli SC Pista, Panasonic NJS track, Alpine Cycles lo-pro pursuit frame, others.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked 11 Times in 9 Posts
Originally Posted by Reynolds View Post
+1 on not modifying that frame!
Some more inspiration here:
Picture of Your Favorite Vintage Time Trial Bicycles and Why!
thanks for that link!! but after going through all 76 pages of it only one bike had the same rear brake set up as mine. I was expecting to see more examples.
Danger Diaz is offline  
Old 11-07-21, 05:18 AM
  #13  
verktyg 
verktyg
 
verktyg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 3,915

Bikes: Current favorites: 1988 Peugeot Birraritz, 1984 Gitane Super Corsa, 1981 Bianchi Campione Del Mondo, 1992 Paramount OS, 1990 Bianchi Mondiale, 1988 Colnago Technos, 1985 RalieghUSA Team Pro, 1973 Holdsworth

Mentioned: 193 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 987 Post(s)
Liked 1,013 Times in 565 Posts
ALPINE Background

ALPINE was the house brand for Georgetown Cycle and Sport located at 3310 M St., N.W., Washington, DC. They also sold frames/bikes under the C.I. D. (Cycle Import and Design) brand.

Georgetown Cycle had a storied past dating at that location from the early 70's until 1975 . Mike Schwering (RIP) was the prime mover but many well known C&V folks like Larry Black, Wayne Bingham and others passed through those doors.The following was complied from extensive web history searches that I did - I'm not an expert on Alpines but this is some of what I found:

"Mike Schwering imported a variety of British, French and Italian frame sets and bikes. He also sold frames made in the US by builders like Paris-Sport, Tanguy, Albert Eisentraut, some very early Bruce Gordon's, StrawBerry, etc. At some point in time, Mike made a deal with MKM Cycles in the UK to buy painted frames without any decals. Those frame sets were decaled in the basement of the Georgetown shop with Alpine and C.S.D.(Custom Import and Design) brands.

MKM, Hurlow, Iles, Condor, Roberts, Limongi, and a variety of other frames and bikes were sold with those decals. [I had a mid 70's Alpine frame that was reputed to have been made in the UK by Tom Board]. Over time, many a decal found its way to other machines less worthy of the names." [In other words, anything that went through the shop could have been labeled an Alpine]

In the later and final years, the Alpine name was taken over by Fred Kelly and a few others in their frame shops in Rockville, MD producing some first-rate framesets. Fred Kelly got involved when he was a young racer starting in the early 80's. He built Alpine branded frames until the mid 80's. There were others who continued making "Alpine" frames but Fred Kelly was probably the best known."


Judging from the Swiss crosses engraved in the fork crown and the "fish mouth" fork and stay ends, the OP's frame could have been produced by Fred Kelly - blue bike below.... but for now, it could be considered a "bâtard"

My ALPINE




Eisentraut Limited frame built for Georgetown Cycle with ALPINE decals




Fred Kelly built ALPINE track frame





BTW, I know where there is a stack of ALPINE Swiss cross decals....

verktyg
__________________
Don't believe everything you think! History is written by those who weren't there....

Chas. ;-)


Last edited by verktyg; 11-07-21 at 05:33 AM.
verktyg is online now  
Old 11-07-21, 10:50 AM
  #14  
Danger Diaz
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 34

Bikes: Cinelli Vigorelli Road, Cinelli SC Pista, Panasonic NJS track, Alpine Cycles lo-pro pursuit frame, others.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked 11 Times in 9 Posts
Originally Posted by verktyg View Post
BTW, I know where there is a stack of ALPINE Swiss cross decals....

verktyg
that’s my next decision to make. I originally wanted to paint it a much different color but that would mean I’d have to get rid of the Alpine decals. now that I’m finding out all its history, do I keep it an “Alpine” with new decals? do I go about and make it my own? I wish I could see how this bike was first set up like.
Danger Diaz is offline  
Old 11-07-21, 09:30 PM
  #15  
verktyg 
verktyg
 
verktyg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 3,915

Bikes: Current favorites: 1988 Peugeot Birraritz, 1984 Gitane Super Corsa, 1981 Bianchi Campione Del Mondo, 1992 Paramount OS, 1990 Bianchi Mondiale, 1988 Colnago Technos, 1985 RalieghUSA Team Pro, 1973 Holdsworth

Mentioned: 193 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 987 Post(s)
Liked 1,013 Times in 565 Posts
Setting Up A Bare Frame

Originally Posted by Danger Diaz View Post
that’s my next decision to make. I originally wanted to paint it a much different color but that would mean I’d have to get rid of the Alpine decals. now that I’m finding out all its history, do I keep it an “Alpine” with new decals? do I go about and make it my own? I wish I could see how this bike was first set up like.
Frames like that were always sold as "bare frames" to be equipped with what ever the buyer wanted (that fit).

There is no right or wrong! Use whatever you have that fits. Period correct would be good.

I only use "matchy matchy" components when I'm putting together a bike that's expected to be All Campy or All French or what ever. Shimano is a good example, 600,105, Ultegra they all work well so what ever I have on hand or can get inexpensively (read cheaply) works for me. I only have one All DuraAce bike.

See my green ALPINE above: Campy headset and seatpost, Stronglight 93 cranks, Weinmann Carrera brakes, Shimano Crane GT RD. Shimano 600 FD and so on.

verktyg
__________________
Don't believe everything you think! History is written by those who weren't there....

Chas. ;-)

verktyg is online now  
Likes For verktyg:
Old 11-07-21, 10:09 PM
  #16  
Danger Diaz
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 34

Bikes: Cinelli Vigorelli Road, Cinelli SC Pista, Panasonic NJS track, Alpine Cycles lo-pro pursuit frame, others.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked 11 Times in 9 Posts
Originally Posted by verktyg View Post
There is no right or wrong! Use whatever you have that fits. Period correct would be good.
thanks, I plan on keeping it period correct which isn’t easy. the only rear brake I can see working is an early 80’s Shimano Ax but I want to keep the rear campy. looking for campy cranks with the engraved logo.
Danger Diaz is offline  
Old 11-08-21, 11:20 AM
  #17  
DMC707 
Senior Member
 
DMC707's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Norman, Oklahoma
Posts: 4,881

Bikes: Too many to list

Mentioned: 35 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1369 Post(s)
Liked 718 Times in 482 Posts
I have a Cliff Shrubb fillet brazed lo-pro with a curved seat tube that i need to do something with someday --- (far right in the pic) -- its pretty to look at, but i have little interest in actually riding it , so it sits.
Funny -- ive put together a handful of cool vintage projects over the past few years and i dont really ride those much either, as its tough for me to say no to the modern stuff ---- but at least with those, the idea that i COULD ride it if i wanted to is an important mental boost i guess

Id have to have the stem raised so high it would look ridiculous -- Technomic on a funny bike anyone ?


DMC707 is offline  
Likes For DMC707:
Old 11-08-21, 11:45 AM
  #18  
DMC707 
Senior Member
 
DMC707's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Norman, Oklahoma
Posts: 4,881

Bikes: Too many to list

Mentioned: 35 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1369 Post(s)
Liked 718 Times in 482 Posts
Originally Posted by Danger Diaz View Post
thanks, I plan on keeping it period correct which isn’t easy. the only rear brake I can see working is an early 80’s Shimano Ax but I want to keep the rear campy. looking for campy cranks with the engraved logo.
That bike looks like it was obviously designed to be dual purpose --- as in, you would have a set of track wheels for it as well so you could pop the brakes and derailleurs off, install track wheels and track chain, and go hit the velodrome too

But the track wheel would have to be built with a dished out setup to go with the 126 spacing as track wheels are usually 120
DMC707 is offline  
Likes For DMC707:
Old 11-08-21, 03:38 PM
  #19  
Danger Diaz
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 34

Bikes: Cinelli Vigorelli Road, Cinelli SC Pista, Panasonic NJS track, Alpine Cycles lo-pro pursuit frame, others.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked 11 Times in 9 Posts
Originally Posted by DMC707 View Post
That bike looks like it was obviously designed to be dual purpose --- as in, you would have a set of track wheels for it as well so you could pop the brakes and derailleurs off, install track wheels and track chain, and go hit the velodrome too
Do I run a 165mm or 170mm crank? I want to make this a 6 speed.
Danger Diaz is offline  
Old 11-09-21, 09:03 AM
  #20  
DMC707 
Senior Member
 
DMC707's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Norman, Oklahoma
Posts: 4,881

Bikes: Too many to list

Mentioned: 35 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1369 Post(s)
Liked 718 Times in 482 Posts
Originally Posted by Danger Diaz View Post
Do I run a 165mm or 170mm crank? I want to make this a 6 speed.
Thats a personal choice for sure ---- i'd run 170's myself or even 172.5's ----- and i ride the same size bikes as you so we're likely around the same height (5'8 for me ) ---- The thinking around the shorter cranks for a track specific bike is to give a little more clearance to prevent pedal strikes when riding up track. But even if you used this one for pursuit or kilo practice at the velodrome, you wont be riding above the red line , this type of machine stays down near the apron so you can use longer cranks
-- but 165's might be handy if youre a higher rpm spinner
DMC707 is offline  
Likes For DMC707:
Old 11-09-21, 10:06 AM
  #21  
DMC707 
Senior Member
 
DMC707's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Norman, Oklahoma
Posts: 4,881

Bikes: Too many to list

Mentioned: 35 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1369 Post(s)
Liked 718 Times in 482 Posts
Just found a pic of mine mocked up- i have a nice MAvic disc for the rear, but its more modern than i wanted to use -- i contemplated using it in our summer TT series, but its tough to visualize riding this thing if you have a beer belly


DMC707 is offline  
Likes For DMC707:
Old 11-09-21, 01:10 PM
  #22  
Catnap 
zungguzungguguzungguzeng
 
Catnap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Ridgewood, Queens
Posts: 1,459

Bikes: Zunow, 3Rensho, Look KG196

Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 72 Post(s)
Liked 137 Times in 61 Posts
I'm sitting on a 53cm 3Rensho lo-pro with similar geometry. I was going to build it up and spent some time hunting down component before I decided not to go through with it. The biggest challenge is finding or building up a wheelset for it.

If you look on eBay, there's currently Wolber Profil tubular rims available in 24" and 700c, allowing you to build up a nice wheelset. There's also a nice silver Mavic Sport red-label 24" that could be matched to a 700c example. If you go the rear disc wheel route, it becomes a little easier since you're not trying to match a 24" rim to a 700c. As of last search (like two weeks ago or so) there were only 2 or 3 disc wheels with 126mm rear spacing available.

I never got as far as trying to hunt down a 24" tubular tire, but I assume that will also be a challenge.
__________________
Check out www.djcatnap.com for articles on vintage Japanese & French bicycle restorations, components and history.
Catnap is offline  
Likes For Catnap:
Old 11-09-21, 11:23 PM
  #23  
Danger Diaz
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 34

Bikes: Cinelli Vigorelli Road, Cinelli SC Pista, Panasonic NJS track, Alpine Cycles lo-pro pursuit frame, others.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked 11 Times in 9 Posts
Originally Posted by Catnap View Post
I'm sitting on a 53cm 3Rensho lo-pro with similar geometry. I was going to build it up and spent some time hunting down component before I decided not to go through with it. The biggest challenge is finding or building up a wheelset for it.
to be honest this will see more runs to coffee shops than velodromes. I wish I lived next to one, or within riding distance. I already have two options for the front. matching a rear disc to the build will take time. can you share a pic of your 3Rensho lo pro? please!!!
Danger Diaz is offline  
Old 11-10-21, 07:46 AM
  #24  
T-Mar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 22,587
Mentioned: 600 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4423 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2,424 Times in 1,568 Posts
Rear brake would have been one of the aero/delta brakesets. THe OP could use 600AX, Dura-Ace AX, Campagnolo Record Delta, Campagnolo Crocé d'Aune, Modolo Kronos or Weinmann Delta.
T-Mar is offline  
Likes For T-Mar:
Old 11-10-21, 08:11 AM
  #25  
Catnap 
zungguzungguguzungguzeng
 
Catnap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Ridgewood, Queens
Posts: 1,459

Bikes: Zunow, 3Rensho, Look KG196

Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 72 Post(s)
Liked 137 Times in 61 Posts
Originally Posted by Danger Diaz View Post
to be honest this will see more runs to coffee shops than velodromes. I wish I lived next to one, or within riding distance. I already have two options for the front. matching a rear disc to the build will take time. can you share a pic of your 3Rensho lo pro? please!!!
here's some photos of the Rensho:



__________________
Check out www.djcatnap.com for articles on vintage Japanese & French bicycle restorations, components and history.
Catnap is offline  
Likes For Catnap:

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.