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Bianchi, that will make you cry

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Bianchi, that will make you cry

Old 11-07-21, 12:59 PM
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konakai
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Bianchi, that will make you cry

picked this up yesterday off of local Facebook. the seller had 3 or 4 poor pictures in sections not showing the complete frame and Def not showing the rear stays. his ad said something like bianchi frame with some vintage bits. frame is straight with no damage that I can see. I was jazzed driving over to get it. I almost cried when I saw the stays. I still drug it home after renegotiate, the serial number starts with 160, 1960 maybe. does anyone know who could replace these stays....thanks for letting me vent






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Old 11-07-21, 01:13 PM
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Old 11-07-21, 01:17 PM
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Sort of looks like there was a rack on there that was so overtight for so long it became structurally integral to the frame.
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Old 11-07-21, 01:17 PM
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konakai-

Could you narrow your location? Your profile says US but people will recommend builders depending on your location. And yes, it is to weep.
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Old 11-07-21, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by bertinjim View Post
konakai-

Could you narrow your location? Your profile says US but people will recommend builders depending on your location. And yes, it is to weep.
sure, I'm in the midwest, missouri. I'm sure there are many who could make this repair, I just don't know anyone. thanks
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Old 11-07-21, 01:36 PM
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1605XX is 1960/1961.

Yellow Jersey in Wisconsin could fix the stays. They are relatively local to you.

Neat bike though, would have cleaned up nice if it weren't for those stays.
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Old 11-07-21, 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by iab View Post
1605XX is 1960/1961.

Yellow Jersey in Wisconsin could fix the stays. They are relatively local to you.

Neat bike though, would have cleaned up nice if it weren't for those stays.
yea, that's why I was sick when I saw it, don't know what was up with all that tape, thought maybe it was holding it together.. I'd like to repair the stays,, just repaint them,, and leave the original paint


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Old 11-07-21, 02:03 PM
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Definitely talk to Yellow Jersey, and I;m sure you'll get a few more recommendations from folks as this thread progresses. It's a brutal discovery, but certainly fixable, and that's a bike that's worth the trouble.
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Old 11-07-21, 02:10 PM
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If it makes you feel better, I'd spend real money on the stem/bars/cage combo. Maybe even more than what you paid total.
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Old 11-07-21, 02:24 PM
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Originally Posted by konakai View Post
sure, I'm in the midwest, missouri. I'm sure there are many who could make this repair, I just don't know anyone. thanks
Jeff Bock in Des Moines is a very fine frame builder. He could do this repair. If you're not too far from Des Moines, you could even visit his shop which is north of Des Moines and talk to him about the repair.
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Old 11-07-21, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by iab View Post
If it makes you feel better, I'd spend real money on the stem/bars/cage combo. Maybe even more than what you paid total.
I'm not crying about buying the frame, I've got a sweaty folgore, and have been looking for an early celeste bianchi for a while. I like something as nice as I can find it original, but I really appreciate the sweaty, battle scarred originals. I saw half the bike in pics, then the rest when I went to pick it up. it was a blow, but it's all good, I'm a happy camper
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Old 11-07-21, 03:28 PM
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If you're in Kansas City, Missouri area Julie Ann Pedalino could easily do that job.
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Old 11-07-21, 03:59 PM
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Question for @Doug Fattic,

Seat stays are probably the easiest things for a framebuilder to replace; it's the last part of a frame that goes on. I'm looking at the mitered end caps and chrome socks, and would think these should be preserved if possible. If'n it were me, my first thought would be just to cut out the damaged portion and splice in a new section, preserving both the mitered "bullet" original ends at the seat lug as well as the original chrome, then of course adding a new brake bridge. This would save most of the original paint (the OP stated he appreciated the battle scars).

Probably the hardest thing would be matching the paint color and matching the patin, but an automative paint shop could match it.

Thoughts?
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Old 11-07-21, 04:03 PM
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Didn’t actually cry. Just teared up some, is all (sniff).
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Old 11-07-21, 04:14 PM
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Originally Posted by gugie View Post
Question for [MENTION=184012] I'm looking at the mitered end caps
The Bianchi seat cluster is cast, including the bullet, there is no miter. The seat stay is square cut to fit.
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Old 11-07-21, 04:38 PM
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Originally Posted by iab View Post
The Bianchi seat cluster is cast, including the bullet, there is no miter. The seat stay is square cut to fit.
Another reason to keep it.
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Old 11-07-21, 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted by gugie View Post
Another reason to keep it.
It looks like this Bianchi is in the right hands. Canít wait to see the end results.
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Old 11-07-21, 05:22 PM
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For another source check out Lightweight Classic Vintage bicycles. You'll find a bunch of qualified individuals.
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Old 11-07-21, 06:25 PM
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Originally Posted by konakai View Post
I'm not crying about buying the frame, I've got a sweaty folgore, and have been looking for an early celeste bianchi for a while. I like something as nice as I can find it original, but I really appreciate the sweaty, battle scarred originals. I saw half the bike in pics, then the rest when I went to pick it up. it was a blow, but it's all good, I'm a happy camper
IMO, you hit the jackpot.

Plenty here to be thankful for, that kind of thing up front would be far worse and way more $$$$$$ to fix.

This is a holy grail of Bianchi's this old, Specialisima, Celeste, bars, stem, HS, levers, crank, BB and pedals, check, check, check and check.

Pretty much whatever you paid was a deal.

Get to it and make it so, this is going to be fantastic.
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Old 11-07-21, 07:13 PM
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What's the big deal? That'll buff right out. (Hey, somebody had to say it . . . .)

Even if iab hadn't provided the serial number/date info, I would have said that was a bunch older than 1980. The head badge, the pressed-in headset, the decal style and the placement of the serial number all say "early to mid 1960s" even without iab's (as usual) great info.

As for the previous owner, some people just should not be allowed to have nice things. What was done to those seat stays has to be banned by the Geneva Convention. And if they had to splash gray paint/primer on the damaged seat stays, why did they also have to splash it on the back of the (seemingly undamaged) seat tube? I mean, really, ?
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Old 11-07-21, 09:11 PM
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Bianchi Seat Stays

Originally Posted by bikingshearer View Post
What's the big deal? That'll buff right out. (Hey, somebody had to say it . . . .)

Even if iab hadn't provided the serial number/date info, I would have said that was a bunch older than 1980. The head badge, the pressed-in headset, the decal style and the placement of the serial number all say "early to mid 1960s" even without iab's (as usual) great info.

As for the previous owner, some people just should not be allowed to have nice things. What was done to those seat stays has to be banned by the Geneva Convention. And if they had to splash gray paint/primer on the damaged seat stays, why did they also have to splash it on the back of the (seemingly undamaged) seat tube? I mean, really, ?

Some people shouldn't be allowed to pick up any tool more complicated that a hammer! A stone hammer!



Ed Litton would be the go to guy for first class repairs on high end Bianchis. He had a contract for years with Bianchi USA to do all of the warranty repairs, resprays and other work on their top bikes. He has decals and can mix any color of Celeste you'd like.

Unfortunately like many of the other top builders, he has a back log. I'm going on a years and a half waiting for my new frame.

That said, as gugie suggested, splicing in some new seat stays would be a good option if done by someone who knew what they were doing.

Bianchi used cast lugs; the bullet points were part of the of the seat lug casting.



The seat stays slide over he spuds or spigots like on this lug.



Trying to un-braze the stays from the lug can easily result in overheating the lug and seat tube because the remelting temperature of the brass is higher than the original melting temperature when the frame was being built. Look up eutectic effect.

I would recommend cutting the seat stays off near the lug and use a mechanical method like filing, grinding with a burr etc.

The NDS stay looks OK above the brake bridge until you get to the butchery. Cut it off below what could be the heat affected zone - 3" below the scar. The drive side stay need major reconstructive surgery. Remove the diseased portion and go from there.

Fit smaller diameter tubes into the implants, even a sold rod might work OK as weight is not an issue. Braze using low temperature silver, file, sand, respray.

The over spray on the back of the seat tube could be just that, the nimrod got carriesd away with the rattle can... or they could have burned the paint while trying to cauterizing the wound...

UMM ROCK GUD !

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Old 11-07-21, 11:09 PM
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Originally Posted by verktyg View Post

I would recommend cutting the seat stays off near the lug and use a mechanical method like filing, grinding with a burr etc.

The NDS stay looks OK above the brake bridge until you gt to the butchery. Cut it off below what could be the heat affected zone - 3" below the scar. The drive side stay need major reconstructive surgery. Remove the diseased portion and go from there.

Fit smaller diameter tubes into the implants, even a sold rod might work OK as weight is not an issue. Braze using low temperature silver, file, sand, respray.

The over spray on the back of the seat tube could be just that, the nimrod got carriesd away with the rattle can... or they could have burned the paint while trying to cauterizing the wound...

verktyg
Those details are pretty much exactly what I was thinking. I think the overspray could be carefully removed, or resprayed to match, then some accelerated patina to match the rest of the bike. The goal would be to make it look like there was never an issue to begin with - an "invisible" repair.

There are lots of great builders mentioned above, if their queues are too long, the OP could contact me. Looks like something I'd enjoy bringing back to life. This frame is definitely worth saving.

BTW, a solid "implant" wouldn't be advised, it'd take a lot of heat to get silver to melt and stick to it. A few times when doing this kind of spice I've use both undersized and oversized tubing, slotted it, and reshaped. The OD of the seat stay should be easy to match from stock tubing.
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Old 11-08-21, 04:10 AM
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Palliative or Reconstructive Surgery ???

Originally Posted by gugie View Post
Those details are pretty much exactly what I was thinking. I think the overspray could be carefully removed, or resprayed to match, then some accelerated patina to match the rest of the bike. The goal would be to make it look like there was never an issue to begin with - an "invisible" repair.

BTW, a solid "implant" wouldn't be advised, it'd take a lot of heat to get silver to melt and stick to it. A few times when doing this kind of spice I've use both undersized and oversized tubing, slotted it, and reshaped. The OD of the seat stay should be easy to match from stock tubing.
I was thinking of using a small plug near the bottom of the mangled DS stay because the small diameter stays are usually taper gauge. The tubing wall thickness increases as the diameter decreases. Maybe a Roll Pin of the right diameter would work?

Years ago a friend of mine got interested in C&V bikes after seeing and riding some of mine. We went to a bikes swap at the Cow Palace. He's quite impulsive and bought an old custom built ultra light French frame from the 50's or earlier without consulting with me first. It was lugless with main tubes that could have been as thin as 0.3mm like the post war French Trials bikes.

It had been sand blasted and rattle can sprayed flat gold. Visions of sugar plums danced in his head as he was looking forward to restoring it to period correct and riding it. Not sure if it was me or him who discovered the rust cancer in the seat stays and forks...

He's an accomplished machinist, designer, fabricator and so forth but had the common sense to take it to a local builder who sleeved the seat stays rather than try to replace them (can of worms). Now it will always be a wall hanger.

The OP's Bianchi has a much more robust frame... but any time I see chrome socks I get suspicious because I have 3 rare bikes that were not properly neutralized after chrome plating and you can hear the rust flakes rattling around in the forks and stays.

Most recently, I bought this low mileage 1985-86 Bernard Hinault Look 753 bike. There were only 50 or 100 of these frames made in each size. Someone was bugging me to buy it. On close inspection of the rust worms on the NDS seat stay, he asked "what's that spot?" I pushed on it and became instantly ILL... Stage IV carcinoma!




The NDS stay can be replaced but what about the other side? Then the chains stays??? and the cost to replace the 753 stays and so on...

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Old 11-08-21, 05:59 PM
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Very nice! Is the crankset an early version with the raised lip around the pedal eye?
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Old 10-20-22, 07:12 PM
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thought I'd show an update on the bianchi, its still a work in progress,, but it looks a little better


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