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New Carlton in the house

Old 12-08-21, 05:43 PM
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52telecaster
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New Carlton in the house

Raleigh international to be exact. This thing is rough but in the 22.5" size it will fit me with proper adjustment. I usually ride a 23 and can deal with this. It appears to be a 1971 and I did get the seatpost and stem out!!! Also everything except the seat is stock including the campy seatpost. Gonna be a lot of derusting and I'll need some frame blocks for the top tube but it's still real cool.


Lots of campy

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Old 12-08-21, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by 52telecaster View Post
Raleigh international to be exact. This thing is rough but in the 22.5" size it will fit me with proper adjustment. I usually ride a 23 and can deal with this. It appears to be a 1971 and I did get the seatpost and stem out!!! Also everything except the seat is stock in clouding the campy seatpost. Gonna be a lot of derusting and I'll need some frame blocks for the top tube but it's still real cool.


Lots of campy
...plus the top tube dent came free! That ones a nice little battle scare from bike leaning maybe...
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Old 12-08-21, 06:04 PM
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there were a couple steps in the evolution of the International, I've had a bike like this with the "oval" decal and wonderful champagne color in my shop, I was impressed at what a nice bike it was, really a level of finish filing and detail that were not present on the later ones. nice find.

/markp
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Old 12-08-21, 07:30 PM
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Beautiful bike, Should be an awesome build! This model is Iconic!

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Old 12-08-21, 08:11 PM
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cool!

I had a brown '71 International about 10 years ago. Nice bike, and I sorta miss it.

So where did you find yours? Or how did you get it? If someone in the area is getting rid of their old steel, maybe I should give them a call.

just in case someone doesn't know, I've got a lovely '74 copper International, so I'm not complaining at all! Maybe we'll have to start the first annual Illinois International ride next summer??

Steve, in Peoria, of course
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Old 12-08-21, 08:23 PM
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Great score, you should enjoy the fantastic ride quality. My 1974 International is one I truly regret letting go.

Please keep us updated on how it goes.

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Old 12-08-21, 09:20 PM
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Originally Posted by steelbikeguy View Post
cool!

I had a brown '71 International about 10 years ago. Nice bike, and I sorta miss it.

So where did you find yours? Or how did you get it? If someone in the area is getting rid of their old steel, maybe I should give them a call.

just in case someone doesn't know, I've got a lovely '74 copper International, so I'm not complaining at all! Maybe we'll have to start the first annual Illinois International ride next summer??

Steve, in Peoria, of course
It was a FB marketplace find. Had to drive to Chicago.
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Old 12-08-21, 09:35 PM
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Also love the classic Blackburn work stand, works well with vintage steel.
Tim
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Old 12-09-21, 04:56 AM
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I don't like that dent. Top-tubes are loaded (mainly) in compression; the crease is favourably aligned to initiate a buckle. And it's big. It's big enough that you should take a straightedge and check the tube.

Get some frame blocks and fix it. They're not expensive, it's a simple job that goes slowly and it's pretty hard to make things worse even if it's your first time.

However, if you do it yourself the paint should come off down to bare shiny steel, if you leave paint on it will be torn up anyway, but that's not the problem with leaving paint on. The problem is that the blocks work by having the high spots of the steel surface slide inside the block as they compress downwards, with paint on they stick. Shiny and loads of grease.
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Old 12-09-21, 06:51 AM
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Originally Posted by oneclick View Post
I don't like that dent. Top-tubes are loaded (mainly) in compression; the crease is favourably aligned to initiate a buckle. And it's big. It's big enough that you should take a straightedge and check the tube.

Get some frame blocks and fix it. They're not expensive, it's a simple job that goes slowly and it's pretty hard to make things worse even if it's your first time.

However, if you do it yourself the paint should come off down to bare shiny steel, if you leave paint on it will be torn up anyway, but that's not the problem with leaving paint on. The problem is that the blocks work by having the high spots of the steel surface slide inside the block as they compress downwards, with paint on they stick. Shiny and loads of grease.
I will get frame blocks before this gets too far along. I think the dent and the rust are the reasons I could afford this frameset. I like patina but I do have limits.
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Old 12-09-21, 07:57 AM
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I'm sure this is a valuable seatpost and all but what a pain in the ass.
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Old 12-09-21, 08:12 AM
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After reading about it a bit I guess I'm lucky to have the seatpost. Amazing what I learn with old bikes.
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Old 12-09-21, 08:21 AM
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All looks redeemable to me.
the top tube dent is sharp but should work out enough. Paint will suffer, some Vaseline to reduce the friction- there are wood and aluminum blocks.
I would consider hardwood blocks first.

rims look the original Weinmann
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Old 12-09-21, 08:30 AM
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Originally Posted by repechage View Post
All looks redeemable to me.
the top tube dent is sharp but should work out enough. Paint will suffer, some Vaseline to reduce the friction- there are wood and aluminum blocks.
I would consider hardwood blocks first.

rims look the original Weinmann
They are original with campy hubs. I will probably build clincher 700c and keep these for posterity. If I ever organized and sold my posterity stuff I could fund something really fun.
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Old 12-09-21, 08:36 AM
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Originally Posted by 52telecaster View Post

I'm sure this is a valuable seatpost and all but what a pain in the ass.
I've seen way worse. That will clean up nicely.
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Old 12-09-21, 08:58 AM
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Congrats on a GREAT find.

As others have said....that will clean up nicely

I have done many clean -ups and I LOVE how Evaporust works . Can be a little pricey but it works GREAT for removing rust !!

Good Luck and be patient ( very hard to do when excitement of a new find )
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Old 12-09-21, 09:39 AM
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Great project! A bunch of years ago I bought a particularly tatty '71 Int'l frameset and built it up in multiple ways, including as a commuter with front basket:



After many years of hard miles, I sent it to the frame butcher of Portland, OR, for some mods:

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Old 12-09-21, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by nlerner View Post
Great project! A bunch of years ago I bought a particularly tatty '71 Int'l frameset and built it up in multiple ways, including as a commuter with front basket:



After many years of hard miles, I sent it to the frame butcher of Portland, OR, for some mods:

That is beautiful 😍
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Old 12-09-21, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by oneclick View Post
I don't like that dent. Top-tubes are loaded (mainly) in compression; the crease is favourably aligned to initiate a buckle. And it's big. It's big enough that you should take a straightedge and check the tube.

Get some frame blocks and fix it. They're not expensive, it's a simple job that goes slowly and it's pretty hard to make things worse even if it's your first time.

However, if you do it yourself the paint should come off down to bare shiny steel, if you leave paint on it will be torn up anyway, but that's not the problem with leaving paint on. The problem is that the blocks work by having the high spots of the steel surface slide inside the block as they compress downwards, with paint on they stick. Shiny and loads of grease.
I don't like the dent either, but your worry is highly overstated. I get a lot of frame repairs at the Atelier, but have never seen a dent on a top tube cause the frame to buckle. It will misalign the frame a bit, but typically not significantly more than the misalignment out of the factory on a production Raleigh of this vintage.

I'd fix it for cosmetic reasons, but I'd be ok with riding as is.

Your method on rolling out the dent area is spot on. I'd go a bit further and after rolling it out as best as possible, use some JB Weld to fill it - carefully file and sand off the excess. I use JB weld as most of my modded/repaired frames get powder coated, and it will hold up to the heat used in that process.
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Old 12-09-21, 11:26 AM
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Interesting that JB weld will take the heat.
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Old 12-09-21, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by gugie View Post
I don't like the dent either, but your worry is highly overstated. I get a lot of frame repairs at the Atelier, but have never seen a dent on a top tube cause the frame to buckle. It will misalign the frame a bit, but typically not significantly more than the misalignment out of the factory on a production Raleigh of this vintage.

I'd fix it for cosmetic reasons, but I'd be ok with riding as is.

Your method on rolling out the dent area is spot on. I'd go a bit further and after rolling it out as best as possible, use some JB Weld to fill it - carefully file and sand off the excess. I use JB weld as most of my modded/repaired frames get powder coated, and it will hold up to the heat used in that process.
I've ordered the block and picked up jb weld as well. My plan is to try and paint the area reasonably close to the rest of the frame after rust treatment. I want to keep as much original finish as I can even though I will probably completely change the drive train.
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Old 12-09-21, 12:18 PM
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Originally Posted by 52telecaster View Post
They are original with campy hubs. I will probably build clincher 700c and keep these for posterity. If I ever organized and sold my posterity stuff I could fund something really fun.
the world is going clincher...
These bikes came with all manner of spoke type, my bike has zinc plated, some were chrome, and others stainless.
If they are not dented, those rims do have a following.
They are wider than many, so accept a cyclocross width tire readily.
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Old 12-10-21, 04:27 PM
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Originally Posted by repechage View Post
Interesting that JB weld will take the heat.
I've used it many times for this exact same application with powder coat after. Powder coating is done at a temperature between 350-400F for 10-20 minutes

From jbweld.com/faqs:
"Original J-B Weld can withstand a constant temperature of 500 F. The maximum temperature threshold is approximately 600 F for a short term (10 minutes)."
There are formulations of JB weld that will withstand even higher temps, but this is the common one that most use, and it works.

I've used several different powder coaters, only one of them told me they didn't like JB Weld as they've had it outgas and bubble up on a few jobs. My guess is that the JB Weld either needed more cure time or there was some trapped air in the application.


@nlerner's Raleigh International (same as the OP's!) with what appears to be the same exact dent, same position.


Frame blocks per the method @oneclick mentioned earlier. Grease the blocks beforehand to make it easier. This removes most of the dent and rounds the tube (dents ovalize the tube in the ares not indented)

Result after JB Weld, careful sanding, and powder coat.
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Old 12-10-21, 04:58 PM
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Originally Posted by gugie View Post
I've used it many times for this exact same application with powder coat after. Powder coating is done at a temperature between 350-400F for 10-20 minutes

From jbweld.com/faqs:
"Original J-B Weld can withstand a constant temperature of 500 F. The maximum temperature threshold is approximately 600 F for a short term (10 minutes)."
There are formulations of JB weld that will withstand even higher temps, but this is the common one that most use, and it works.

I've used several different powder coaters, only one of them told me they didn't like JB Weld as they've had it outgas and bubble up on a few jobs. My guess is that the JB Weld either needed more cure time or there was some trapped air in the application.


@nlerner's Raleigh International (same as the OP's!) with what appears to be the same exact dent, same position.


Frame blocks per the method @oneclick mentioned earlier. Grease the blocks before hand to make it easier. This removes most of the dent and rounds the tube (dents ovalize the tube in the ares not indented)

Result after JB Weld, careful sanding, and powder coat.
Block is on order and my son and I are going to go together to derust a couple of frames.
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