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Is this a real De Rosa?

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Is this a real De Rosa?

Old 12-13-21, 07:49 PM
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Is this a real De Rosa?

Here is a link to an ebay listing for a De Rosa track bike. Seller in Australia must be confident in what he's got because he's asking over $4000 for it. Here's what I see:
1) The seat stays are rounded. Every De Rosa bike I have seen have flat tips by the seat cluster. From about 1970 on they would be stamped with De Rosa or sometime in the mid 70's stamped with a heart.
2) Seller includes a picture of the bottom bracket shell. Here it is stamped DE ROSA and again, I've never seen "DE ROSA" stamped on the bottom shell. In the 70's they all had cutouts - sometimes slots, sometimes hearts.
3) Also evident in the bottomshell photo, there is no chainstay bridge at all - none. Never seen a bridgeless frame before - and on a track bike where stiff and strong is key?
What do you guys think? The seller has no idea what he has because he originally listed it as a 1980's bike but its got 1970s stickers. I don't think its a De Rosa at all.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/33424431565...oAAOSwb4RhraO-
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Old 12-13-21, 07:53 PM
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Old 12-13-21, 08:08 PM
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Thanks for posting the pics Bill! The chainstays look odd to me too. Could be a custom build? Waiting to hear from the experts.
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Old 12-13-21, 08:17 PM
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Man if that's not a De Rosa it would have fooled me. But I'm no expert. However, a quick google search found a De Rosa pista with no chainstay bridge, so that part may not be relevant, The fork crown and chainstays with no engraving is odd though for sure.
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Old 12-13-21, 08:58 PM
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I'm guessing, but I would say not a De Rosa. I'm not that familiar with pistas, but too many anomalies on that frame for me.
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Old 12-13-21, 09:27 PM
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Old 12-13-21, 09:30 PM
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Looks like Campy Omega 20 rims. Tubular road rim FWIW.

Totally different animal but would this titanium Merckx CX from the same seller be worth consideration?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/33424412890...oAAOSwFjJgYpWy

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Old 12-13-21, 09:55 PM
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It is a 90ies De Rosa Pista made to look like a 70ies bike. The (non) seatstay caps are typical for Primato era De Rosa Pista and the bottom bracket shell I believe have been altered to look older. There are still some reinforcement tangs left - but others seem too have been made much smaller by some means.

Here is the BB shell unaltered:
https://www.worthpoint.com/worthoped...teel-131049280

Plenty of examples of unmarked De Rosa Pista front forks out there.

I believe someone tried to "make it older".

Last edited by styggno1; 12-13-21 at 09:59 PM.
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Old 12-13-21, 11:13 PM
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Post 1979 DeRosa ???

Originally Posted by Biketiger View Post
Here is a link to an ebay listing for a De Rosa track bike. Seller in Australia must be confident in what he's got because he's asking over $4000 for it. Here's what I see:
1) The seat stays are rounded. Every De Rosa bike I have seen have flat tips by the seat cluster. From about 1970 on they would be stamped with De Rosa or sometime in the mid 70's stamped with a heart.
2) Seller includes a picture of the bottom bracket shell. Here it is stamped DE ROSA and again, I've never seen "DE ROSA" stamped on the bottom shell. In the 70's they all had cutouts - sometimes slots, sometimes hearts.
3) Also evident in the bottomshell photo, there is no chainstay bridge at all - none. Never seen a bridgeless frame before - and on a track bike where stiff and strong is key?
What do you guys think? The seller has no idea what he has because he originally listed it as a 1980's bike but its got 1970s stickers. I don't think its a De Rosa at all.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/33424431565...oAAOSwb4RhraO-
DeRosa used stamped Nervex Dubois Ref 32 lugs without the reinforcement rings around the top and bottom of the head tube portion. In 1979 they switched to cast lugs.





Cast seat lug on my early 80's DeRosa...



Cast head tube lugs...



Page from the 1984 DeRosa catalog showing the cast lugs..



styggno1 nailed it on the BB shell...



The one "Tell" on DeRosa frames are the diamond shaped chain stays...



I can't speak to the fast back style seat stay tops??? They could have been replaced and that style is one of the easiest way to attach the stays?

Someone has gone to great lengths to make this frame look older than it is???



"Just one more thing..."

The right side of the BB shell appears to have been hammered on. That was an old trick to fix a problem when the threads were oversize. Pound it down and re-thread it!


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Old 12-13-21, 11:50 PM
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This one has a serial number in the BB shell. I thought De Rosa did not do serial numbers. I know I never found one on my 1986 road frame, but that is not definitive.
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Old 12-14-21, 04:20 AM
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How has nobody mentioned the price yet? RUN AWAY.

No way is that bike anywhere worth spending that kind of cash on. DREAMIN!!!
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Old 12-14-21, 06:50 AM
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Originally Posted by verktyg View Post
The one "Tell" on DeRosa frames are the diamond shaped chain stays...


verktyg
My understanding is the "Diamante" CS were no longer used, at least on road bikes, after about 1987.
I have a Professional with estimated 1988 time that does not have the "Diamante" stays.
See Help me build a 1990 De Rosa Pro - Page 4 - Bike Forums Bike Forums - View Single Post - Help me build a 1990 De Rosa Pro

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Old 12-14-21, 07:36 AM
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I don't know enough about DeRosas to say if that pista is legit. But I do know that a number of things that people have concerns about are typical of some DeRosa models.

Originally Posted by Biketiger View Post
1) The seat stays are rounded. Every De Rosa bike I have seen have flat tips by the seat cluster. From about 1970 on they would be stamped with De Rosa or sometime in the mid 70's stamped with a heart.
2) Seller includes a picture of the bottom bracket shell. Here it is stamped DE ROSA and again, I've never seen "DE ROSA" stamped on the bottom shell.
The seatstay ends are not unusual. There are a number of different models with them here - https://www.flickr.com/photos/qogwarp/with/4937274908/

That BB doesn't look unusual to me either.
Originally Posted by SJX426 View Post
My understanding is the "Diamante" CS were no longer used, at least on road bikes, after about 1987.
They may have stopped building with Diamante stays for a short time, but there were definitely a lot of DeRosa frames built after 1987 with those stays. You can find plenty of examples if you do a search for pics of DeRosa Giro d'Italia, Primato or Neo-Primato.

Here's a Primato for sale. It has the rounded seatstay caps, engraved BB, Diamante stays and a serial number. https://cicli-berlinetta.com/product...-blue-55-5-cm/
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Old 12-14-21, 07:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Choke View Post
I don't know enough about DeRosas to say if that pista is legit. But I do know that a number of things that people have concerns about are typical of some DeRosa models.

The seatstay ends are not unusual. There are a number of different models with them here - https://www.flickr.com/photos/qogwarp/with/4937274908/

That BB doesn't look unusual to me either.
They may have stopped building with Diamante stays for a short time, but there were definitely a lot of DeRosa frames built after 1987 with those stays. You can find plenty of examples if you do a search for pics of DeRosa Giro d'Italia, Primato or Neo-Primato.

Here's a Primato for sale. It has the rounded seatstay caps, engraved BB, Diamante stays and a serial number. https://cicli-berlinetta.com/product...-blue-55-5-cm/
Yep for sure, the two 90's area De Rosa's I've had/have both had the Diamante stays.
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Old 12-14-21, 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Biketiger View Post
Never seen a bridgeless frame before
Gitane Defi.
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Old 12-14-21, 08:50 AM
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@Choke and @jamesdak - Good info. I suspected there was not a definitive cut off. @Biketiger - Pinarello Montello does not have a chain stay bridge, one of its characteristic's.
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Old 12-14-21, 09:55 AM
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I have a '75 pista De Rosa, it's fork came unbranded and was chrome. Other than chrome looks the same as the painted in the picture. The bb shell is different than the posted bike.
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Old 12-14-21, 10:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Mr. 66 View Post
I have a '75 pista De Rosa, it's fork came unbranded and was chrome. Other than chrome looks the same as the painted in the picture. The bb shell is different than the posted bike.
Never saw that seat stay top termination in the 70's.
On a EL-SO Primato... but that was decades later.
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Old 12-14-21, 07:37 PM
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Thanks to all for your helpful and knowledgeable responses.
I learned a lot. The bike in question appears to have Diamante stays and De Rosa used them in the 1990s.
There are examples of De Rosa frames without chainstay bridges.
In fact, there are many examples of steel frames without them.
The bottom bracket stamp with DE ROSA was also used in the 90s. I'm with the others who said this bike is probably a Primato with 70s decals. Whatever it is, this was a learning experience for me!
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Old 12-15-21, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by SJX426 View Post
My understanding is the "Diamante" CS were no longer used, at least on road bikes, after about 1987.
I have a Professional with estimated 1988 time that does not have the "Diamante" stays.
See Help me build a 1990 De Rosa Pro - Page 4 - Bike Forums Bike Forums - View Single Post - Help me build a 1990 De Rosa Pro

P1030447 on Flickr
Not true at all.
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