Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

Drivetrain swapping?

Notices
Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

Drivetrain swapping?

Old 01-15-22, 12:02 PM
  #1  
densolo
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2021
Location: Newmarket, ON
Posts: 28

Bikes: Miyata 710, Motobecane Riviera, Motobecane Nomade, Miele Mercury

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Drivetrain swapping?

Is drivetrain swapping a possibility?


What I mean by that is, swapping a french threaded freewheel (and drivetrain) with an english threaded freewheel (and drivetrain)?


Why would I want to do that?


I've got an extra rear wheel with an english threaded hub (which is different than the original french threaded hub/freewheel). But I have a Sunrace freewheel that I can use instead. So I figure I'm half way there to have a swappable drivetrain.


But I'm not sure (hence my question). The thing is, I've read that because of wear, the chain should be swapped with the freewheel. My question is, does that also apply to the chainrings? Lastly, is there anything in the bottom bracket that would prevent me from swapping in (and out) the drivetrain? Or is it a bad idea?


Thanks
densolo is offline  
Old 01-15-22, 12:08 PM
  #2  
Bianchigirll 
Bianchi Goddess
 
Bianchigirll's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Shady Pines Retirement Fort Wayne, In
Posts: 28,318

Bikes: Too many to list here check my signature.

Mentioned: 154 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2321 Post(s)
Liked 1,348 Times in 805 Posts
I'm no expert but I don't think you can do that
__________________
One morning you wake up, the girl is gone, the bikes are gone, all that's left behind is a pair of old tires and a tube of tubular glue, all squeezed out"

Sugar "Kane" Kowalczyk
Bianchigirll is offline  
Old 01-15-22, 12:34 PM
  #3  
densolo
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2021
Location: Newmarket, ON
Posts: 28

Bikes: Miyata 710, Motobecane Riviera, Motobecane Nomade, Miele Mercury

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by Bianchigirll View Post
I'm no expert but I don't think you can do that
I figure the answer was no (why hasn't anyone tried it before?) as well, but I thought I'd ask. I've never seen it written anywhere.

But theoretically, if I leave the fixed cup, adjustable cup in the BB, and the spindle doesn't change, and I change the chainrings, chain and freewheel, then along with my wheels I can swap out the entire drivetrain.
I just figure if I can do it, I can extend the useful life of the bike (french parts will become harder to come by).

Thanks
densolo is offline  
Old 01-15-22, 01:58 PM
  #4  
Moe Zhoost
Half way there
 
Moe Zhoost's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 2,649

Bikes: Many, and the list changes frequently

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 880 Post(s)
Liked 678 Times in 409 Posts
French freewheel threading is not compatible with English. You can mount an English freewheel on an Italian threaded hub, but not the other way around (well, maybe you could but it may be a loose fit). If all you are doing is swapping wheels around, your bottom bracket is not a factor. Replacing chain and chainrings when you change the freewheel? I would say that this is neither mandatory nor even recommended. It all depends on wear. If you've maintained your chain well and replaced when stretched, you should be ok with the other components.
Moe Zhoost is offline  
Likes For Moe Zhoost:
Old 01-15-22, 02:02 PM
  #5  
dedhed
SE Wis
 
dedhed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 8,839

Bikes: '68 Raleigh Sprite, '02 Raleigh C500, '84 Raleigh Gran Prix, '91 Trek 400, 2013 Novara Randonee, 1990 Trek 970

Mentioned: 32 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2056 Post(s)
Liked 2,000 Times in 1,244 Posts
Originally Posted by densolo View Post
Is drivetrain swapping a possibility?


What I mean by that is, swapping a french threaded freewheel (and drivetrain) with an english threaded freewheel (and drivetrain)? Not on the same wheel.


I've got an extra rear wheel with an english threaded hub (which is different than the original french threaded hub/freewheel). But I have a Sunrace freewheel that I can use instead. So I figure I'm half way there to have a swappable drivetrain. IF the extra wheel is english threaded and the Sunrace is english threaded you're fine.


But I'm not sure (hence my question). The thing is, I've read that because of wear, the chain should be swapped with the freewheel. Depends on the age and miles on the chain. My question is, does that also apply to the chainrings? "In General" chainrings wear less than rear cogs as they spread the load over more teeth. Lastly, is there anything in the bottom bracket that would prevent me from swapping in (and out) the drivetrain? That depends on what you are considering as "drive train". Or is it a bad idea?
You really need to define what you mean by " drive train". It sounds like you have a second English threaded hub wheel and freewheel to "replace" the French ones completely. Swapping in the second wheel isn't an issue if it's the same size. Might need to dial in the brakes a bit and check derailleur limit screws. They both use the same 3/32 chain so the crank/derailleurs don't care what wheel/freewheel they're driving. There are some changes once you get to 9 speed related to the width of the chain, but the pitch doesn't change. Now if you want to start swapping cranks you open up a whole nother set of questions

See also above.


Maillard french-threaded freewheels - South Salem Cycleworks
dedhed is offline  
Likes For dedhed:
Old 01-15-22, 02:11 PM
  #6  
JohnDThompson 
Old fart
 
JohnDThompson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Appleton WI
Posts: 23,428

Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.

Mentioned: 135 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2921 Post(s)
Liked 1,875 Times in 1,136 Posts
You can replace your metric thread hub and freewheel with an English thread hub and freewheel. Some derailleur adjustment is likely as the chainline could be subtly different. If the replacement freewheel is new, a new chain is advisable to avoid problems. If it is worn similarly to the original freewheel, you may be able to use the current chain. You have nothing to lose by trying it; if it skips on the small sprockets, replace it. Chainrings spread the wear over far more teeth than freewheel sprockets and seldom present a problem. Nothing in the bottom bracket is likely to be relevant.
JohnDThompson is offline  
Likes For JohnDThompson:
Old 01-15-22, 02:29 PM
  #7  
SurferRosa
Señor Member
 
SurferRosa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Pac NW
Posts: 5,535

Bikes: Old school lightweights

Mentioned: 71 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2294 Post(s)
Liked 2,947 Times in 1,604 Posts
Wording in the op is overly complicated. The main issue here is that French and standard/english threading are not compatible.
SurferRosa is offline  
Old 01-15-22, 02:52 PM
  #8  
densolo
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2021
Location: Newmarket, ON
Posts: 28

Bikes: Miyata 710, Motobecane Riviera, Motobecane Nomade, Miele Mercury

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by dedhed View Post
You really need to define what you mean by " drive train". It sounds like you have a second English threaded hub wheel and freewheel to "replace" the French ones completely. Swapping in the second wheel isn't an issue if it's the same size. Might need to dial in the brakes a bit and check derailleur limit screws. They both use the same 3/32 chain so the crank/derailleurs don't care what wheel/freewheel they're driving. There are some changes once you get to 9 speed related to the width of the chain, but the pitch doesn't change. Now if you want to start swapping cranks you open up a whole nother set of questions

See also above.


Maillard french-threaded freewheels - South Salem Cycleworks
Awesome. I think you answered my question! So it is possible.

By drivetrain, I mean the chainwheel (Dancing Chain uses this term instead of chainring, sorry), plus chain plus freewheel. So the idea of swapping is to remove the french threaded freewheel vs english threaded freewheel problem.
I just wanted to ask whether the chainwheel has any affect in my proposal. And your answer is no. And also, your comment about the chain is helpful as well, i.e. I can use a standard chain (for 5sp.) and it would work interchangeably (between my original french-threaded freewheel and substitute english-threaded freewheel).

So that means I can just swap the rear wheel and it might just work out!

Thanks
densolo is offline  
Old 01-15-22, 03:21 PM
  #9  
Random Tandem
Old Bike Craphound
 
Random Tandem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Posts: 194

Bikes: 1974 Teledyne Titan, 1970's Sekine, 1980's Kuwahara Tandem, plus a few dozen

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 59 Post(s)
Liked 48 Times in 27 Posts
Drive train swapping

I would not hesitate to go ahead with your plan, but I think I would stick with your idea of using a different chain with each wheel/freewheel set, even though they are the same size chains. My hesitation to using the same chain is that I would not want to have to replace the French freewheel any sooner than necessary (as they are difficult for me to obtain replacements YMMV). It means you are going to have to split the chain every time you swap the wheels, which is a hassle, or worse. I would not have any concern with using the same chainrings for both chains, as so many more teeth are engaged (so wear is slower and I rarely encounter problems with differing wear), and replacing chainrings is just one of those things we do. I suppose if it were me, I would expect that I would eventually mainly ride the non-french set, and keep the french set for “special occasions”.

I think this is not different in principle from people who back in the day had a lighter set of racing wheels for days when they want to go really fast, except you will have a special set for when you want to go really french! (I did not add any photos of “really french” as they may not meet with community standards.)

-Will
Random Tandem is offline  
Likes For Random Tandem:
Old 01-15-22, 06:40 PM
  #10  
dedhed
SE Wis
 
dedhed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 8,839

Bikes: '68 Raleigh Sprite, '02 Raleigh C500, '84 Raleigh Gran Prix, '91 Trek 400, 2013 Novara Randonee, 1990 Trek 970

Mentioned: 32 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2056 Post(s)
Liked 2,000 Times in 1,244 Posts
Originally Posted by Random Tandem View Post
I would not hesitate to go ahead with your plan, but I think I would stick with your idea of using a different chain with each wheel/freewheel set, even though they are the same size chains. My hesitation to using the same chain is that I would not want to have to replace the French freewheel any sooner than necessary (as they are difficult for me to obtain replacements YMMV). It means you are going to have to split the chain every time you swap the wheels, which is a hassle, or worse.
You buy a couple $10 6/7/8 speed chains with quick links and it's not a big deal.
dedhed is offline  
Likes For dedhed:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.