Help identify this frame
 

Bought this just because I needed some parts that were on it and as I was the only bidder....never the less. it looks a descent frameset, so before part with it, I'd like to know what it actually is. Japanese? American? British/ Italian perhaps?

FRAME - Champion No.1 sticker, could be false as had respray (red colour originally). Serial number on bottom bracket 4592. Rear dropouts Tange TR. Seatpost 27.2mm BSA threads. Weight (size 57) with headset cups is 1900 grams
FORKS - Champion sticker. Tange TF-R dropouts. Tange Made in Japan 2H on steerer. Weight 720 grams.

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...0d5fa13319.jpg
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...dd9162a804.jpg
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...bab57d8dcf.jpg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1f4aa7e8d1.jpg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...5981f71f4a.jpg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...d37e07e0f2.jpg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...74bc82200a.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...80c6409253.jpg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...4dc6d82896.jpg

with the Tange fork and Tange (TR) DOs I bet this is in fact a Tange-tubed Japanese frame. Those headlugs look like Prugnats but I think they are the ones with the "points" in the front-most sockets that are very possibly Tange-made model 1818/1838 lugs. The fork is clearly marked as a Tange product and the crown MIGHT be a C-22 model.
Are you certain the 4-digit serial number is complete or could paint be hiding additional numbers?

Welcome to the ‘looks like a nice quality frame but I have no idea cub”


https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...3cd8e490f.jpeg
I acquired this at the Trexlertown swap meet in 2012. I’m still not certain if I lost out on the deal trading a cool suicide front shifter for it. It is a good looking frame and rides nice.

I had a Nishiki Medalist that looked a lot like your frame. Same lugs, seat stay caps and drop outs. Best guess is it is a nicely made Japanese frame from the golden era of Japanese frame building.

Will check tonight, I doubt, but there is possibility that under that paint something can be found :)

nice, like those large flanges

great large flanges, can't agree more with kekec1965

Hi, rubbed the bb and the full number is 04892, what looks like stamped stronger to the right hand side as 0 is really faint, so thanks for the suggestion.

Since I'm so bad with serial numbers, and we have a World Class expert in our ranks...let's send up the Bat Signal for T-Mar I bet he can nail this one.

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FWIW here is a Tange catalogue page showing their replica of the Prugnat model 62/d lug set:

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...0de6ab864.jpeg

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we have not as yet heard from T-Mar on this inquiry - he is sure to have some helpful information...

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This may not be of much help to Kekec1965 at this point (considering this thread started over a year ago and the frame is probably long gone by now), so this is going to be just for reference.

I think this frame was most likely originally badged as Barry Hoban (British Eagle). They had two nicer models - Campanissimo (Reynolds 531/501) and Primavera (Tange 1). Aside from the tubing, the two models also used different seat stay caps, dropouts and fork crowns. The mystery frame here is definitely a Primavera.

There were some slight differences between Primaveras (like the choice of lugs (two Prugnat styles) and number of water bottle bosses) but I'm not sure those were changes from year to year or was the result of a 'use what's available at the time' type of approach.


Ad (late 1986) showing the two models:

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...cf5d6f6d85.jpg


Tange TR dropouts and the same stay end treatment were used on Primaveras:

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...fb10be47f2.jpg


Head lugs, fork crown:

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...7bc514749b.jpg

This one shows the seat stay caps and brake bridge (this frame is definitely repainted and the fork might be a replacement, too):

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...9d79e7861c.jpg



A couple more. I'm still not sure if that red fork was a later respray or not:


https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2d0a315181.jpg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...bfceaf64de.jpg

Day-um! we are so lucky to have MauriceMoss in the house!
:thumb:

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thanks so much MauriceMoss for another outstanding detection! :beer:

was the Harry Hoban marque connected with/derived from Ernie Clements?

IIRC read somewhere that the Newtown operation closed in the mid-eighties after only being going for a relatively short period


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The only thing I've read online (so take with a grain of salt) is that after Ernie Clements got the Welsh government to invest/build a factory in Newtown (there were apparently skilled workers there from an old Phillips factory), he ran it for only a few years before running into financial trouble by the early-mid 80s. He then got Barry Hoban to take over in the mid 80s, after which point they started producing pretty decent frames (like the two I mentioned above) and a very popular British Eagle badged 'Touristique'. There was also a Triathlon model that must have been relatively popular, as you can see those for sale on gumtree pretty regularly. By 1990 though, the business was sold to the Townsend group, who also bought up the Falcon, Claud Butler and Dawes labels.

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Grazie Mille Don Professore Maurizio! :thumb:


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