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When you want to use Campy but you're a tad weak...

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When you want to use Campy but you're a tad weak...

Old 07-18-22, 07:16 PM
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52telecaster
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When you want to use Campy but you're a tad weak...


24-42-45
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Old 07-18-22, 07:56 PM
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Ok, that is neat as heck. I think I know how this connects the big to the small. I'll let you reveal what it is whenever you would like. You got my interest.

I see you have been exploring triples @52telecaster and coming up with wicked good things.

I'm already anticipating the gearing on this. It look like a half step plus granny. Brilliant again. And the nice thing is that the 42 is no problem to find.
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Old 07-18-22, 08:19 PM
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You don't need to be a tad weak to know that a quality cold forged 110/74 bcd crank beats the heck out of 144/whatever bcd your campy has any day of the week . . .



That said, the design on this looks interesting and it's a good way to repurpose all those campy cranks you may have stashed away somewhere . . .
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Old 07-18-22, 08:50 PM
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Red clover triplizer with a 45 on the outside. This gives a 7+% half step which works nice with a 13-15-17-21-24-28 freewheel. I wish the 21 was a 20 but it's close enough to turn a grand record into touring bike territory.
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Old 07-18-22, 08:57 PM
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Work smarter, not harder.
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Old 07-18-22, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by nomadmax View Post
Work smarter, not harder.
​​​​​​Man I hated when my boss would say that. When u did actually work smarter he never understood it.
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Old 07-18-22, 09:31 PM
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Nice job @52telecaster . 17 perfectly good gear ratios staying within a simple shift pattern.

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Old 07-18-22, 10:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Velo Mule View Post
Nice job @52telecaster . 17 perfectly good gear ratios staying within a simple shift pattern.

Notice how that 21 makes it dip? I'm sure I can't feel that but I know it's there!
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Old 07-19-22, 12:06 AM
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That is a Red Clover triplizer, is it not?
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Old 07-19-22, 02:41 AM
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Nice work. Could you show the back side with the chainring bolts in place on the granny? Did you have to get a longer / wider spindle and what length? How much clearance to the chain stay?
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Old 07-19-22, 05:29 AM
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Very cool. I did something very similar with the Stronglight 93 on my PX-10. 45-42-30, with a 13-28 7sp freewheel. My first 'half-step + granny' setup, and I really like it. How does the Cyclone FD handle getting from the granny to the middle ring? The SLJ double FD on mine can do it, but it isn't always exactly smooth- I often end up over-shifting up onto the big ring then dropping it back down...
I've got a Holdsworth to build up with a Cyclone set and Campy crank, so it's very good to see a 45t 'inner' will work as the big ring (going to see if I can get away with 42/46 double and a 13-32 FW on it, but likely will end up triplizing eventually). Red Clover is great stuff, breathing new & useable life into old gear and saving aging knees at the same time!
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Old 07-19-22, 05:39 AM
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I LOVE Campy cranks but they are limited and pose a problem for a lot of us.The tripilizer is a solution but unless you have something like a Phil BB where you can set the crank out for the chain line, then you need a different spindle. I have a couple with the rare TA 41 small ring but that doesn't help that much, especially when the NR/SR rear derailleur only handles a 28 tooth low on the FW. I am going with a Sugino 110BCD crank for my touring bike and putting a Cyclone GT RD with a 32 tooth low FW . I have the parts so why not?

This was my "donor bike " I bought just for the wheels for my Raleigh Pro and now a source for getting low gearing on my touring bike
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Old 07-19-22, 06:05 AM
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Originally Posted by ehcoplex View Post
Very cool. I did something very similar with the Stronglight 93 on my PX-10. 45-42-30, with a 13-28 7sp freewheel. My first 'half-step + granny' setup, and I really like it. How does the Cyclone FD handle getting from the granny to the middle ring?
I triplized a Stronglight 93 as well, 48-42-28. Campagnolo Record (pre-CSPC) front derailleur handles it fine.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg
93-triple-1.jpg (57.1 KB, 271 views)
File Type: jpg
93-triple-2.jpg (65.8 KB, 272 views)
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Old 07-19-22, 06:05 AM
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Please tell me about the device you're using to keep the bars/front wheel straight.

Originally Posted by Kabuki12 View Post
I LOVE Campy cranks but they are limited and pose a problem for a lot of us.The tripilizer is a solution but unless you have something like a Phil BB where you can set the crank out for the chain line, then you need a different spindle. I have a couple with the rare TA 41 small ring but that doesn't help that much, especially when the NR/SR rear derailleur only handles a 28 tooth low on the FW. I am going with a Sugino 110BCD crank for my touring bike and putting a Cyclone GT RD with a 32 tooth low FW . I have the parts so why not?

This was my "donor bike " I bought just for the wheels for my Raleigh Pro and now a source for getting low gearing on my touring bike
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Old 07-19-22, 06:37 AM
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Originally Posted by 52telecaster View Post
Notice how that 21 makes it dip? I'm sure I can't feel that but I know it's there!
Yes, I set up the spreadsheet with formulas so that I could easily sub out the chainrings and with the 20 tooth chainring the line is perfectly smooth. With 21 it comes awfully close though.

A really nice progression from 20 to 93 gear inches with an off the shelf freewheel or cluster and the trick here being the Triplizer to get that small front chainring.
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Old 07-19-22, 06:44 AM
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Originally Posted by nomadmax View Post
Please tell me about the device you're using to keep the bars/front wheel straight.
That is made by Feedback Sports and I bought it at REI in Oxnard for $20 a few years ago . It works on just about any bike. I can turn the handle bars and lock it in any position. Joe
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Old 07-19-22, 06:55 AM
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Originally Posted by 52telecaster View Post
Red clover triplizer with a 45 on the outside. This gives a 7+% half step which works nice with a 13-15-17-21-24-28 freewheel. I wish the 21 was a 20 but it's close enough to turn a grand record into touring bike territory.
If your freewheel is a Suntour Perfect (not always marked as such), I have plenty of 20T sprockets I can provide. If it is something else, let me know the make and model and I'll do my best to assist.

BTW, the Red Clover 144BCD triplizer was modeled directly from the TA one I have installed on my 1971 Schwinn Super Sport. Jon borrowed it when he was developing his with his machine shop. So glad it is serving you well!

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Old 07-19-22, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Bad Lag View Post
That is a Red Clover triplizer, is it not?
It is!
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Old 07-19-22, 09:32 AM
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Originally Posted by mech986 View Post
Nice work. Could you show the back side with the chainring bolts in place on the granny? Did you have to get a longer / wider spindle and what length? How much clearance to the chain stay?
The stronglight that was on the bike had a long enough bb axle already. This one cheats a little toward the bike which is how I prefer it. I have a little space left. I thought I would need to change bb but got real lucky on this one.

Very tight clearance. But it clears.

I'm not averse to sanding the bolt heads but it wasn't necessary here.
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Old 07-19-22, 09:37 AM
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Originally Posted by ehcoplex View Post
Very cool. I did something very similar with the Stronglight 93 on my PX-10. 45-42-30, with a 13-28 7sp freewheel. My first 'half-step + granny' setup, and I really like it. How does the Cyclone FD handle getting from the granny to the middle ring? The SLJ double FD on mine can do it, but it isn't always exactly smooth- I often end up over-shifting up onto the big ring then dropping it back down...
I've got a Holdsworth to build up with a Cyclone set and Campy crank, so it's very good to see a 45t 'inner' will work as the big ring (going to see if I can get away with 42/46 double and a 13-32 FW on it, but likely will end up triplizing eventually). Red Clover is great stuff, breathing new & useable life into old gear and saving aging knees at the same time!
The cyclone is working great. I can over shift is coming from the 24 but you use the granny so rarely that I don't worry about it. My thing is just knowing I have the security of really low gears.
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Old 07-19-22, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Kabuki12 View Post
I LOVE Campy cranks but they are limited and pose a problem for a lot of us.The tripilizer is a solution but unless you have something like a Phil BB where you can set the crank out for the chain line, then you need a different spindle. I have a couple with the rare TA 41 small ring but that doesn't help that much, especially when the NR/SR rear derailleur only handles a 28 tooth low on the FW. I am going with a Sugino 110BCD crank for my touring bike and putting a Cyclone GT RD with a 32 tooth low FW . I have the parts so why not?

This was my "donor bike " I bought just for the wheels for my Raleigh Pro and now a source for getting low gearing on my touring bike
Why not indeed. Make the bike work for you! I use 110 bcd on my 720. It's a champ!
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Old 07-19-22, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by pastorbobnlnh View Post
If your freewheel is a Suntour Perfect (not always marked as such), I have plenty of 20T sprockets I can provide. If it is something else, let me know the make and model and I'll do my best to assist.

BTW, the Red Clover 144BCD triplizer was modeled directly from the TA one I have installed on my 1971 Schwinn Super Sport. Jon borrowed it when he was developing his with his machine shop. So glad it is serving you well!

Bob, that is an extremely generous offer but I will just ride as is now. My legs would probably benefit from a change in cadence now and then. I am so glad you got the triplizer thing going on 144. Weak old men everywhere ty!
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Old 07-19-22, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnDThompson View Post
I triplized a Stronglight 93 as well, 48-42-28. Campagnolo Record (pre-CSPC) front derailleur handles it fine.
Man that's beautiful.
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Old 07-19-22, 11:38 AM
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I bought at a bike swap a TA tripilizer with the intent of perhaps using it on a pretty 144 bcd Superbe I have. Turns out the TA is for an odd 135bcd Campy. I guess I will have to keep an eye out to purchase a bike using that crank to put it on. Good reason for a purchase.
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Old 07-19-22, 11:42 AM
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I screwed up. This has 20 usable gear ratios, not the 17 I posted above. Duh! I seemed to have left a few combinations out and the graph still looked good! Here is the correct one:



The nice thing about half step gearing like @52telecaster 's project is the even steps that allow fine tuning to conditions and and to make a bigger jump, you just need to shift the rear derailleur. I am hoping that the spreadsheet below illustrates the beauty of this system.



Compare this to a standard 13 - 28 rear cog with 42 - 52 chainrings:

You will notice that although there are 14 combinations available, there are some ratios that are so close to each other that we would consider then to be functionally the same. This standard gearing gives us 10 distinct ratios.


This is not bad, many of us use this or something similar. Both my Traveler and LeTour have this type of set up with a 5 speed freewheel. We get used to it and even me, the gearhead that I am, just learn to live with it.

Half-step gearing is what many touring cyclists use, you can see why.
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