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Scratching a more recent itch

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Scratching a more recent itch

Old 08-29-22, 12:42 PM
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Scratching a more recent itch

It's often stated that people on this forum seek out the bikes they wanted when they were teenagers but couldn't attain then. When I was a teenager I wasn't really aware of any bikes above the basic entry level stuff, and I didn't even know the names of those. I had "a bike" and all my friends had "bikes" and I was happy with that state of things. But that doesn't mean I'm unfamiliar with the feeling. The bike that really got me into collecting vintage bikes was a 1984 Pinarello Gran Turismo. It wasn't one I couldn't attain, exactly. I bought it. It just didn't fit me. I saw it. I had to have it. I spent a year in denial about the fact that it was too small for me. Finally, I sold it to @Andy Antipas who it does fit. But even as I did, I told myself that one day I'd find one in my size.

Here's the bike in question, fully demonstrating how much it didn't fit me.



A few years later, I bought a beautiful chrome Pinarello Montello, and you'd think that would settle things, but it didn't. It turns out, the color was a huge part of what I loved about the bike above and the chrome Montello just wasn't scratching that itch. Then last week, while I was on vacation, Charles Nighbor shared a Portland CL ad to the Facebook SiR group for a 57cm Pinarello Treviso that was the spitting image of my old love. I spent a few days worrying that someone would buy it before I got back. Then yesterday, despite being wiped out from travel, I swung over to SE Portland and brought this beauty home with me.



I know they all say "Treviso" on them, so I'm not entirely sure that's what this is. The 1985 catalog shows several models, including the Treviso, with chrome seat stay caps like this one. It doesn't show anything with both chain stays chrome (except the Montello, and this definitely isn't a Montello). Based on the lack of downtube palmarès decal, I think this might be a 1984 model.

@T-Mar -- you were able to identify the Gran Turismo. Do you happen to know which model this is?

More detail pics:

















It's possible the decals are reproductions -- they are intact after all. The components are all Super Record except for the wheels and saddle, which are unlikely to be original (Bernard Hinault Turbo saddle and Fiamme/Maillard wheels).
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Old 08-29-22, 01:38 PM
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That's pretty Andy. If I'd have known you were jonesing for a Pinarello, I would have flogged mine on you last year, but maybe I wouldn't have gotten traction with the shade of red. I sold it last summer. It has the same chrome chain stays and seat stay caps. I had decided at the time it was a Record and I seem to remember that it was considered an '85 but I forget why. Fork crown on mine was sloping, internally lugged. Mine was a repaint and incorrectly labelled SLX.
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Old 08-29-22, 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Spaghetti Legs View Post
That's pretty Andy. If I'd have known you were jonesing for a Pinarello, I would have flogged mine on you last year, but maybe I wouldn't have gotten traction with the shade of red.
Yeah, it definitely had to be this shade of red. It's been deeply ingrained in my psyche for some reason. I think Pinarello called it "Bordeaux" and I believe it's the same as Colnago's Saronni red. I've got a Performance Superbe in this color, and I like it but it still didn't quite satisfy the urge. A Colnago might have done it, but I'm super happy to have this Pinarello. Now I just need to find the right components. Any sane person would leave the Super Record build, but you know I like 3x10 Campy.
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Old 08-29-22, 02:54 PM
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Very Nice. A Super Record Racer is a must have. Not sure its a Pinarello as it CLEARLY says Pinarello on the DT.
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Old 08-29-22, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Classtime View Post
Not sure its a Pinarello as it CLEARLY says Pinarello on the DT.
Maybe they used a different supplier for their decals in 1984. Notice that the decals on the smaller bike were also still there.

Another detail they share that you can't see from these pictures is that the saving between letters on the seat tube changes to avoid putting a water bottle boss in the middle of a letter. On the smaller frame there was a bigger space between the L's. On the new one the bigger space is between the L and the O. This is kind of odd because in both cases the "Vincitrice" decal above the P overlaps the Columbus decal.
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Old 08-29-22, 03:39 PM
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This is very nice!
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Old 08-29-22, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
Yeah, it definitely had to be this shade of red. It's been deeply ingrained in my psyche for some reason. I think Pinarello called it "Bordeaux" and I believe it's the same as Colnago's Saronni red. I've got a Performance Superbe in this color, and I like it but it still didn't quite satisfy the urge. A Colnago might have done it, but I'm super happy to have this Pinarello. Now I just need to find the right components. Any sane person would leave the Super Record build, but you know I like 3x10 Campy.
Millions of shades of Red, it has to be the right one.

Saronni Red was the stock color I could have had that looked too light in the book so Black Magic found this and painted it without my approval, whatever, turned out great anyway and I have a pretty unusual color that gets plenty of love.

That is the Red I thought I wanted on the Strawberry until it ended up with Honda Basque Red.

My crappy photo skills can't capture it very well and it looks different in any light.





Last edited by merziac; 08-29-22 at 04:48 PM.
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Old 08-29-22, 03:46 PM
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I really like the metallic paint on this and agree that either the bike has repo decals, was stored indoors, not ridden much etc. In any event I hope that you don't have a question about color with this one....Celeste it's not, Candy yes, but which fruit, if you do I am sounding a Rabbit Hole Alert and I can't help........!
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OOP's I see its started...........
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Old 08-29-22, 04:17 PM
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Originally Posted by merziac View Post
Saronni Red was the stock color I could have had that looked too light in the book so Black Magic found this and painted it without my approval, whatever, turned out great anyway and I have a pretty unusual color that gets plenty of love.

That is the Red I thought I wanted on the Strawberry until it ended up with Honda Basque Red.
Something like that happened with my Stella. I wanted to keep the original color, which was a very red orange. It ended up more of a pure orange. I guess if you don't have a color code (and maybe even if you do) you never know how it's going to look until it's done.
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Old 08-29-22, 04:38 PM
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Pinarello

Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
It's often stated that people on this forum seek out the bikes they wanted when they were teenagers but couldn't attain then. When I was a teenager I wasn't really aware of any bikes above the basic entry level stuff, and I didn't even know the names of those. I had "a bike" and all my friends had "bikes" and I was happy with that state of things. But that doesn't mean I'm unfamiliar with the feeling. The bike that really got me into collecting vintage bikes was a 1984 Pinarello Gran Turismo. It wasn't one I couldn't attain, exactly. I bought it. It just didn't fit me. I saw it. I had to have it. I spent a year in denial about the fact that it was too small for me. Finally, I sold it to @Andy Antipas who it does fit. But even as I did, I told myself that one day I'd find one in my size.

Here's the bike in question, fully demonstrating how much it didn't fit me.



A few years later, I bought a beautiful chrome Pinarello Montello, and you'd think that would settle things, but it didn't. It turns out, the color was a huge part of what I loved about the bike above and the chrome Montello just wasn't scratching that itch. Then last week, while I was on vacation, Charles Nighbor shared a Portland CL ad to the Facebook SiR group for a 57cm Pinarello Treviso that was the spitting image of my old love. I spent a few days worrying that someone would buy it before I got back. Then yesterday, despite being wiped out from travel, I swung over to SE Portland and brought this beauty home with me.



I know they all say "Treviso" on them, so I'm not entirely sure that's what this is. The 1985 catalog shows several models, including the Treviso, with chrome seat stay caps like this one. It doesn't show anything with both chain stays chrome (except the Montello, and this definitely isn't a Montello). Based on the lack of downtube palmarès decal, I think this might be a 1984 model.

@T-Mar -- you were able to identify the Gran Turismo. Do you happen to know which model this is?

More detail pics:

















It's possible the decals are reproductions -- they are intact after all. The components are all Super Record except for the wheels and saddle, which are unlikely to be original (Bernard Hinault Turbo saddle and Fiamme/Maillard wheels).
Beautiful Bike Andy.
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Old 08-29-22, 04:59 PM
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As an FYI, Testors red metal flake spray enamel was a perfect match (maybe only time ever) for touch up on my Saronni red Basso.
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Old 08-29-22, 05:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
Something like that happened with my Stella. I wanted to keep the original color, which was a very red orange. It ended up more of a pure orange. I guess if you don't have a color code (and maybe even if you do) you never know how it's going to look until it's done.
Yep always a bit of a crap shoot, I harpooned myself when I agreed to let them look for another color. I told them I wanted a little darker not but that dark and had no idea they weren't going to let me have any say in spending another $150 for it. By the time I researched it, found out it can be very orange sometimes, it was way too late "we already started, it looks fine". Uh ok I guess I'll have to be good with it and I was but not the way it should have gone IME.

I know its a very fickle thing, paint is brutally hard to match, my buddy is a world class painter and has way too many stories of it going wrong despite his best efforts. Everybody's perception is different, to red or too dark, too bright or too much metallic, too shiny or too much pearl, too light or .

It can be and often is a nightmare on a good day.
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Old 08-29-22, 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by merziac View Post
Yep always a bit of a crap shoot, I harpooned myself when I agreed to let them look for another color. I told them I wanted a little darker not but that dark and had no idea they weren't going to let me have any say in spending another $150 for it. By the time I researched it, found out it can be very orange sometimes, it was way too late "we already started, it looks fine". Uh ok I guess I'll have to be good with it and I was but not the way it should have gone IME.

I know its a very fickle thing, paint is brutally hard to match, my buddy is a world class painter and has way too many stories of it going wrong despite his best efforts. Everybody's perception is different, to red or too dark, too bright or too much metallic, too shiny or too much pearl, too light or .

It can be and often is a nightmare on a good day.
Yeah, I think this is why Groody Bros has the customer buy powder and send it to them. "We just used what you bought..." I'd hate to be in that part of the business. With my Stella, I told him (Jeff Bock) what I wanted and let him pick something. He called me and said "It doesn't match the original, but I think it looks good." I've been really happy with that because he was right -- it looked great in fact -- but if this had been a case like when I was looking for just the right shade of Celeste it would have taken a miracle for me to be happy with someone else's choice for the color. With the red for a Pinarello, I almost certainly would have been disappointed. I think it has to be painted over gold to get exactly the right look. I took the Montello to Black Magic and after looking at their color book I didn't have confidence in matching what I wanted so I went with a more basic red and only had them paint the lugs. Looking back, I wish I had had the whole main triangle painted. The red for that matched the common red I see on Montellos.
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Old 08-29-22, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Spaghetti Legs View Post
As an FYI, Testors red metal flake spray enamel was a perfect match (maybe only time ever) for touch up on my Saronni red Basso.
I've got some nail polish that worked well for my Performance Superbe.



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Old 08-29-22, 09:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
Yeah, I think this is why Groody Bros has the customer buy powder and send it to them. "We just used what you bought..." I'd hate to be in that part of the business. With my Stella, I told him (Jeff Bock) what I wanted and let him pick something. He called me and said "It doesn't match the original, but I think it looks good." I've been really happy with that because he was right -- it looked great in fact -- but if this had been a case like when I was looking for just the right shade of Celeste it would have taken a miracle for me to be happy with someone else's choice for the color. With the red for a Pinarello, I almost certainly would have been disappointed. I think it has to be painted over gold to get exactly the right look. I took the Montello to Black Magic and after looking at their color book I didn't have confidence in matching what I wanted so I went with a more basic red and only had them paint the lugs. Looking back, I wish I had had the whole main triangle painted. The red for that matched the common red I see on Montellos.
Well I had a pretty good initial conversation with BM and tried to explain that I had an idea of the challenges they work with, thought we were on the same page until the "found a color that looks good and started already" email. I was really taken aback and disappointed, not sure where I went wrong and never got much info or explanation so not a huge fan of them now despite it turning out well, that kind of customer service is no bueno in most similar service businesses.

I was glad after the fact when I started getting attention and compliments from many folks out and about.

Interesting that you lacked confidence in them when you went there. You would think that sort of thing to be their wheelhouse.

I never asked but my deal could have been something to do with included paint on a TiCycles frame, they were trying to move and it didn't work out but they have moved now and are right down the street from me.

Wish I felt like I could go see them and check out their new digs.

Its probably just me.
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Old 08-29-22, 11:13 PM
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Originally Posted by merziac View Post
Interesting that you lacked confidence in them when you went there. You would think that sort of thing to be their wheelhouse.

I never asked but my deal could have been something to do with included paint on a TiCycles frame, they were trying to move and it didn't work out but they have moved now and are right down the street from me.

Wish I felt like I could go see them and check out their new digs.
I didn’t know you lived in that neighborhood. My first house was a tiny place on NE 80th across from Flanders — really, really close to their new shop.

Black Magic does really amazing work with paint, but picking colors I don’t know apart from my experience and yours. I described what I wanted and they showed me a primary red. To be fair, the primary red is what I see most often on Pinarellos, but it was far enough from what I was after to convince me that they didn’t understand what I was after and I know myself well enough to know that I wouldn’t be happy with “close enough.”
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Old 08-29-22, 11:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
I didn’t know you lived in that neighborhood. My first house was a tiny place on NE 80th across from Flanders — really, really close to their new shop.

Black Magic does really amazing work with paint, but picking colors I don’t know apart from my experience and yours. I described what I wanted and they showed me a primary red. To be fair, the primary red is what I see most often on Pinarellos, but it was far enough from what I was after to convince me that they didn’t understand what I was after and I know myself well enough to know that I wouldn’t be happy with “close enough.”
Well I'm not that close but way closer than when they were at Dave's shop. I'm out by David Douglas HS.

Ben just didn't seem too concerned with my struggle either but was glad to pick a color for me for an extra $150 at the time, then not care when I was upside down with the color. Guess I was lucky I was able to come around and get on board.

I know how good they are and had also talked to Rudi earlier on, he was great and I was happy after talking with him but not sure after talking with Ben and found out why.

Another thing that seemed way off and not ok was that they installed a headset for a photo shoot of my frame with out my ok which I got over from them posting it on their website which was cool but still.

None of this was life threatening but left a pretty bad taste in my mouth, again, maybe just me and their work and skill is certainly very good so.....

Again, not a good look and not really how to run a business but what do I know.
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Old 08-30-22, 12:05 AM
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Also find it a bit interesting and telling that they have a help wanted ad for a shop assistant again after having the same a year ago when they moved.

They are asking for a rockstar candidate to do just about everything. In the current job climate this person is not walking around looking for this job, likely not at the number they are offering.

https://bikeportland.org/2022/08/08/...c-paint-361145
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Old 08-30-22, 01:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
I've got some nail polish that worked well for my Performance Superbe.



Next time we get together, it would be interesting to try a dot of that same nail polish somewhere on my Marinoni. Pretty sure my red isn’t as deep or lustrous as that Pinarello or the Performance Superbe, but they are similar.
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Old 08-30-22, 02:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Dfrost View Post
Next time we get together, it would be interesting to try a dot of that same nail polish somewhere on my Marinoni. Pretty sure my red isn’t as deep or lustrous as that Pinarello or the Performance Superbe, but they are similar.
I think your Marinoni is a slightly darker red. Of course, one of the great things about nail polish is that it's easy to remove if it doesn't look good, so we should try it.
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Old 08-30-22, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
Pretty bike.

Looks like that's the only road rash on that right lever. I usually just use a file on that and smooth it enough so my hand doesn't notice. If the rash is significant, I'll deanodize Campy levers. And I always put the nicer of the two levers on the drive side.

Actually, all the good stuff goes on the ds: the better dust caps, brake lever, hood, clip/strap, brake shoe, shifter wing nut ...
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Old 08-30-22, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by SurferRosa View Post
Pretty bike.

Looks like that's the only road rash on that right lever. I usually just use a file on that and smooth it enough so my hand doesn't notice. If the rash is significant, I'll deanodize Campy levers. And I always put the nicer of the two levers on the drive side.

Actually, all the good stuff goes on the ds: the better dust caps, brake lever, hood, clip/strap, brake shoe, shifter wing nut ...
Thanks! I've been contemplating what can be done with that lever. The other lever is like new. It'd be a shame not to be able to salvage the pair.
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Old 08-30-22, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
Thanks! I've been contemplating what can be done with that lever. The other lever is like new. It'd be a shame not to be able to salvage the pair.
Oh, it could be cleaned up and returned to service no problem - but the hood would have to be removed to do it right, and might very well become torn in the process

Anyway, you're just gonna take off the SR bits and stuff 'em in a box, right?

Whatever it ends up wearing, the frame's the star here, for sure.

DD
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Old 08-30-22, 01:57 PM
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Really nice Andy. Not sure I saw this one on our local CL... Looks proper with the SR components. With that fork crown, suggests early 1980's, perhaps 82-83 given the Vuelta - Giro 81 palmeres. That deep red is gorgeous. Put some 30c tires on, a 28t freewheel and do Banks-Vernonia!
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Old 08-30-22, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
I've got some nail polish that worked well for my Performance Superbe.



I had the same issue with my Holdsworth Avanti, officially it's Holdsworth Red Pearl, but looks quite similar (forks):




Turns out Mavala nail polish comes in a large number of red shades
Full list is here: https://www.mavala.com/en/910-mini-color (pick "red" on "Group of shades"), but here's half of them.
I went with "3 Paris".


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