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Some French frames on eBay

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Some French frames on eBay

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Old 01-01-06, 08:41 PM
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In case anyone is interested and is close by to either of these. Check out the rake on the Moto fork:

Vintage French Jeunet Frame Set Bicycle

VINTAGE MOTOBECANE ROAD BICYCLE FRAME 58 CM
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Old 01-01-06, 08:49 PM
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Those Jeunets are kinda cool, but the tubing is straight guage and I believe it is seamed. Still a very nice looking bike; good construction, nice lug and paint work, good rear drops. I've had a couple over the last few years, but in midgie sub 60cm sizes. Why can't folks have longer legs? A bit nicer than a UO8, maybe. The moto is overpriced, IMHO. I could be wrong, of course, as I am poor and want everything to be cheap.
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Old 01-01-06, 09:00 PM
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The Jeunet fork is definitely aftermarket, and the Moto fork looks like it's been run off a few to many ramps or done a few to many wheelies.
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Old 01-01-06, 09:03 PM
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Nah, those are the original forks for that model Jeunet, fully chromed. They do look aftermarket, tho, but since every single one of that model I've ever seen (about a dozen at least) had that fork, either that model bike is really crash prone, Jeunet replaced every fork on that model, or... they're the originals. The nice loooooong rake on the moto is pretty French.
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Old 01-01-06, 09:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Poguemahone
Nah, those are the original forks for that model Jeunet, fully chromed. They do look aftermarket, tho, but since every single one of that model I've ever seen (about a dozen at least) had that fork,...
Nah, does that look like a race that fits the headset? Looks like a replacement to me. This is more representative of the Jeunet bikes/forks I've seen...

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...et#post1225232

...but I havent seen them all.

By the way, what model is that Jeunet?
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Old 01-02-06, 01:07 PM
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Nah. Pretty sure it's original in the fork; looks right. Here's another ebay auction for the same model:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-Jeunet-L...QQcmdZViewItem

And attached are some pictures of a pristine one I found a couple of months ago. Don't think I have photos of the full bike anymore; it had Solida cottered cranks and standard Mfac/Simplex setup with steel rims and Normandy hubs; I bought it for the flawless Mafac half-hoods. It was on the catch of the day thread, but the photos got washed when Joe did a system check a while back. Note that the comment about 531 in the above linked auction is either hopefull thinking on the part of the seller or complete misdirection; this model is NOT 531.

The bike in the linked discussion you've given me is a higher end full 531 model, not the same bike at all. This one is pretty much a UO8 equivalent, maybe a bit nicer. Not as nice as that 531 model (the picture is from CR). I'm not sure of the model of the bike we're discussing, but I've seen it often enought to know that fork looks original.
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Old 01-02-06, 02:33 PM
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To muddy the water a bit more, I had a 1974 Jeunet Pro with Reynolds 531DB. It had the 1/2 chrome forks. I don't recall the lesser models coming with full chrome forks and it's curious that the higher end models would be 1/2 chrome, while the lesser models were full chrome, but that's not to say that the full chrome forks are not original. It could simply be a slightly more recent model year or maybe the owners stripped the paint to reveal the chrome, which was fairly common once chips revealed the underlying chrome. In the former case, Jeunet would have been a decade ahead of their time. In the mid-1980s, many manufcturers found that offering a full chrome fork was cheaper in the end, as it allowed them to use a single fork on mutiple models, regardless of the color, provided the frame size was correct. It certainly reduced inventory costs.
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Old 01-02-06, 05:26 PM
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T-mar, I've seen about a dozen of these, and never seen one without fully chromed forks... they're definitely a lower end model, given the seamed frame tubing and the component set. The first time I saw one, I assumed the fork was a replacement, but after seeing so many, and never one with any other type of fork, I'm pretty sure it's original. I'll leave open the possibility I'm completely wrong and the victim of statistical improbabilty. It seems odd that every one I've ever seen had the chromed fork... all the higher end Jeunets I've seen have had half chromed forks. It may have been a cost cutting manuevuer, as many half chromed forks were in fact fully chromed and half-painted. Could've saved a few pennies by not painting the forks, I guess....
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Old 01-02-06, 06:51 PM
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This is maybe the fourth Juenet that I've seen picture of; there's also one in the bike donation pile at the lbs - my question is, why are they all so tiny? The biggest ones were these 21" ones - does Jeunet mean little bitty bicycle in French?
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Old 01-02-06, 06:58 PM
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I dunno. All the ones I've seen were midgie sizes too, with one exception, a 63cm 630 French Pro on ebay a few years ago with a BIN of 180$... I bid to kill the BIN, and have been kicking myself ever since, because it went for quite a bit more. Should've grabbed it at 180$. Think I was poor then or something... wait, I'm poor now.
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Old 01-02-06, 07:54 PM
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I've seen quite a few of the low end models also and all the ones I've seen have the 1/2 chrome forks. I still have the 1974 literature at home and I'm pretty the sure the forks are 1/2 chrome. Not that I'm doubting you, but it is strange.

The predominance of small sizes in your experience is also strange. I know that they came in the larger sizes, up to about 25", but for some reason, I seem to recall it being something odd, like 24-1/2", which would be the equivalent of 62 cm. Back during the boom, the buyers tended to favour slightly large bicycles, with 23" being the best selling size. So it's strange that that you're seeing so many 21" models. The Pro was available in smaller increments. Mine was 22"/56cm.

One possible reason for the predominace of smaller sizes may be the reputation of the slightly undersize tubing used by the French manufacturers. The smaller diameter helped contribute to their light weight and resilient ride quality, but with taller and presumibly heavier riders, it was notably flexy and more suceptible to damage in the event of a crash. I had a 6'2" friend who rode one of the pink Mercier team bicycles and he quickly got rid of it for an early Marinoni, which was much better suited to his weight. I know that I could readily tell the difference in switching between the Jeunet and my Italian bicycles, or at least I thought I could.
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Old 01-02-06, 08:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Poguemahone
...I've...never seen one without fully chromed forks...
Weird, you posted a photo of a Jeunet with half chrome forks here...:

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...net#post871267,

... so I guess I just assumed you had seen one with the half chrome forks. Go figure.

Anyway, check out the headset closely on that frame. It is a replacement upper locknut; in fact it has quite a few replacement parts. Nah, it's not the original. Probably had to replace the upper locknut to accomodate the english threads on the replacement fork.

I think T-Mar is right. Peugeot was one of the first I remember to start putting full chrome forks on lower end bikes in the 80's, but back in the 70s, chrome was an upgrade, so the higher up you went in the model line, the more chrome you got.
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Old 01-03-06, 07:08 AM
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"Weird, you posted a photo of a Jeunet with half chrome forks here...:

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthrea...unet#post871267,

... so I guess I just assumed you had seen one with the half chrome forks. Go figure."


As I've said, I've seen higher end models with half-chromed forks, but not this one... see my post #8 in this thread (which you selectively quote, read it again), where I say: "It seems odd that every one I've ever seen had the chromed fork... all the higher end Jeunets I've seen have had half chromed forks." Again, this bike is a different model, lower end. The picture in that thread is of the 630 model, it's from the CR site, I believe. Better frame than this one.

At any rate, I'm not convinced the fork on the pictured Jeunet is a replacement, but I'm open to the possibility. Especially give T-mars comments about the catalogs. I'm uncertain about the reasons why there might be variations within a model, but I do know some french manfacturers would build a bike with whatever they could get (notably Gitane, there seems to be a bit of variation in the TDF models). What I'm saying is I have repeatedly seen this entry level model with fully chromed forks and half chromed rear stays; I believe it's original. I'm certainly not married to my interpertation here, and certainly could be wrong again, but repeatedly seeing these with the fully chromed fork lead me to believe it's original. Not certain, however.

By the way, Tmar, I doubt the small sampling of the Jeunets I've seen is representative of their size. Anything under about 60cm looks small to me.
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Old 01-03-06, 07:31 PM
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What I'm saying is I have repeatedly seen this entry level model with fully chromed forks and half chromed rear stays; I believe it's original. I'm certainly not married to my interpertation here, and certainly could be wrong again, but repeatedly seeing these with the fully chromed fork lead me to believe it's original. Not certain, however.

Sounds like you've seen lots of this model. What model is it? Thanks.
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Old 01-03-06, 08:07 PM
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Shiftinjohn, I honestly don't know the model, but I've had two of them in the last year (both now sold; hence the pictures). I've been unable to find much further documentation on this particular model, but it's fairly distinctive. The basic setup on it is your basic simplex derlin derailleurs, Mafac racer brakeset, Jeunet steel chromed bars, Normandy high flange hubs (base level, similar to those on a UO8 or the old "schwinn approved Normandys), steel rims (I think Rigida, but I'd have to check-- I think I still have the wheelset from the last one) solida cottered crank, unmarked headset with the old serrated style ring (similar to a stronglight, but unmarked, as I said), unmarked tubing, but with noticable seams, particularly in the headtube, simplex rear drops with no integral hanger, Jeunet seat (hard, lousy plastic and foam-- I think I've still got one if you'd like it, PM me and it's all yours), 26mm seat post, type with clamp (I recall). Cable routing is via braze ons on most of the ones I've seen, though along the side of the top tube, very similar to a 1970s UO8. (edit: rear brake cable; I recall the derailleur cable being thru camp-ons. end edit) The lugs are designed to be Nervex like, but on closer examination are not. And on both the ones I've found, fully chromed forks. Decent paint for an old Frenchie. Kind of this I wouldn't hesitate to build into a fixed gear or the like for someone. The last one I found was in nearly pristine condition; I still have about a dozen photos of the frame if you'd like to see more of it. Stripped it down for the Mafacs, which I think I'm putting on an old Follis (can't give you the model on that one either, but it's a 531 bike... may be a 472, but I'm not entirely sure, that's just the closest match I've found to what I have.)

In addition, the frames pop up on ebuy now and again, and every one I recall seeing had the chromed forks. Doubt I've seen 'em all, but I search ebuy for this brand fairly frequently; I'd like one of the 531 models. When I first saw this model (just the frame; I didn't see a complete bike until later) I assumed it was a replacement fork and the frame was the 630 model from CR, but closer examination has proved it not to be that model. I wouldn't mind having a Jeunet, but not this particular model, whatever it may be. It's really, truly a UO8 equivalent with some pretty neat frills, nothing earth-shattering.

Information on Jeunets seems to be a bit sparse, but it would seem T-mar has some old cats, which I wouldn't mind knowing a bit more from. As always, thanks, tmar. And if you've got any info, ShiftinJohn, please share it. Most of the info I've managed to garner has been from years of scrounging locally, and I won't pretend it is authoritive (or even correct)-- but it is what I've seen. Additional info is always appreciated. Thanks!
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Old 01-03-06, 10:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Poguemahone
Shiftinjohn, I honestly don't know the model
Ok, just curious.

Sorry for the edit.
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Old 01-08-06, 08:49 PM
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Ok, I just got back from hoidays and went looking for the Jeunet info. Here's what I found.

The most probable model is the model 611, Dole Stadium. It's your basic Peugeot UO8 equivalent, with a steel cottered crankset, Simplex Prestige derailleurs, MAFAC brakes, steel rims laced to Normandy QR hubs. The other possibility is the model 620, River Doubs, which is the Peugeot PA10 equivalent. It has the same components as the model 611, but with a tubular wheelset. The frames appear to be the same and use the same Alleges tubing, but the 620 may have slightly "racier" geometry.

Interestingly, the 611 was spec'd only in 20" and 22" frames. At first, this seemed to explain the comments regarding the small frames, However, I then noted that the model 610 (mixte version of model 611) listed an additional 25" frame. Apparently, the printer interchanged the specs for the 610 and 611.

Above info is circa 1973. As you can see from the attached 620 picture, the forks are 1/2 chrome, as I recalled. Also have 1974 dealer lists, which mention "chrome front fork ends" on similarly spec'd models, but the names have changed to Classique and Competition.

As for the all chrome front forks, I 've had another thought, besides the different model year. Maybe Jeunet had some complaints of defective forks and had the distributor replace all the forks, just in case? Just speculation on my part.
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Old 01-09-06, 12:49 PM
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"As for the all chrome front forks, I 've had another thought, besides the different model year. Maybe Jeunet had some complaints of defective forks and had the distributor replace all the forks, just in case? Just speculation on my part."

Well, this is interesting. Obviously something is going on here; since this thread has three of these bikes pictured, all with the fully chromed forks. Model year? Defect replacments? Someone decided they could save a few pennies by not half-painting the forks? I suppose we'll never find out... I suspect the ones I've dug up were the 611 (clinchers). One mistake in my earlier post: the saddles were Messingers, although it really doesn't matter, because they are truly horrid looking saddles. Ugh. Plastic attempt at a fake brooks looking thing.

This bike is, I think, an interesting attempt to bring the "bling" of higher end models to a lower end one. It's (I think) the only low end bike I've seen with the half-chrome rear drops, and the lugs are Nervex imitations. As others have noted, you generally got more chrome on the frames for more $$$, like a PX10 compared to a an AO8. I guess someone at Jeunet figured looks were more important and gave more bling for the buck... everything else on these bikes screams entry level. There are probably other similar entry level bike boom models out there, but I can't think of any just now.

Thanks as always Tmar for the cat scans and your knowledge!
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Old 01-09-06, 01:27 PM
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If you wanted lots of chrome on an entry level model in the early 1970s, Italian was the way to go. Typically, the 2nd from the bottom of the line models had chrome fork and stay ends, chrome fork crown and chrome head lugs. Very stunning cosmetics, but generally with mediocre cottered cranks, steel rims and Valentino derailleurs. The Atala Grand Prix and Bottechia Special fit this mold, along with similar models from Chiorda and Torpado. The Torpado in fact, was all chrome underneath a translucent paint. So, the Italians had their cookie cutter models too, but with a little more "bling" than the French.
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Old 01-14-06, 09:10 PM
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Here's a vintage pic of the exact same model down to the rear derailleur - half chrome forks all the way.

Source is http://www.classicrendezvous.com/Fra...Jeunet_620.htm

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Old 01-14-06, 09:21 PM
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Looks like it-- still doesn't explain why so many of them have the fully chromed forks. At this point, I'd like to see an image w/ half chrome that's not from the catalog, as this thread has shown they're consistently popping up with the fully chromed forks. Except for these two cat pictures, the dozen or so I've seen have had the fully chromed forks. I only know what I see, but that's too many (three shown in this thread alone) to be coincidence.

Another possibilty is the model was changed to fully chromed forks after the catalog photos were printed.

There's a much nicer Jeunet on ebuy right now, BTW, full 531.
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Old 05-03-06, 02:09 PM
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Juenet folks

Here is one that you all have been talking about but its big.

top tube cc 58.4/ 23in
seat tube cc 60.9/ 24in
stand over 87.6/34.5in

Chrome fork
not chromed chainstays but everything else as talked about.
I am going to clean it a probably put in on ebay.
This is a 1976 or earlier, Had a college sticker from 1976
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Old 09-27-08, 12:43 AM
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can the cottered cranks/BB be replaced with any 68mm bottom bracket and crankset?
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Old 09-27-08, 12:55 AM
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Hoffa626: As you are obviously new to the "Forum Concept" - allow me to enlighten you. Please direct your attention to the dates on the above posts. The one posted just before your request for info is dated: 05-03-06. This makes it nearly 2 years and 5 months old.

See where I'm going with this?

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Old 09-27-08, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Panthers007 View Post
See where I'm going with this?

Happy Cycling!
Not really - this issue comes up often and you're damned if you do and damned if you don't - start a new thread and you'll get somebody posting that you should have used the search function. Post to an old thread and somebody complains that the thread is too old. Now as to why Hoffa626 is asking that question in this thread, well I guess that's another thing...

Anyway, for Hoffa626, no, you can't just use any 68mm bottom bracket on a French bike of that period. Use the search function and you will find many threads on this topic. And if any of them are old but you still have a question, don't be afraid to ask. That's why they don't lock the old threads.
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1959 Bottecchia Milano-Sanremo(frame), 1966 Bottecchia Professional (frame), 1971 Bottecchia Professional (frame),
1973 Bottecchia Gran Turismo, 1974 Bottecchia Special, 1977 Bottecchia Special (frame),
1974 Peugeot UO-8, 1988 Panasonic PT-3500, 2002 Bianchi Veloce, 2004 Bianchi Pista
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