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the BEST raleigh three-speed!

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the BEST raleigh three-speed!

Old 11-20-07, 11:19 PM
  #26  
nlerner
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Vaughn, it's a real apple-and-oranges comparison. The Kogswell is unlike the Sports and unlike the lightweight 3-speed conversions, mainly because of the frame geometry (low trail) and the 650B wheelset (cushy and fast!). I don't think it's overall lighter than some of those conversions I show from all Reynolds 531 frames, but it's designed from the ground up for a certain kind of ride, and in my view certainly delivers that ride. But it's not C&V!

Neal
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Old 11-21-07, 03:18 AM
  #27  
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I thought the Kogswell had MORE than usual trail? To stabilize a front rack?
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Old 11-21-07, 05:34 AM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by Sammyboy View Post
I thought the Kogswell had MORE than usual trail? To stabilize a front rack?

It depends upon which fork you order with the P/R; there are three to choose from.
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Old 11-21-07, 08:37 AM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by Sammyboy View Post
If you think about it, having a double chain-wheel means having a derailleur like chain tensioner too - not a good solution in my view.
Had a think about that and what made it seem workable to me was the simple tensioner on the Itera.

It does add one complication, but a double (triple even?) chain-wheel (+ tensioner) is simpler and cleaner than using a rear derailer with a 3 speed.
In theory anyway.

I've yet to try it, but I have thought about it!!
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Old 11-21-07, 12:04 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by Sammyboy View Post
I thought the Kogswell had MORE than usual trail? To stabilize a front rack?
It can have more than usual fork rake, which will translate into shorter trail (and shorter trail is generally more stable for carrying a load on front). A key factor is headtube angle. Fwiw, I went with the middle range fork on my P/R, giving me 40mm of trail (the other options give 25mm and 50mm). The ride is very stable, very cushy, and quite nimble.

For a handy trail calculator, see http://greenspoons.com/cgi-bin/trailulator.

Neal
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Old 11-21-07, 12:26 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by viscount View Post
Had a think about that and what made it seem workable to me was the simple tensioner on the Itera.
Like this.

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Old 11-21-07, 02:22 PM
  #32  
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You've got an Itera??? I've always wanted to ride one of those! How is it? I see how in that case, it could work well, but I like a nice, simple solution - I'd much prefer NOT to have one of those fellas.
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Old 11-21-07, 08:58 PM
  #33  
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"Ultimate" means different thing to different people. A 531 road bike converted to faux "Clubman" makes a lot of sense. But 531 road bikes converted to pseudo roadsters don't work for me. Geometry is wrong for the roadster riding position.

I'm fortunate enough to have a couple of sets of 531 and the tools needed to turn them into proper "Light Roadsters" with 69 degree angles and long chainstays. (Now all I need is time.) The sets I have should produce a 4.3 pound frame in my size. With alloy parts and thermoplastic fenders you should be able to come in 10 pounds under the weight of a Raleigh Sport without giving up any functionality.

High on the list of features would be a secure mount for the prop stand that would keep it from moving and protect the chainstays. Easy to do, but few manufacturers ever have.
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Old 11-22-07, 07:28 AM
  #34  
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Admittedly I have my three speed set up more like a Clubman than a Sports but I still think it would make a great commuter. The frame is an early 1970's Raleigh Competition (Reynolds 531 throughout) with Campy wheels and a 1950's Sturmey Archer Three Speed rear hub. The pics are from right after I bought it so I am have made some cosmetic changes since. All and all it makes for light, great riding bike which I use for my Saturday morning rides as well as grocery runs. It will probable continue to be my only three speed until that mint condition Raleigh Clubman or Record Ace falls into my lap.


http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/...96&uid=8070887
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Old 11-22-07, 07:37 AM
  #35  
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Neal,

That Competition looks very familar. I posted pictures of it further down not realizing you had already posted it as part of your collection. I enjoy the bike very much. Thanks again.
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Old 11-22-07, 07:50 AM
  #36  
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Viscount,
What is the story on the Itera? I have never seen one of those before? Year? Do they still make them?

Aaron
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Old 11-22-07, 11:57 AM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by MnHPVA Guy View Post
"Ultimate" means different thing to different people. A 531 road bike converted to faux "Clubman" makes a lot of sense. But 531 road bikes converted to pseudo roadsters don't work for me. Geometry is wrong for the roadster riding position.
I'd love to have them all be Club-type conversions with drop bars, but unfortunately I have a chronic neck condition that makes being on drops a literal pain in the neck. I have to have my bars up above saddle height, and achieving that with upright bars (or flat bars and a upward-angled stem) is usually what I do.

However, having ridden lots of true Raleigh 3-speeds for many years and now having modified a bunch of 531 bikes into lightweight Sports-type bikes, I'd take the latter ride quality every time. The angles aren't as slack, for sure, but the responsiveness you get back is very nice. There's certainly a sweet spot--for instance, I found that late 70s Raleighs with their more "sport" geometry don't do well as upright riders. But the early 70s models were still slack enough to be excellent candidates.

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Old 11-22-07, 01:59 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by nlerner View Post
However, having ridden lots of true Raleigh 3-speeds for many years and now having modified a bunch of 531 bikes into lightweight Sports-type bikes, I'd take the latter ride quality every time.

Neal
This is a big part of the impetus behind the Kogswell P/R: to make a better roadster.

At first (this is around 1986), I wanted to make a light version of an American roadster, like a Schwinn Racer. Later when I became aware of the more sophisticated models, like the older Raleighs, that just fanned the flames. And when I became aware of the porteur bikes, I crossed the Roadster Rubicon, so to speak.
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Old 11-23-07, 04:48 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by Sammyboy View Post
You've got an Itera??? I've always wanted to ride one of those! How is it? I see how in that case, it could work well, but I like a nice, simple solution - I'd much prefer NOT to have one of those fellas.
Yes, me have Itera.
The bars are a bit flexy but you get used to it quickly.
Was such a brilliant idea in the 80s.
Recyclable way before its time.
And just like a 3 speed to ride.
I often get asked when I'm riding it "is it an electric bike?"

Does look like that, but it's a piece of history now.
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Old 11-23-07, 04:56 PM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by wahoonc View Post
Viscount,
What is the story on the Itera? I have never seen one of those before? Year? Do they still make them?

Aaron
Aaron, the Iteras were made in the 80s, and financed by an enlightened Swedish government grant that enabled the whole process. (Could you imagine it happening anywhere else?)
It didn't succeed financially, but that was more down to the implementers/managers than the idea itself.

It folded on the verge of success, some would say. (Me included)
But it was a brave attempt I think.
Good place to start is here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Itera_plastic_bicycle
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Old 12-08-07, 08:28 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by Sammyboy View Post
You've got an Itera??? I've always wanted to ride one of those! How is it? I see how in that case, it could work well, but I like a nice, simple solution - I'd much prefer NOT to have one of those fellas.
What about this one then?
Similar one can be used to switch between fixie/SS:



Posted it last night before I found this thread again.
Simpler than a conventional derailer.
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