Okay Coelcanth and CV-6, I know you can give me some details.

I know from reading CR threads that older record headsets have a <c> on the lower cup. This <c> comes after Campagnolo. I believe catalog 15 (1967) to be the first catalog to show the record headset with embossed print. In the catalog and all subsequent catalogs you can see "Brev. Campagnolo Italy"

1. What year did this <c> appear and disappear on the lower cup, exactly?

I know from looking at parts of my own that some Record headsets have a <c> on the bottom of the crown race and later ones surely did not.

2. What year(s) did this <c> appear and or disappear on the crown race?

3. Lastly, did the profile of the crown race change? What I am talking about is the part you can see when the headset is mounted. For most headset it is a nice flat taper. I have an old crown race that is rounded and bulbous, just curious if it is a super early record crown race.

Sorry if I am delving too deep into the unknown.

Research has uncovered the below. But I don't know if I can see the "post 1967 flattened hex top nut" does anyone have an example of a pre-1967 non-flattened top nut other than the catalogs? And were all top nuts from 1967 on the same? I have a top nut that has lines inbetween the campagnolo --- Patent (like that but continuous) it looks older is it non record? What I take from this is that officially the inset type appear in 1969 and that the characteristic that makes it pre-1972 is the <c>? That seems odd since the type appear inset in the 1967 catalog... does anyone have an example of a 1967-69 headset?

This from Robert S. Broderick's Wool Jersey Album:

"chrome plated steel - post 1967 flattened hex top nut - post 1969 and pre 1972 with channel inset marked "BREV. CAMPAGNOLO ITALY BREV. CAMPAGNOLO ITALY" on upper cup and "BREV. CAMPAGNOLO ITALY BREV. CAMPAGNOLO <C>" on lower cup - caged ball bearings - model 1039"

My understanding is the original Campagnolo headset were copied by Zeus. I have a Zeus I could shoot, but oddly, all the 50s Italian bikes I had never had a Campagnolo headset.

Geez, Campy have been making parts for a loonnnggg time.

LOL...Bob Broderick is the person who first educated me about the <c> headsets when I got one on my Gitane Super Corsa. Can't go too far wrong with his info. He researches these things assiduously. I cannot answer your questions. Wait until you get started on the brake levers of that era.

I already know a bit about them. The curve changed over time though I don't know the details. I know the earliest has circle cut-outs for the cables and yes I have a set.. Both the <c> headset cup and the levers going on corky are courtesy of the good Dr.

ii had always thought the headsets with printing around the cups were introduced before 1967..
and i am pretty sure i recall seeing an original one for sale from a bike ca. 1963 (i bought the dated brooks saddle from this bike)

it is often debated but i guess the <c> marking on the lower cup to have disappeared around 1970..
i know there has been some discussion on CR where people insisted they only appeared AFTER this date and for a short time. what i've seen isn't really consistent with that.

the rounded crown race had the 1mm lip added to it sometime in the late 70s or early 80s.. i think it had something to do with making the stack height closer to the Super Record headset or perhaps for better brake clearance..

i've pasted some additional info from velostuf.com's headset gallery.. mostly his page deals with earlier parts and does not attempt to precisely date them rather than put them in chronological order.. the last version he gives a date for is ver. 2 ca. 1960, so it might make sense that ver. 4 first came out in the early 60s.. i have not looked through catalogs earlier than no. 15 much.. are they on the internet somewhere ?:

""
4th version- 4.5 version and 5th version- cups with lettering in a channel CAMPAGNOLO ITALY BREV. CAMPAGNOLO ITALY BREV. with or without <C> on the bottom cup; (with <C> is earlier) plain hex top nut that has 4 lines interspersed with the lettering on it, (earlier) or no lines, (later); a crown race with a rounded bottom, (earlier), or crown race with a squared bottom; plain stamped toothed washer. The words on the inside of the adjustable cup are slightly different, for example earlier versions will say, "ENGLAND" on one end and "1" x 24tpi" on the other end. Later versions will have an adjustable cup that says inside, " 1" x 24tpi ENGLAND" on one end and "Made in Italy" on the other end. Also, the collar of the pressed races, (the part that goes into the head tube) has lettering on earlier versions, and no lettering on later versions, (thanks J. Westerman and hi.campy).

It is common for some parts to seemingly appear mismatched with other parts in a set. However, it may be no less correct. For instance, if the factory was switching over to new wording on the top nut, they wouldn't necessarily throw away older pressed races with lettering, they would use what was available to make up complete sets.
""

Thanks coelcanth....
I was looking for a c-record headset when I found this:
https://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...MEWN:IT&ih=006


I took a chance and snagged it. Whether the others think they knew what I think I know I can not say. Now I want to know what you think.

purported to be NOS.

First let me rundown my thoughts.
-Looking at the description we can immediately rule out C-record.
-checking my victory headset I found no marking on the bottom of the crown race and I don't think there are any on the sleeves that fit into the headtube so those pieces at least could not be victory.
-After many email exchanges with the seller I was told that there was also a <c> on the lower cup (you can see one clearly on the bottom of the crown race and I know that this disappeared on later crown races, but am not sure when.
- The top (adjustable) cup has 8 sides.
-I hope he isn't scamming me because he knows the <c> is significant and he didn't post our exchanges thought I told him what he had was possibly worth more than a victory headset)..

Now what I see in the photo is text on the crown race sleeve and a rounded crown race with no lip.
That puts this around mid-late 60s record and it's NOS! Needless to say I'm pretty stoked at the moment to get such a piece for $60 plus s/h... but I may be sorely mistaken when I get it.