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#@*%$# French! Non-standard chainring bolts???

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#@*%$# French! Non-standard chainring bolts???

Old 06-24-08, 09:04 PM
  #1  
Kommisar89
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#@*%$# French! Non-standard chainring bolts???

The big ring on my Stronglight 49D was rather worn (#@*%$# French again! Soft aluminum...) so I ordered a replacement from eBay, used but in very nice condition. I disassembled the crank and removed the rings, cleaned everything up and put the new ring on the arm. Then I went to mount the original little ring to the new big ring and lo and behold, the bolts don't fit! The original bolts are standard chainring bolts like any modern crank. The holes in the chainring measure 10mm diameter. The replacement chainring appears identical to the original except...the holes are 7mm diameter. What's up with that? So now my crank is sitting there in pieces and my shiny new chainring doesn't work. #@*%$# French! Good thing I wasn't ready to put the Peugeot on the road.
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Old 06-25-08, 05:07 AM
  #2  
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There are about five different "standards" for chainring bolts. The modern standard use the 10mm hole. Sounds like Stronglight changed the standard for the inner ring somewhere along the product life cycle. At least you can drill out the 7mm holes to the 10mm that you require. If it was the other way around...
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Old 06-25-08, 05:41 AM
  #3  
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Yep, The smaller holes were earlier versions. The same diameter as was used on the model 57 Super Competition cranks. Model 63 was the first to use the standard 10mm (Campy-style) hex-key bolts - in 1963. The model 49 rings dragged behind for a while before Stronglight finally changed them over too (probably because there were already so many already in circulation).

If interested in a trade, let me know. I probably have a used, Very Good to Excellent condition or possibly even a New-Old-Stock 52-tooth outer chainring with 10 mm holes.

Here are some comparison photos for anyone interested in seeing the different styles we're talking about:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/strongl...7604050476598/
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Old 06-25-08, 08:13 AM
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Originally Posted by stronglight View Post
Yep, The smaller holes were earlier versions. The same diameter as was used on the model 57 Super Competition cranks. Model 63 was the first to use the standard 10mm (Campy-style) hex-key bolts - in 1963. The model 49 rings dragged behind for a while before Stronglight finally changed them over too (probably because there were already so many already in circulation).

If interested in a trade, let me know. I probably have a used, Very Good to Excellent condition or possibly even a New-Old-Stock 52-tooth outer chainring with 10 mm holes.

Here are some comparison photos for anyone interested in seeing the different styles we're talking about:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/strongl...7604050476598/
PM'd you.
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Old 06-25-08, 10:54 AM
  #5  
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7mm bolts were "standard" until others decided they weren't going to use them. Don't blame "the French" as people are so apt to do. Blame the individual Italian and Japanese makers who chose to use something else. TA and Stronglight dominated the market for aluminum cranks for a long time and 7mm was the measurement they used. If Campagnolo and, later, the Japanese makers copying them chose something different and the French makers had to adapt when their market shrank, who should we be blaming for the bolt size change?

Likewise, Stronglight invented the square taper, but when Campagnolo adopted it, they decided to use their own taper. So who do we blame for that one? "The French" ?

I'm tired of seeing threads like "I hate French BBs!" and "#@@#$ French!"

For anyone who is annoyed by French parts, please PM me and I'll give you my mailing address.

Karl
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Old 06-25-08, 04:04 PM
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Originally Posted by karmat View Post
7mm bolts were "standard" until others decided they weren't going to use them. Don't blame "the French" as people are so apt to do. Blame the individual Italian and Japanese makers who chose to use something else. TA and Stronglight dominated the market for aluminum cranks for a long time and 7mm was the measurement they used. If Campagnolo and, later, the Japanese makers copying them chose something different and the French makers had to adapt when their market shrank, who should we be blaming for the bolt size change?

Likewise, Stronglight invented the square taper, but when Campagnolo adopted it, they decided to use their own taper. So who do we blame for that one? "The French" ?

I'm tired of seeing threads like "I hate French BBs!" and "#@@#$ French!"

For anyone who is annoyed by French parts, please PM me and I'll give you my mailing address.

Karl

Sorry man, didn't mean to offend, it was just my poor attempt at humor I wouldn't be building a French bike if I didn't like the them. Actually, it's not that it's 7mm that bugged me - I'm perfectly happy with looking for special French parts - it's that the one I already had was 10mm and I just assumed that was "normal" for a 49D chainring. It never even dawned on me to check the bolt hole sizes when I ordered. It was rather annoying last night though. My bad.
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Old 06-25-08, 09:22 PM
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I apologize in advance if my tone offends anyone, but I must reply.

This comment is reminiscent of the recent “I hate French BBs” thread in which the OP forgot that the French used a right-hand thread, drive side fixed cup before he wrenched the wrong way and trashed his BB. That sentiment was echoed in the “I don't want to mess around with that weird French threading” comment of a few days ago.

Let us not forget that Italian threaded frames also have a RH threaded fixed BB cup. Truth be told, Italian threading is a goofy mix of metric and British, with no common sense to it at all. Where is the movement to throw all Italian frames into history’s garbage can? Are hordes of annoyed, unskilled, amateur bicycle mechanics standing in line to pee on Tulio Campagnolo’s grave? I think not.

There was a time when metric-threaded bicycles (French, Spanish, Belgium, Swiss…) dominated the European and US bicycle markets. Those bicycles, by the very definition of the phrase, are now called Classic and Vintage. It seems to me to be both illogical and nonsensical to complain about them on a forum devoted to classic and vintage bicycles and expect a sympathetic audience.

Embrace and love C&V French bicycles, or else buy a 2008 “Motebecane” from Bicycles Direct. I hear that Shimano makes wonderful bicycle components.

Bob


Originally Posted by Kommisar89 View Post
The big ring on my Stronglight 49D was rather worn (#@*%$# French again! Soft aluminum...) so I ordered a replacement from eBay, used but in very nice condition. I disassembled the crank and removed the rings, cleaned everything up and put the new ring on the arm. Then I went to mount the original little ring to the new big ring and lo and behold, the bolts don't fit! The original bolts are standard chainring bolts like any modern crank. The holes in the chainring measure 10mm diameter. The replacement chainring appears identical to the original except...the holes are 7mm diameter. What's up with that? So now my crank is sitting there in pieces and my shiny new chainring doesn't work. #@*%$# French! Good thing I wasn't ready to put the Peugeot on the road.
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Old 06-25-08, 09:58 PM
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Old 06-25-08, 10:46 PM
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Originally Posted by grifone37 View Post
This comment is reminiscent of the recent “I hate French BBs” thread...
Bob, you must have missed my reply above - I was kidding - I don't REALLY hate French stuff - see above. I actually LIKE French stuff. Except 7mm chainring bolts. Oh yeah, and boudin noir.

Thank you folks I'm here all week (que drums and cymbal). I'll lay off the humor now as it obviously isn't my forte. Did I mention my ancestors are from France? Sheesh, you guys are a rough crowd. Vive la France!
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Old 06-25-08, 11:28 PM
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I want to pee on Tulio's grave. Most local bike shops in my area don't have Italian bottom brackets and if they do I get nickel and dimed.

Suntour shifts better than Campy.
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Old 06-25-08, 11:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Kommisar89 View Post
..... I was kidding - I don't REALLY hate French stuff - see above. I actually LIKE French stuff. Except 7mm chainring bolts.
Heh - I do. I have a Motobecane Grand Touring that I'm overhauling, and the Pivo stem bolt is 7mm. I've tried ALL the local hardware stores, and no one has a 7mm hex key. No one. Now I gotta go mail-order if I want to rebuild the headset.

Stupid French.
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Old 06-26-08, 12:52 AM
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Originally Posted by bigbossman View Post
Heh - I do. I have a Motobecane Grand Touring that I'm overhauling, and the Pivo stem bolt is 7mm. I've tried ALL the local hardware stores, and no one has a 7mm hex key. No one. Now I gotta go mail-order if I want to rebuild the headset.

Stupid French.
My genuine Italian Carnielli stem has that same 7mm bolt. Wonder if it was made in France?
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Old 11-09-09, 08:51 PM
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the stronglight crank may use the same connecting bolts as TA cranks. We had some made, and have some NOS hardware too:
http://velo-orange.com/tapro5visch.html
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Old 11-09-09, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by bigbossman View Post
I have a Motobecane Grand Touring that I'm overhauling, and the Pivo stem bolt is 7mm. I've tried ALL the local hardware stores, and no one has a 7mm hex key. No one. Now I gotta go mail-order if I want to rebuild the headset.
Huh? You must really live out in the boondocks. I mean, I've got a Husky multi size hex key set of metric sizes that includes everything from 1.5mm through 5.5mm in 0.5mm increments and 6mm through 10mm in 1mm increments. I bought it at Home Depot, but probably WalMart has them also. Cost me maybe $5. Anyway, I've got Cinelli stems that use both 6mm and 7mm, and a French stem that uses 7mm. If you want to talk non-standard sizes, try finding a 25.5mm seatpost for an early 1970s Mercier or Puch Cavalier or Whitworth fastener sizes. Fortunately, I long ago obtained all the necessary tools to work on my French bikes and parts, such as a puller for my 2 Stronglight 99 cranksets.
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Old 11-09-09, 10:15 PM
  #15  
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Originally Posted by bigbossman View Post
Heh - I do. I have a Motobecane Grand Touring that I'm overhauling, and the Pivo stem bolt is 7mm. I've tried ALL the local hardware stores, and no one has a 7mm hex key. No one.
Ha! I just went through that two weeks ago. Luckily, I eventually found a cheapo set for 10 bucks that included the 7. Up until then I felt like Steve Martin trying to buy the correct number of hot dog buns in Father of the Bride.

Go ahead and swear all you want Kommisar. Obviously, anyone expressing or sympathizing with the sentiment is someone who likes French bikes or they wouldn't be bothering enough to get annoyed with it.
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