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Show off that Randonneur; and let's discuss the bike, the gear, the sport

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Show off that Randonneur; and let's discuss the bike, the gear, the sport

Old 11-15-18, 10:37 AM
  #551  
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Originally Posted by rhm
...as long as most riders are on skinny tires, most brevets will have to be designed to accommodate them. This means busier roads. I did a grand brevet at the end of August that was entirely on roads deemed acceptable to people on skinny tires, which included some roads that were downright dangerous. Some unpaved roads had been considered but rejected on the pre-ride. I cannot second guess that decision, of course. But one way or another, fatter tires open up possibilities that are not available to those on skinny tires...
I was on the pre-ride, and the decision to skip the gravel in favor of the busier roads was based on the velomobiles, recumbents and tandems that we knew would have problems with some of the soft sand and rough gravel sections. So as long as those bikes are allowed on brevets, the rides will be designed to accommodate them. Run-of-the-mill skinny tire road bikes actually didn't factor into the decision.

By the way, I have RTPs on my tandem that I wouldn't hesitate to take on a brevet if my stoker were up for it, and an 80's dirt-drop that would be fine comfort-wise for any brevet, it just wouldn't be my first choice because the gearing is a little low and I don't think it would be as fast as some of my other bikes which are at least as comfortable.
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Old 11-15-18, 10:53 AM
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Old 11-15-18, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by kingston
I was on the pre-ride, and the decision to skip the gravel in favor of the busier roads was based on the velomobiles, recumbents and tandems....
Ah, right! I wasn't thinking of those. The tyranny of the minority!
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Old 11-15-18, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by justinsdrake
What are your thoughts on converting an early 80s MTB to rando with new wheels and those supple rat trap pass tires?
The fat 26" Compass tires themselves are fantastic. My drop-bar MTB conversion picked up a little speed and comfort with 1.8" Naches Pass tires over the 1.75" Paselas.

@rhm covered most of the downsides to using an 80's MTB frame. The geometry is designed for a much more upright posture, so even when you do convert them to drops and a lower position, you're still fighting a lot of trail and wheel flop which can get tiring on longer rides.

I've seen a few custom 26" wheeled bikes designed from the ground up for Rat Trap Pass tires. With lightweight tubing/parts and road or "rando" geometry, that would make a killer do-everything bike.
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Old 11-15-18, 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Scottybigs
Keeping this thread alive. I road an almost-century (145 km...really should have done donuts in the parking lot or something) last week, and feel like my Schwinn Voyageur SP is in that near-perfect build phase for getting up to the 200km brevet level.

It's at 26lbs now (without the bag), which is getting into a great weight for a fully equipped bike. I've got a pair of 700c Pacenti Brevets waiting to be laced to 105 hubs, which will drop almost 1 lb off the wheels since the A319's are boat anchors, as are the vintage hubs and freewheel.

I do wish that the frame was made of Reynolds 725 or Kaisei tubing, not because of the weight savings per se, but because of the flex and performance. Tange 2 is great, but my 725 Wabi frame is noticeable stiffer and more responsive.

One thing I've been mulling over is geometry. The Schwinn has 44cm chainstays to account for rear panniers, and 72/72 frame angles. Does anyone ride brevets with mid-range chainstays (42cm) and 73/73 angles? How does it feel?

That does look great! What specs do you have in mind for the new wheels? Those are a good place to save weight -- if you're careful not to add it back inadvertently.

P.S. There might be a little "opportunity" in that seat post, too...
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Old 11-15-18, 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted by ThermionicScott
That does look great! What specs do you have in mind for the new wheels? Those are a good place to save weight -- if you're careful not to add it back inadvertently.

P.S. There might be a little "opportunity" in that seat post, too...
Thanks! I've already got the 32H Pacenti Brevet rims, but am going to start looking for hubs. I'd like to try and find a pair of vintage Ultegra 9-speed hubs on the C+V sales, to semi-sync with the 600EX derailleurs.

The seatpost is a pretty short SR Laprade - which I think is light-ish? I actually haven't put the weight weenie lens on it yet. The stem, on the other hand....:




The 90mm stem that I have is half the weight of the Dia Compe ENE stem I had previously. Was a bit shocked - and I bought it for $40 off a guy on my street!
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Old 11-15-18, 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Scottybigs
Thanks! I've already got the 32H Pacenti Brevet rims, but am going to start looking for hubs. I'd like to try and find a pair of vintage Ultegra 9-speed hubs on the C+V sales, to semi-sync with the 600EX derailleurs.

The seatpost is a pretty short SR Laprade - which I think is light-ish? I actually haven't put the weight weenie lens on it yet. The stem, on the other hand....:


The 90mm stem that I have is half the weight of the Dia Compe ENE stem I had previously. Was a bit shocked - and I bought it for $40 off a guy on my street!
Wow, that is a light stem! Now I'm tempted to look for one of those. Mine is a "porky" 277 grams.

As for the seatpost, I was able to save 40 grams by moving from a Laprade-style to a Kalloy Uno. (I cut both to about the same length before using.) Considering that I only spent $12 or so on it, that was a really inexpensive weight savings compared to what people will spend to shave 40 grams elsewhere.
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Old 11-15-18, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by rhm

*Old MTB's are a possiblity, but the high bottom bracket and slack geometry are an issue. Also, these frames are built heavy and tough, which is not great for randonneuring. If I were building up a bike for these tires now, I would look at getting an off the shelf frame made for either 650b or 26" wheels with disk brakes (I'm thinking of the Crust Romanceur, I think), and I'd have a custom fork made to fit it with 26" rims and cantilever brakes.
Have you looked at the Velo Orange Polyvalent? Designed for 650bX47 or 26X2.3. Nice colors, too.
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Old 11-15-18, 05:15 PM
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Originally Posted by beicster
Have you looked at the Velo Orange Polyvalent? Designed for 650bX47 or 26X2.3. Nice colors, too.
I have not. To be clear, I'm just not in the market. I had a custom frame made, and I'm happy with it. At the time I insisted on cantilever brakes front and back, but were I doing it again I would go with disc brakes on the rear; and this opens up options that are not fully custom, and therefore cheaper. I'd still insist on rim brakes in front, which most likely means a custom fork.

the reason for rim brakes in front is that a fork made for disc brakes has to be built much heavier and stronger than a fork for rim brakes, and I assume the disc brake fork will result in a less comfortable ride. I don't know, but perhaps the fat tires will adequately compensate for that; i think it's a fair question. At any rate I gladly confess a prejudice against disc brakes. I really don't know whether it's justified.
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Old 11-15-18, 06:38 PM
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Originally Posted by non-fixie


If you're limited to a very small frame size, then it may be a useful workaround, but they tend to have high BB's, giving you a high center of gravity and issues when stopping, such as at trafiic lights. Also, bigger wheels roll better over rough roads.
So, my advice would be to get the biggest wheels you can fit, and on a road frame. Me, I would love 30" wheels.
And would you love 36" wheels?
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Old 11-16-18, 09:35 AM
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Originally Posted by MarcoBianchi
And would you love 36" wheels?
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Those are cool.

Back when 700c was introduced, the average frame size was a lot smaller, and 700c was the biggest you could fit without running into problems, such as toe overlap. I mostly ride 62 to 64 cm frames, and 700c wheels are beginning to look a bit small and out of proportion. Especially on post-1980 bikes, like this Peloton Superlite:

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Old 11-16-18, 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by non-fixie
Those are cool.
But heavy.

The lightest of the three models I see listed, the 2x10, is 18.9 kg (= 41.7 lbs).The single speed is even heavier, +0.5 kg / 1 lb.

Iím not sure why they would need to be so heavy.

Suddenly, my dropbar MTB conversion doesnít seem too bad.
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Old 11-16-18, 05:20 PM
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41.7 lbs is lighter than Charles Terront's winning bike in the inaugural PBP, but I wouldn't choose a bike that heavy for actual randonneuring.
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Old 11-16-18, 06:15 PM
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Not the best but I don't have more pics.
Originally Posted by ThermionicScott
41.7 lbs is lighter than Charles Terront's winning bike in the inaugural PBP, but I wouldn't choose a bike that heavy for actual randonneuring.
Of course, the rarity is in the wheel size. As CO_hoya said above I'd prefer my Trek 950 drop bar conversion. 8-)
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Old 11-17-18, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by justinsdrake
What are your thoughts on converting an early 80s MTB to rando with new wheels and those supple rat trap pass tires?
If you were going to do a lot of brevetes on rough gravel roads, Iíd say, ďGo for it!Ē I think my sig contains a link (canít see it on mobile) to my Ď83 Stumpy. Itís mostly original but for the tires, fenders and crankset. I love riding it on gravel and donít feel sluggish on it. I have ergonomic grips on it now which have vastly improved hand comfort when spending hours in the saddle. So far my longest ride is about 35 miles, but front loaded for light touring and probably four hours over rough terrain for much of it.

For road riding, I found 650x38 tires to be just great. 42ís would handle county gravel roads even better, but the 38ís get by most maintained gravel roads just fine.

If if I had a bike that only fit 30mm tires and fenders, Iíd look into the feasibility of a 650b conversion...

As for stock 26Ē wheel Rando bikes: VO has been mentioned, FMBxEndpoint Hunter/Gatherer, and the ones I desperately want, Elephant NFE or Crust Romanceur.

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Old 11-17-18, 09:48 AM
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Originally Posted by non-fixie
Those are cool.

Back when 700c was introduced, the average frame size was a lot smaller, and 700c was the biggest you could fit without running into problems, such as toe overlap. I mostly ride 62 to 64 cm frames, and 700c wheels are beginning to look a bit small and out of proportion.
I feel the same. I love the way my 25.5" Super Course fits but it can look a little out of proportion, even with 700c wheels. I was running 650b on it for a while but it just looked too odd to my eye to stick with them.
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Old 11-18-18, 05:32 PM
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I've used this 1982 Trek 412 on a couple brevets now. Including this Saturday's Mt Lemmon 200k.

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Old 11-19-18, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by mountaindave

I think my sig contains a link (canít see it on mobile) to my Ď83 Stumpy. Itís mostly original but for the tires, fenders and crankset. I love riding it on gravel and donít feel sluggish on it. I have ergonomic grips on it bow which have vastly improved hand comfor when spending hours in the saddle. So far my longest ride is about 35 miles, but front loaded for light touring and probably four hours over rough terrain for much of it.
Mountaindave - Your Stumpy is kind of what I was aiming for but maybe putting dirt drops on there. I have an 85 Schwinn Cimarron with fairly light tubing considering its vintage and original purpose. But as I am coming to understand, there is a tool (bike) for every job. N+1 right?

The MTB conversion is probably better to focus and build for more off pavement riding.
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Old 11-19-18, 09:27 PM
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Here is a late 70's Charrel Randonneur. 531 Reynolds, Simplex mech, Stronglight crank and headset. Joy to ride, smooth, fast and dry.


Interesting features: internally routed brake and shift cables, Charrel built brakes, fender stay attachments brazed onto the drop outs, one of the most beautiful frork crowns I have ever seen. The bike
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Old 11-19-18, 09:52 PM
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Agreed - cool fork crown!
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Old 11-19-18, 10:55 PM
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Rawland gets dusted off


It seems to have become a tradition; as the weather gets dicey, wet, little snow and ice, i switch back over to a bike with flatter tires. My Rawland has Grand Bios Hetres right now. I moved from bar-end shifters to 10sp Ultegra STI. Not sure I am diggin' the STI on this bike.
Pure comfort. I am in a dilemma though; I need to decide if I want to keep the Rawland, or the Trek 620; not enough space for both.. I'd like to take all the components; move everything to the Trek and keep the Trek. But the Rawland is 650B; so I would end up with a frame/fork and wheels. I would have to go through the hassle of selling frame/fork/wheels.
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Old 11-19-18, 11:53 PM
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Originally Posted by vintagerando
Pure comfort. I am in a dilemma though; I need to decide if I want to keep the Rawland, or the Trek 620; not enough space for both.. I'd like to take all the components; move everything to the Trek and keep the Trek. But the Rawland is 650B; so I would end up with a frame/fork and wheels. I would have to go through the hassle of selling frame/fork/wheels.
That doesn't sound like a dilemma - keep the Stag, move the 620 on and use the funds for a sexy front rack/bag combo. I'm guessing the 620 has canti's for 700c, so limited in tire widths. Plus, the Stag is just about perfectly set up for what you use it.

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Old 11-22-18, 02:48 PM
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no competition, keep the Rawland
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Old 01-26-19, 03:34 AM
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The Bob Jackson World Tour. I read everything I could lay my hands on concerning audax / rando / and distance in general. Everything is a compromise, So I decided I would build something that would work for me. At 63 I get tired and that compromises what reflexes I have left, so fit and comfort slows the onset of fatigue this means my brain and body will be able to work longer.
The things that work for me are a long wheelbase and slack angles for a nice ride and stability with handling that remains crisp . Gearing wide enough to cover anything, a rear triangle stiff enough the bike will climb well, light enough that the weight is not an issue yet strong enough that reliability is lot a problem.
The bike looks vintage but ts not, The frame was a semi custom order from Bob Jackson in 2015 with arrow head lugs and standard size 631 butted tubing, assembled with kit I found astically pleasing yet bombproof. The photos were taken about an hour after assembly so no bar tape and unrefined cable routing, I am happy with the result.












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Old 01-26-19, 04:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Nemosengineer
The Bob Jackson World Tour.
Thatís a beauty. What are the hubs, Curtis Odom?
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