Another mystery frame....
 

So these are pictures a friend of mine posted on Facebook, sorry about the quality. Anyone have an idea? She says it is a Centurion frame, and that's all she knows.

It has Suntour Cyclone components (with Shimano shifters).

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...51_2270831.jpg

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...51_2270832.jpg

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...51_2270833.jpg

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...51_2270834.jpg

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...51_2270837.jpg

that's a nice frame, looks like the top-of-the-line from back in the '70s: a Cinelli-copy forkcrown and seat cluster, and the perfed BB shell is like one that Nishiki also used. I have read sketchy reports of there being a '70s Cinelli-built Centurion (NOT the Cinelli-Centurion Equipe, which was an '80s deal and has been very well documented), though this is made with early Tange Champion and so would surely have been produced in Japan (or...would it?)
Questions: are those vertical drop-outs labeled Campy, Shimano or (my guess) SunTour?
What size seat post? What BB threading?

I will have to ask her and get back to you on that.

Also, it says "Professional" in gold lettering on the toptube, which you probably cannot see in these images.

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...51_2270840.jpg

And it says something around the BB too.

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...51_2270839.jpg

And the Shimano shifters / Crown shot.

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w...51_2270838.jpg

OK it's a 1.37" x 24 BB, so it confirms it to be a Japanese-made Centurion (almost certain anyway, but that helps to close the loopholes)...any holes (like 3-in-a-row) in the lugs?

Nice eye on the BB size! I can see it now, but wouldn't have been able to before.

I'll ask about the holes too.

Yes, late 1970s Centurion Professional.

I had a Centurian that was identical to a Windsor Pro once... don't know the story on that. Same candy orange color.

TMar, would you have any more info on this bike? I've search BF and haven't found a single thread on them, and cannot find anything by means of google, as "Centurion Professional" seems to be a training company :)

Thanks!

I owned a bike shop from 80-87 and we occasionally sold the low end Centurions. They were always very very nicely finished frames compared to the competition. The company that distributed them was called something like Western States Cycle. It was the same company that sold the BMX bikes called Diamond Back. The reason I mention this is that in the mid/late 80s, the company stopped calling their road bikes Centurions and changed their name to Diamond Back and the Centurion brand ceased to exist from then on. I may have gotten some of the details wrong but thats the general story of why you don't see Centurion any more.

Dan

Dan,

Thanks for the great info...really interesting how companies and brands change over time.

The Centurion brand was created when a bicycle sales agent, Mitchel Weiner, got involved in a Raleigh project to develop a Japanese version of the Grand Prix in 1969. Raleigh backed out of the deal and Weiner was stuck with 2000 Grand Prix clones which he labeled as Centurion and made a handsome profit selling them in California. Centurion was distributed though his company, Western States Imports, and was a very popular road bicycle brand through the 1980s. In 1978, the company started the Diamond Back brand for their BMX bicycles and later applied it to their ATBs. 1989 was unprofitable and Mitchel sold his stake in the company. This was also the last year for Centurion in the US, as the new owners consolidated all the models under the Diamond back brand, though Centurion continues in Europe to this day.

Weiner had success using a clone of the Grand Prix and obviously decided to clone a Cinelli for his top end model. A similar approach was used by Windsor for their Mexican manfactured Professional. I'm not sure of the exact production dates for the Professionals but the newest sample I've seen is from 1980 and they were certainly gone by 1983, having been replaced by the Turbo. The North Star head badge is typical of late 1970s models, so I suspect that is also the era of your friend's, though the serial number will provide a definitive answer. The tubing is Tange butted CrMo, though it is unclear which grade. Period literature does not specify the grade and decals ,when still present, tend to be generic. Regardless, the the samples I've seen tend to be well designed and manufactured.