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I need some guidance/advice from some home-made bike mechanics

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I need some guidance/advice from some home-made bike mechanics

Old 10-08-09, 09:23 AM
  #51  
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Start with a lockring tool, a fixed cup tool, a pin spanner and crank puller.
I agree with that list, except why the fixed cup tool?

I have the Hozan lockring wrench, and I'm surprised it costs so much, as I've had it for a long time, but it works well.

I refuse to use the word "spanner" because it is merely the British word for "wrench." There is no difference.
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Old 10-08-09, 09:39 AM
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After you get the fixed cup and the BB interior clean and dry, lay the bike down on its right side, and layer fresh grease pretty thick onto the right side bearing race, inside the BB. You'll place the balls into that grease bed, one at a time. Embed them in the grease with your fingers. You won't be moving the frame from this position until the balls are secured by the BB axle, if all goes well. You'll need to use either one or two extra balls, compared to the number of balls in the caged bearing set.

Next you can either cover the balls with a thin layer of grease, or pack a 1/8" bead of grease on the BB axle bearing surface, and carefully insert the BB axle through the hole in the fixed cup, working from the inside of the BB shell. Once this is all the way in, you should be able to turn the shaft and feel nice smooth ball bearing action.
Ok, sounds easy enough.

Did the right (drive) side bb cup thread in towards the front of the bike (right handed), or towards the rear (left handed)?

If left, its probably english or swiss. If right, its french.
I have no idea. I haven't taken the drive side cup out. I was under the impression that I didn't have to.

Will my local bike shop have the bearings and cotters? Just to make sure, 1/4" is the bearing size I need correct? Also, is that grease I have pictured acceptable to use?

One more question. Is there a way to tighten the lock ring without a lock ring wrench? Or will I have to buy/borrow one?
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Old 10-08-09, 10:02 AM
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When you get teh old balls clean, measure them, or take them with you to the bike shop. Compare the new balls to the old balls.

I'm not sure you'll need new cotters.

Some people here like Park blue grease, and I've used that and Pedro's.
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Old 10-08-09, 10:08 AM
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Thanks Road Fan. I'll just take them in with me. The cotters are in ok shape, but I think I messed up the threads on at least one of them when I was taking them out.
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Old 10-08-09, 10:17 AM
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Get a lockring wrench. Really. Nothing else works as well.
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Old 10-08-09, 12:19 PM
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Pardon my ignorance, but what is a "pin spanner" used for?
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Old 10-08-09, 12:24 PM
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it's used for things like adjustable cups on a bottom bracket:

fits into the holes (see below).

photo's courtesy Park Tool and Velobase.com respectively.
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Old 10-08-09, 01:02 PM
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not all BB adjustable cups use a pin spanner, some have flats that fit a standard wrench. Its either one or the other...its simple to tell which just by looking at the outside of the Adjustable cup.

+1 get a lockring wrench. If there's 2 specialty bike tools that you'll ever want its a lockring wrench and a chain link press.


When putting the bearings into the fixed cup (which will still be on the bike) i've had good success squeezing a load of grease into the fixed cup and inserting the Bearings one by one through the hole in the cup.

Hold the frame sideways with the fixed cup on the bottom and just pop the bearings in through the hole in the cup from the bottom. The grease is thick and will hold the bearings in place.

That grease you have should be fine
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Old 10-08-09, 01:10 PM
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Thanks CravenMoarhead. I have a chain tool so I guess I just need to bite the bullet and get a lockring wrench.

The cup on this bike looks like it just accepts a regular wrench so I should be good there. What do most people use to apply grease? I know there are grease guns, but is there some other trick that anybody has come up with to do it without one?

When I'm off work I will go to the bike shop and see if I can get some bearings and cotters. I'll report back with how it goes. Thanks everyone.
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Old 10-08-09, 01:20 PM
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I apply grease with my fingers!
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Old 10-08-09, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by lotek
I apply grease with my fingers!
I don't think I would expect anything else from somebody with that name!
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Old 10-08-09, 02:09 PM
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Regards the Hozan Lock-Ring Wrench:

The one's being made today are notably inferior to the older ones. Due to this depreciation of quality, Harris Cyclery (Sheldon Brown's nest) has stopped offering these for sale. If you find some old stock around - grab one! Otherwise you'll have to be contented with something like what Park Tool offers.
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Old 10-08-09, 02:17 PM
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Right now I have a Park HCW-5 Double-Ended Lock Ring Spanner, a universal spoke wrench and a Park DCW-4 13x15mm Double-Ended Cone Wrench in my basket. I'm waiting to figure out if I will need anything else before I pull the trigger though.
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Old 10-08-09, 02:19 PM
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Another technique, which I occasionally use, is to slather grease on the race portion of the axle, insert the balls on that layer of grease, and gingerly insert the axle into the fixed cup. There is good potential for one or more balls to fall, but I usually manage to do the job.
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Old 10-08-09, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by lotek
I apply grease with my fingers!

+1 for a greasy finger.



to the op: if you're about to place an order for tools/parts it might be a good time to order yourself new cotters. They're like $3-4 for a pack of 10. Just be sure to check the size on your cotters..there's 3 sizes. 9.5mm, 9mm and 8.5mm... Chances are if your cranks are french its 9mm, but measuring is always a good thing.
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Old 10-08-09, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by flammenwurfer
Thanks Road Fan. I'll just take them in with me. The cotters are in ok shape, but I think I messed up the threads on at least one of them when I was taking them out.


just run the nuts down the threads. If they run clean and there are no visible blemishes on the threads, there's not likely to be a problem.
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Old 10-08-09, 03:50 PM
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Originally Posted by flammenwurfer
So, you say I should use loose bearings? Does that mean just bearings alone, and not ones that are in a plastic clip/holder thing like in this picture? If they aren't in a clip, how would I get them in there when I put everything back together without them going all over the place?


When I do put the bearings back in, is this grease ok to use? Or is there a specific kind you are supposed to use?


And here's a pic of the bike now with almost everything taken off.
You're doing fine! The "simple but effective" rope bike stand shows initiative. Lithium grease will be OK. If I'm leaving the right hand cup in the frame I normally poke a thick bed of grease through the spindle hole with my finger and rotate the finger to spread it evenly around the inside of the cup. Then insert the bearings (balls) one at a time in the same way, all the way around and push them down into the grease. Spread a large dollop of grease all the way around the bearing face (raised collar) on that side of the spindle and push it in from the other side so the spindle emerges from the hole in the right hand cup.

Take the left hand cup and again fill it with a thick ring of grease and embed the balls in this all the way around. spread another layer of grease over the top of the balls and grease the cup threads. Put the hole in the cup over the left end of the spindle and carefully screw it into the frame. Put on the lock ring and adjust as described in previous posts. Wipe any spare grease off the ends of the spindles and outsides of the cups - and you're done!
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Old 10-08-09, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by lotek
I apply grease with my fingers!
+1 Fingers!
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Old 10-08-09, 07:47 PM
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I was just thinking. Is there any trick to putting cotters back in? do I just pound them back in and tighten the nuts?
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Old 10-09-09, 06:51 AM
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I rarely get them out without destroying them, so I rarely put them "back" in. Anyway, putting them back in involves pounding them in with a hammer. Of course, you have to support the bottom bracket with something such as a block of wood so the shock doesn't go to the bearings. The cotter may not be the right thickness, so you have to bang it in part-way, bang it out, file it, bang it in. Repeat until it fits, then bang it in all the way.

It's one of the most annoying jobs on a bike.
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Old 10-09-09, 06:56 AM
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You might consider a cotter press if you're going to keep the cottered crankset.
the only one I know of that is still in production is this
https://bikesmithdesign.com/CotterPress/
but it's not cheap, excellent quality and worth the $ if you need it.
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Old 10-09-09, 06:58 AM
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Oh golly, I can't wait to do that part! haha So that is the part that makes people hate cottered cranks huh?

I think I'll go with the hammer method for now. I'm trying to do this while spending as little money as possible.
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Old 10-09-09, 07:01 AM
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No, don't do the hammer! It can cause problems. If you don't have the cotter press, make do with a big C-clamp, or better yet a bench vise.
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Old 10-09-09, 07:03 AM
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Ok, I have a C-clamp, I'll give that a shot.
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Old 10-09-09, 07:11 AM
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Originally Posted by flammenwurfer
Ok, I have a C-clamp, I'll give that a shot.
Good. You'll want a spacer of some sort, such as a block of wood with a hole in it, to put over the other end of the cotter. Make the spacer as big as possible, so you don't have too much of the threads of the C-clamp showing, because that's where the flex will be. Put the fixed end of the clamp on the cotter, and the spacer on the moveable (threaded) part. Make sense?
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