Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

My 1960 Continental (is this the correct rear derailleur?)

Notices
Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

My 1960 Continental (is this the correct rear derailleur?)

Old 01-01-10, 11:26 PM
  #1  
fiataccompli
Steel Member
Thread Starter
 
fiataccompli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 1,480

Bikes: N + 1

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
My 1960 Continental (is this the correct rear derailleur?)

I guess this is a piece of American cycling history....I found this bike advertised with a picture of it hanging upside down and zero detail. It turned out to be complete and generally functional, actually. I thought i'd share some pictures of it. Sorry, it's not a piece of beauty like some of the other Continentals I've seen here, but it's on it's way to be well-loved even if it keeps it's natural patina. Someone commented that the rear derailleurs on these were often replaced (maybe a recall or something?). This one is a Simplex (like the front) and it happens to be the same as one I have on another bike (and was original to a 1982 Peugeot). The cable stop plastic housing is broken on the one on the Conti, so if this is indeed the correct rear derailleur for the bike, I suppose that means I'm looking for one. If not, I probably have a semi-appropriate '70s Suntour that will do the job just fine. Here are pics of the bike:














(notice the stylish addition of modern zip ties to render the rear derailleur functional for the 5 gears....)
fiataccompli is offline  
Old 01-01-10, 11:40 PM
  #2  
oldbobcat
Senior Member
 
oldbobcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Boulder County, CO
Posts: 3,234

Bikes: '79 Gios, '80 Masi, '06 Felt, early '60s Frejus

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 95 Post(s)
Liked 69 Times in 51 Posts
That's a purty durned old Continental--definitely pre- bike boom.

At least from around 1969 on, Chicago Schwinns came with Schwinn-badged Huret Allvit derailleurs. In my opinion the Simplex Prestige is an upgrade.
oldbobcat is offline  
Old 01-01-10, 11:44 PM
  #3  
auchencrow
Senior Member
 
auchencrow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Detroit
Posts: 10,327
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 8 Times in 6 Posts
I can't answer your question on the originality of that DR , fiataccompli, but whether or not it's original I'd still be looking for an original replacement. I would suggest some gumwalls on this bike. Panaracers have lovely color and are not expensive.

BTW - did I tell you this is a really cool bike? I love the "patina" and the decals and the gold paint. I had an early 60's Schwinn (not a Conti) in the same color and still enjoy seeing it . I think that Ashtabula crank is a thing of beauty too, and a great design in its day.
auchencrow is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 12:28 AM
  #4  
Grand Bois
Senior Member
 
Grand Bois's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Pinole, CA, USA
Posts: 17,415
Mentioned: 24 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 436 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 8 Times in 8 Posts
I think that a Simplex Prestige is the correct derailer. You shouldn't have any trouble finding a replacement. You might want to buy a spare. They don't last long.

I love the graphics on that frame.
Grand Bois is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 12:53 AM
  #5  
jacksbike
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: New Haven, CT area
Posts: 1,409

Bikes: Trek 7.5 Hybrid, Trek 1.1 Road, Holdsworth touring,Raleigh International,Ritchey Commando,Italvega Speciallissimo,et.al.

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 6 Times in 6 Posts
My opinion is that it came with a Huret rear derailleur. It is a little bit before my time, but I do not think that Schwinn used Simplex. Otherwise, love the bike !!
jacksbike is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 01:01 AM
  #6  
DavidW56
Senior Member
 
DavidW56's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Metro Detroit
Posts: 1,240
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Very nice! Love that color! I'd be tempted to add chrome fenders.
DavidW56 is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 07:15 AM
  #7  
sonatageek
Senior Member
 
sonatageek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Cleveland,Ohio
Posts: 2,784
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
If it were mine and I was going to be riding it, I would upgrade the RD to the Suntour unit.

That has to be what, a 1960 model?
sonatageek is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 07:52 AM
  #8  
pastorbobnlnh 
Freewheel Medic
 
pastorbobnlnh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Ascending or Descending the NH Mountains NW of Concord!
Posts: 11,562

Bikes: Snazzy* Schwinns, Classy Cannondales, & a Lonely '83 Santana Tandem (* Ed.)

Mentioned: 97 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 668 Post(s)
Liked 273 Times in 181 Posts
That Simplex RD is not original. I have a '62 Continental and it came with an early version of the Huret Alvit. As you can see, the chrome on mine is in poor shape. Currently it sits in a spare parts box and I use a different RD and FD on mine.

Bob Hufford's Details on the 1960 Continental read:
First year for the derailleur Continental. 10 speed. Stronglight 47/50 chainset. 15-17-19-22-25 Atom freewheel cluster. Simplex Competition front derailleur and Simplex Tour de France rear derailleur. Weinmann side pull brakes. Tubular painted fork with chromed tips. Forged alloy stem with double clamp bolts. Steel? drop bars. Tire size is listed as 27 x 1� (correct) in the consumer brochure, but as 26" (incorrect) in the model and price sheet. Rims were Rigida steel with knurls on the sides. Hubs were alloy high flange (Normandy?). Yellorex chain. Ideale saddle (#43). Colors were Radiant Red, Radiant Blue, Radiant Green, Radiant Coppertone, and Black.
It looks as if you have made a great find that is nearly original!

__________________
Bob
Dreaming about riding in NH's summertime!

Visit my websites:
FreeWheelSpa.com orpastorbobnlnh.com
pastorbobnlnh is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 08:01 AM
  #9  
Mos6502
Elitest Murray Owner
 
Mos6502's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,660

Bikes: 1972 Columbia Tourist Expert III, Columbia Roadster

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 2 Posts
The early 1960 bikes came with pull chain simplex derailleurs. By 1961, Schwinn had switched to Huret.

Here's some pics, of an original setup: https://bikeville.blogspot.com/2009/0...erailleur.html

I don't believe that Schwinn ever used a parallelogram simplex, even though they work better than the Huret alvits usually.

Last edited by Mos6502; 01-02-10 at 08:13 AM.
Mos6502 is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 08:44 AM
  #10  
dit
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Middle TN
Posts: 653

Bikes: 2 Centurian Ironman, Rossin Genisis, Greenspeed GT3, Stowaway (wife)

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
In a couple of my posts I have alluded to a gold colored Continental that my best high school bud rode. I don't remember details of the bike but it sure looked like your find. He thought the frame was aluminum. I do know that the Continental was lighter than his brothers red Varsity in 1960 and it did have 27" wheels.
dit is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 09:08 AM
  #11  
fiataccompli
Steel Member
Thread Starter
 
fiataccompli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 1,480

Bikes: N + 1

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
THanks for the info on the RD. I'll probably do the suntour option from my parts bin. I love that Simplex RD....the other one I have has migrated through two bikes now. It's just smoooooth....very French feeling, I guess.

On this bike, the stem & bars (and brake levers/housings and brakes) are aluminum. I also have a '73 Conti & the bars & stem on that bike are also aluminum...but by then it was all 'Schwinn Approved' stuff and had stem shifters, safety levers and a seriously (IMHO) ugly huge front crankset w/ a guard.

Oh....should the '60 have a form of quick release hubs?
fiataccompli is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 09:20 AM
  #12  
Mos6502
Elitest Murray Owner
 
Mos6502's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,660

Bikes: 1972 Columbia Tourist Expert III, Columbia Roadster

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by fiataccompli View Post
Oh....should the '60 have a form of quick release hubs?
nope
Mos6502 is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 09:37 AM
  #13  
iab
Senior Member
 
iab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: NW Burbs, Chicago
Posts: 10,651
Mentioned: 146 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2133 Post(s)
Liked 1,231 Times in 573 Posts
Sweet bike.

I have used the Huret Tour de France RD. Basically an exact copy of the Simplex that Mos6502 posted. Like the Simplex, it is a chain pull and not a parallelogram RD. It is the worst POS I have ever experienced. I switched it to a Campagnolo Gran Sport and I will never go back.

Your shift lever looks original. Do you have a better picture of it?
iab is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 09:41 AM
  #14  
bernardmarx
Hair Club Member
 
bernardmarx's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: East Tennessee
Posts: 127

Bikes: '86 Miyata 310 '78 Raleigh Sports 3-Speed

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Hey Fiat, love that bike! So cool that you're keeping the seat-tube rod-actuated front derailler and half-step front rings. +1 on the Panaracer gumwalls - I love them on my Miyata. You know, they make aluminium Ashtabula cranks now (for the BMX market). When you have to rebuild the bottom bracket (which requires no special tools on this bike) it would be an easy upgrade. So nice to see such a beautiful example from a time when Schwinn was keeping the flame for adult cycling.
bernardmarx is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 10:23 AM
  #15  
Grand Bois
Senior Member
 
Grand Bois's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Pinole, CA, USA
Posts: 17,415
Mentioned: 24 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 436 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 8 Times in 8 Posts
If the bike originally had a Huret RD, that means that either the FD is not original or that Schwinn mixed brands on the same bike. I know that the Simplex FD is original because I remember them well. It's not likely that they mixed brands.
Grand Bois is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 12:11 PM
  #16  
fiataccompli
Steel Member
Thread Starter
 
fiataccompli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 1,480

Bikes: N + 1

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
That's kinda what I was thinking. I'd like to keep it as original as possible. I don't need it to be a 'do everything' bike so I plan on enjoying it for what it is (or, what it was in 1960, I guess). I might put an aluminum rim in front and I suppose a bit of function over form for the RD would be in order & ultimately, the plastic "Grand Prix" seat that must have replaced the original Ideale leather seat would likely be replaced with something leather (I have a Belt from a '76 Fuji, but putting a Japanese part on it just doesn't seem right), but otherwise, it's cool with me as it is. Getting it lighter by great expense or input of work doesn't make sense when I have a dozen wonderful riding lugged steel bikes that are 20-30 years newer that give me the 21lb fun rides to keep up with the folks on their 17 lb modern machines.... All that said, thanks all of you for the thumbs up & input/info. Rest assured this one won't be recycled.
fiataccompli is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 06:29 PM
  #17  
sykerocker 
Senior Member
 
sykerocker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Ashland, VA
Posts: 4,348

Bikes: The keepers: 1958 Raleigh Lenton Grand Prix, 1968 Ranger, 1969 Magneet Sprint, 1971 Gitane Tour de France, 1973 Raleigh Tourist, 3 - 1986 Rossins, and a '77 PX-10 frame in process.

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 200 Post(s)
Liked 147 Times in 88 Posts
I'm not terribly good on the individual derailleur model names before the late 60's (hell, back in the early 1960's, I didn't even realize that Schwinn made anything but the balloon tyred middleweights - then again, I wasn't even a teenager at that time), but I'm certain that Schwinn used some version of the Simplex pull-chain derailleur on the rear. I'd start seriously looking for one. From what I understand, they aren't the greatest shifters in the world (Campagnolo's Gran Sport was miles ahead of the competition at that time), but I've seen them for sale, and while not cheap they aren't prohibitively expensive.

You've got something rare enough there that going back to original would be almost mandatory. And I'd love to see what it looks like after a disassembly, gentle cleaning and polish, and reassembly. That's the kind of bike you want to take to shows!
__________________
Syke

“No one in this world, so far as I know — and I have searched the records for years, and employed agents to help me — has ever lost money by underestimating the intelligence of the great masses of the plain people. Nor has anyone ever lost public office thereby.”

H.L. Mencken, (1926)

sykerocker is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 06:34 PM
  #18  
sailorbenjamin 
26 tpi nut.
 
sailorbenjamin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Rhode Island (an obscure suburb of Connecticut)
Posts: 5,703

Bikes: one of each

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times in 5 Posts
I think I have a Huret like PastorBob's but with the Schwinn logo on it. It's off a 70's bike i think but you can have it if you want it.
That double Ashtabula is way classy. I haven't seen one like that.
__________________
I have spoken.
sailorbenjamin is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 06:47 PM
  #19  
cudak888 
www.theheadbadge.com
 
cudak888's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Southern Florida
Posts: 26,101

Bikes: https://www.theheadbadge.com

Mentioned: 65 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1347 Post(s)
Liked 1,435 Times in 856 Posts
For reference, a mostly original 1960 Continental w/Simplex Competition FD and Simplex TdF chain-operated RD:





-Kurt
__________________








Last edited by cudak888; 01-02-10 at 06:53 PM.
cudak888 is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 07:00 PM
  #20  
Mos6502
Elitest Murray Owner
 
Mos6502's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,660

Bikes: 1972 Columbia Tourist Expert III, Columbia Roadster

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by sailorbenjamin View Post
I think I have a Huret like PastorBob's but with the Schwinn logo on it. It's off a 70's bike i think but you can have it if you want it.
That double Ashtabula is way classy. I haven't seen one like that.
Those chainrings were made by Stronglight, if I'm not mistaken. I have a single on my 1963 Columbia Sports Pacer, which since we're on the subject of Simplex and Schwinn, I'm going to bring the discussion off on a tangent:


This Columbia uses a Simplex Raidexport derailleur, and recently I corresponded with the guy who runs the Disraeli Gears website about this odd and rare piece of derailleur history, and he related this information to me:

You have a very interesting derailleur. I don't have any precise information about it, but I do hear various variations on a story that goes something like this:

(i) Schwinn originally fitted Simplex 'pull-chain' designs on their derailleur bicycles - and bought these in quantities that surprised European derailleur manufacturers.
(ii) Sometime in the very early 1960's Schwinn decided that Huret's Allvit parallelogram design was superior to Simplex's pull-chain design, and was also much cheaper than Simplex's Export 61 parallelogram design - so they switched to Huret.
(iii) Simplex responded by trying to simplify and reduce the cost of the Export 61 - but Schwinn stuck with the Allvit.
(iv) Simplex then decided that the way forward was to radically reduce the production cost by moving to a plastic design.

Your Raidexport would fit neatly into stage (iii).
Basically, Simplex designed the Raidexport to try and keep Schwinn's business, but they decided to go with Huret anyway. So Columbia stepped in and bought up the Raidexports which apparently weren't going anywhere since Simplex also had just introduced the plastic Prestige.
Mos6502 is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 07:06 PM
  #21  
fiataccompli
Steel Member
Thread Starter
 
fiataccompli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 1,480

Bikes: N + 1

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Kurt - very cool....I like the black. Is that yours? (is that Miami? looks like a place....Coconut Grove?...I went to for a parade somewhere around Miami about 3 years ago, actually....but that's probably coincidental).

Out of curiosity, do these bikes fetch any serious bucks when they're for sale? (and, no, mine's not for sale)

I'll see what I have in the way of an appropriate or semi-appropriate RD for now. The one on that black one looks very much appropriately archaic to match the front setup...and, again, I'm OK if I don't win the Tour de France this year riding my Continental, so being a little crappy on the shifting is OK as long as it basically works.
fiataccompli is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 07:15 PM
  #22  
cudak888 
www.theheadbadge.com
 
cudak888's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Southern Florida
Posts: 26,101

Bikes: https://www.theheadbadge.com

Mentioned: 65 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1347 Post(s)
Liked 1,435 Times in 856 Posts
Originally Posted by fiataccompli View Post
Kurt - very cool....I like the black. Is that yours? (is that Miami? looks like a place....Coconut Grove?...I went to for a parade somewhere around Miami about 3 years ago, actually....but that's probably coincidental).
That one belongs to Mack Cycles. I only brought two machines to this show.

Close to the Grove; try Sunset Drive. The bicycle show was a one-day addition to the Volksblast event running the same week.

Parade in the Grove? King Mango Strut?

-Kurt
__________________







cudak888 is offline  
Old 01-02-10, 07:23 PM
  #23  
fiataccompli
Steel Member
Thread Starter
 
fiataccompli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 1,480

Bikes: N + 1

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Interesting......I'd not really considered "showing" bikes in a serious way (I assume that sounds seriously dumb on this forum, but c'est la vie), but rather using them for social rides with family, local organized bike stuff, etc.

Yes, that's the one....some good friends moved (back) to Miami from Knoxville in '06 and my wife and I made an impromptu road trip to spend the holiday there in December. Being the hillbilly that I am I couldn't imagine biking regularly in a place so flat, but we're ready for another trip there as soon as we can work it in.
fiataccompli is offline  
Old 01-03-10, 10:38 PM
  #24  
sailorbenjamin 
26 tpi nut.
 
sailorbenjamin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Rhode Island (an obscure suburb of Connecticut)
Posts: 5,703

Bikes: one of each

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Hey, look. There's one on Ebay right now. I'm thinking his price is a little high but what do I know about old bikes? Funny, he doesn't have the right derailler either.
__________________
I have spoken.
sailorbenjamin is offline  
Old 01-03-10, 11:17 PM
  #25  
fiataccompli
Steel Member
Thread Starter
 
fiataccompli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 1,480

Bikes: N + 1

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Sounds like a straight description. Is that price even ballpark realistic? Nice shots of the front shifter...mine looks the same but doesn't have the simplex script...as far as I can tell...need to look closer tomorrow!

So, when these were new (or relatively new), were these bikes that people put serious mileage on? I've read about people going on tours on their first bikes...like Varsities or something....but was this common & how would something like this Continental compared to bikes that were really being ridden at the time? It still looks crude compared to European touring bikes from the decade prior, but it also looks (and is) like it's built like a tank...maybe the LHT of it's time?
fiataccompli is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.