Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-12-10, 04:52 PM   #1
eboard17
Fixedgrbiker
Thread Starter
 
eboard17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Bikes: 73 Atala Super Professional, 09 Motobecane Jury, 80 Schwinn Voyageur 11.8 and a Trek 1500
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Returned Bike? What should I do?

My friend recently sold a bike on Criagslist. A vintage 979 Vitus. I know that it has some problems and we made sure to point all of it out. Yes the seat tube was cracked at the top, and was welded back together.

Today we get home from some thrift shopping to find the bike sitting on our porch, And a note that reads, "Please pay $280 money order to his address."

What do we do in this situation. I feel we have no obligation to give any money back. We clearly stated the issues of the bike when he purchased it and he willingly bought it. Any advice as to what should be done.

I will post some pictures of the bike where he left it in a few minutes.
eboard17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 04:55 PM   #2
10 Wheels
Galveston County Texas
 
10 Wheels's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: In The Wind
Bikes: 2010 Expedition, 03 GTO
Posts: 31,002
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 708 Post(s)
Send him a note charging storage by the day.
__________________
Fred "The Real Fred"
10 Wheels is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 04:55 PM   #3
yuoil 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Massachusetts
Bikes: I don't even know anymore.
Posts: 327
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
So you sold the bike to someone in person and they saw the flaws? I don't think you're under any obligation. Either way, it's not like they can make you give the money back. Did something on the bike break? Is it as it was sold?

^ yea, what's up with the note? How non-confrontational can you get? Was he scared you'd say no on the phone?
yuoil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 04:55 PM   #4
Syscrush
Senior Member
 
Syscrush's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Bikes:
Posts: 742
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
That's odd. Purchaser came and saw the bike in person before closing the deal?

Whatever the situation, just pay the money back - he or she knows where you live and obviously has some kind of problem. You'll only make it worse by trying to hold onto the money.
Syscrush is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 04:58 PM   #5
cudak888 
www.theheadbadge.com
 
cudak888's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Southern Florida
Bikes: http://www.theheadbadge.com
Posts: 22,725
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Making such demands without contacting you beforehand (yet, leaving the merchandise in your possession) is the method he is using to twist your arm into giving him a refund. Do not feel obligated to do anything until you have spoken to him to find out what the complaint is.

I have to admit though - he isn't the smartest cookie in the jar, for an unscrupulous seller could easily deny ever having sold it to him, withholding the $280.

-Kurt
__________________
cudak888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 05:04 PM   #6
Schnayke
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Medford, OR
Bikes:
Posts: 325
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cudak888 View Post
Making such demands without contacting you beforehand (yet, leaving the merchandise in your possession) is the method he is using to twist your arm into giving him a refund. Do not feel obligated to do anything until you have spoken to him to find out what the complaint is.

I have to admit though - he isn't the smartest cookie in the jar, for an unscrupulous seller could easily deny ever having sold it to him, withholding the $280.

-Kurt
Or he could just say what do you mean you left it on my porch. I never seen a thing.
Schnayke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 05:06 PM   #7
cudak888 
www.theheadbadge.com
 
cudak888's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Southern Florida
Bikes: http://www.theheadbadge.com
Posts: 22,725
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schnayke View Post
Or he could just say what do you mean you left it on my porch. I never seen a thing.
But of course, we are C&V'ers, and as a rule, stand behind moral and ethical business practices.

...unlike A&S, for instance

-Kurt
__________________
cudak888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 05:16 PM   #8
dit
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Middle TN
Bikes: 2 Centurian Ironman, Rossin Genisis, Greenspeed GT3, Stowaway (wife)
Posts: 653
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
You might consider a 'restocking' fee of like $25.
dit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 05:19 PM   #9
rumrunn6
Senior Member
 
rumrunn6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: 25 miles northwest of Boston
Bikes: Bottecchia Sprint
Posts: 18,201
Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1506 Post(s)
screw it - send the money and sell it again - chalk it up to weirder than weird
rumrunn6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 05:23 PM   #10
eboard17
Fixedgrbiker
Thread Starter
 
eboard17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Bikes: 73 Atala Super Professional, 09 Motobecane Jury, 80 Schwinn Voyageur 11.8 and a Trek 1500
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Ok, Here are some pictures. This is exactly the condition we sold it in, but he removed some decals on the back stays that read "Factory Racing Team"








The only big issue was the seat tube crack, but it was one thing that we made sure to tell him about.
eboard17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 05:25 PM   #11
Elev12k
Senior Member
 
Elev12k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Bikes: (Koga) Miyata, WTB, Fat Chance, Mountain Goat, Grove, Verlicchi, Rafty, Panasonic, Vitus, Gazelle, Batavus, Zieleman, Presto, Peka, RIH, Reus, Vittorio, Simon, Duell, Fongers, Concorde, Alan, Zebrakenko
Posts: 1,261
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
I case stuff in same shape I think I would refund. Shipping would be an issue, but initial for me and return for him would be easiest ...unless shipping is a too large portion of the total sale. Than another solution has to be found.
Elev12k is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 05:28 PM   #12
curbtender
Senior Member
 
curbtender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: SF Bay Area, East bay
Bikes: Marinoni, Kestral 200 2002 Trek 5200, KHS Flite, Koga Miyata, Schwinn Spitfire 5, Schwinn Speedster, Mondia Special, Univega Alpina
Posts: 4,405
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 196 Post(s)
Cool, send it to judge Judy and you both make some money on it, you plus a little. Sold AS-IS items have no warranty. You disclosed defects too? Buyer beware. Is it a friendship issue?
curbtender is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 05:31 PM   #13
eboard17
Fixedgrbiker
Thread Starter
 
eboard17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Bikes: 73 Atala Super Professional, 09 Motobecane Jury, 80 Schwinn Voyageur 11.8 and a Trek 1500
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Just a guy we sold the bike to locally from craigslist.
eboard17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 05:32 PM   #14
vjp
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 2,160
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
That bike should have been trashed in the first place and not sold. Do the right thing, take off the parts, throw away the frame and give the buyer his money back.

vjp
vjp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 05:33 PM   #15
Elev12k
Senior Member
 
Elev12k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Bikes: (Koga) Miyata, WTB, Fat Chance, Mountain Goat, Grove, Verlicchi, Rafty, Panasonic, Vitus, Gazelle, Batavus, Zieleman, Presto, Peka, RIH, Reus, Vittorio, Simon, Duell, Fongers, Concorde, Alan, Zebrakenko
Posts: 1,261
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
I've now seen the pictures

In your 1st post you said it was cracked on the top and welded back together. Did you also tell him it was cracked at the top, welded back together ...and cracked again?

Honestly to me that looks like a written off frame. In fact he bought a written off frame with some kit. Now it has to be advertised again, I would advertise it like that. The safe modus.
Elev12k is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 05:34 PM   #16
wrk101
Thrifty Bill
 
wrk101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: West of Asheville, NC
Bikes: 86 Katakura Silk, 87 Prologue, 88 Cimarron LE, 1975 Sekai 4000 Professional, 73 Paramount, plus more
Posts: 20,469
Mentioned: 22 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 194 Post(s)
I have given buyers refunds twice. Nothing was wrong with either bike, they just changed their mind. In both cases, I sold the returned bike for more.

With one person who returned the bike, not only did I sell him a replacement (he decided he wanted a triple crankset), but I subsequently sold his girlfriend a bike, as well as his mother.


I guess its good karma, as so far, I have come out way ahead.


In the case of the bike above, I would have parted it out. That frame is toast IMHO. I don't sell damaged bikes.

YMMV.

Last edited by wrk101; 02-12-10 at 05:37 PM.
wrk101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 05:45 PM   #17
rat fink
Iconoclast
 
rat fink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: California
Bikes: Colnago Super, Fuji Opus III, Specialized Rockhopper, Specialized Sirrus (road)
Posts: 3,180
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
It sounds to me like you just got a $280 donation.
rat fink is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 05:46 PM   #18
curbtender
Senior Member
 
curbtender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: SF Bay Area, East bay
Bikes: Marinoni, Kestral 200 2002 Trek 5200, KHS Flite, Koga Miyata, Schwinn Spitfire 5, Schwinn Speedster, Mondia Special, Univega Alpina
Posts: 4,405
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 196 Post(s)
Seeing the pictures, I don't see how he could have missed it. I'd be worried about selling a CF lugged bike that had been heated to repair a lug.
curbtender is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 05:48 PM   #19
clasher
Senior Member
 
clasher's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Kitchener, ON
Bikes:
Posts: 2,038
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 61 Post(s)
I'd just give him the money back and chalk it up to weird, passive-aggressiveness of some kind. As someone else pointed out, he knows where you live so no need to invite any unwanted trouble. Though I'd call him and ask if he can come and get the money so as not to inconvenience you more.

Maybe someone gave him **** for spending money he shouldn't have spent!
clasher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 06:14 PM   #20
fiataccompli
Steel Member
 
fiataccompli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Knoxville, TN
Bikes: N + 1
Posts: 1,446
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
unless you misrepresented the usability of the frame in the condition it's in now, I don't see why you should give a refund unless you want to. That said, assuming full disclosure & understanding of the implications by the buyer, I would personally be likely to give the guy a refund & just chalk it up to the nutty world of CL & Ebay. To me, the money and the "principle of it" are not worth the pain in the neck & these days the risk of what kind of bizarre stuff the average nutbag can come up with. There are enough good folks to trade with that there's no need to spend time with the crazies. I try to give fools a wide path to pass on through. I hate it when they get snagged on something near me and hang around trying to dislodge themselves...know what I mean?

on a tangent: can this be properly repaired? Seems like the cost of the repair would total the frame pretty quickly to me.
fiataccompli is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 06:21 PM   #21
cudak888 
www.theheadbadge.com
 
cudak888's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Southern Florida
Bikes: http://www.theheadbadge.com
Posts: 22,725
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
If the OP disclosed the weld, the second crack would have been noted by even the biggest idiot out there.

Took decals off? That's grounds for "no-returns" in my book.

-Kurt
__________________
cudak888 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 06:35 PM   #22
rumrunn6
Senior Member
 
rumrunn6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: 25 miles northwest of Boston
Bikes: Bottecchia Sprint
Posts: 18,201
Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1506 Post(s)
paint the weld
rumrunn6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 06:38 PM   #23
wrk101
Thrifty Bill
 
wrk101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: West of Asheville, NC
Bikes: 86 Katakura Silk, 87 Prologue, 88 Cimarron LE, 1975 Sekai 4000 Professional, 73 Paramount, plus more
Posts: 20,469
Mentioned: 22 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 194 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cudak888 View Post
If the OP disclosed the weld, the second crack would have been noted by even the biggest idiot out there.
I am not sure. Just when you think you have met the world's biggest idiot, you meet a bigger idiot. I am not kidding.

A lot of buyers are not bike savvy, or even awake or alert. They may have noticed the damage, but weren't comprehending what it meant. Then I can imagine they take it to a shop, or show it off to their biking buddy, who lets them know the frame is toast. At that point, the idiot is pretty PO'd. I am glad you were not home when they dropped off the bike.

Selling damaged goods, even when the damage is obvious and disclosed, is not something I would do. I would much rather strip the parts, and cut up the frame and take a loss.
wrk101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 06:40 PM   #24
sailorbenjamin 
26 tpi nut.
 
sailorbenjamin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Rhode Island (an obscure suburb of Connecticut)
Bikes: one of each
Posts: 5,701
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Send him a money order for $3000 and tell him to send you a check for the change.
Seriously, have a good hard look at the bike. Is it in EXACTLY the condition you gave it to him in? the decals arekind of a PITA. did he swap out a busted derailler or something like that?
__________________
I have spoken.
sailorbenjamin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-10, 06:57 PM   #25
eboard17
Fixedgrbiker
Thread Starter
 
eboard17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Bikes: 73 Atala Super Professional, 09 Motobecane Jury, 80 Schwinn Voyageur 11.8 and a Trek 1500
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
OK, Just bought it back for $140.
eboard17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:51 AM.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
 
  • Ask a Question
    get answers from real people!
Click to start entering your question.
I HAVE A QUESTION