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For the love of English 3 speeds...

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For the love of English 3 speeds...

Old 04-25-12, 09:29 PM
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I built a frame for this SA alloy hub I had on my shelf for 30+ years. Decided to be a bit creative in the frame style... Andy.
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Old 04-26-12, 06:53 AM
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I picked this AW hub out of a parts bin last week. It's a '49, and the driver is threaded where there's usually a lock-ring. Any ideas what that's for?
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Old 04-26-12, 07:07 AM
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yellowbarber- With the ability to coast a threaded on cog doesn't need a lockring to hold it on. there's no loosening forces, think about a classic threaded freewheel. The SA threaded driver is long enough to handle a second cog. In fact some companies made such, like Cyclo. I have a Raleigh Twenty (not a Raleigh DL-20) out on a 30+ years loan with a SA FW hub and two cogs. It uses a Huret deraillure to get 8 gears. Andy.
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Old 04-26-12, 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Andrew R Stewart
I built a frame for this SA alloy hub I had on my shelf for 30+ years. Decided to be a bit creative in the frame style... Andy.
Brilliant !
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Old 04-26-12, 07:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Andrew R Stewart
yellowbarber- With the ability to coast a threaded on cog doesn't need a lockring to hold it on. there's no loosening forces, think about a classic threaded freewheel. The SA threaded driver is long enough to handle a second cog. In fact some companies made such, like Cyclo. I have a Raleigh Twenty (not a Raleigh DL-20) out on a 30+ years loan with a SA FW hub and two cogs. It uses a Huret deraillure to get 8 gears. Andy.
Yup, a single cog on a threaded driver of a Sturmey hub has no more need of a locknut than does a threaded freewheel assembly on a threaded multi-speed derailleur hub -or a single freewheel cog for that matter. It only looks odd in comparison to fixed hubs because they are rare and people are unaccustomed to seeing them.

I suppose the forces required to loosen the cog for removal made it a real PITA to do so that's why SA abandoned the threaded cog design in favor of the tab & lockring setup we still see today. I wonder if there was a special factory-approved tool designed to fit the driver into that was intended to help the cog removal process instead of just plopping the driver over a likely-looking bit of angle iron or other flange? It still requires the removal of the driver from the hub to remove the threaded cog unless there is a trick that I don't know about.
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Old 04-26-12, 07:47 AM
  #3131  
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Originally Posted by Fenway
Oh, great. Now I want a chain case, too.
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Old 04-26-12, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by rhm
Oh, great. Now I want a chain case, too.
Yellow Jersey has them.
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Old 04-26-12, 07:56 AM
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Originally Posted by yellowbarber
I picked this AW hub out of a parts bin last week. It's a '49, and the driver is threaded where there's usually a lock-ring. Any ideas what that's for?
Sturmey-Archer used threaded drivers until about 1952 when they changed to the now familiar splined driver. Removing the cogs from the threaded driver can be a PITA, so the recommended fix is to replace the threaded driver with a splined driver from a newer hub.
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Old 04-26-12, 08:00 AM
  #3134  
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Originally Posted by rhm
Oh, great. Now I want a chain case, too.
Only until you get a flat tire.
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Old 04-26-12, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnDThompson
Only until you get a flat tire.
Oh, but I don't want a flat tire. I really don't like flat tires much at all, though I'm pretty sure I get more than my fair share of them.

My Fothergill has a '39 AW hub with two cogs and a Resilion derailleur, a derailleur that shifts okay but is a real PITA when it comes to removing/replacing the rear wheel. When I get a flat on that, I patch the tube without removing the wheel. It's the only way.
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Old 04-26-12, 09:09 AM
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Originally Posted by rhm
Oh, great. Now I want a chain case, too.
Fenways bike rates a change to the rating scale as it is a definite eleven.
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Old 04-26-12, 09:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver
Fenways bike rates a change to the rating scale as it is a definite eleven.
Yeah! That's exactly it! I vote to ban. Humph.
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Old 04-26-12, 09:14 AM
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I have used tyre sealant on my old three speeds with great success in that over the past 6 years have never experienced a flat and discovered that over the winter these tyres lose no air pressure. The fellow I sold my superbe to said he has rarely needed to even top up the tyres and he has been riding it for three years.

My wifes igh equipped bike runs marathon supremes as it also has a full chaincase and she has never had a flat while owning and riding this bike for what is now six years and she puts down a lot of miles.
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Old 04-26-12, 09:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver
I have used tyre sealant on my old three speeds with great success...
I did that for a while, and thought it a great success, until the problems added up and I soured on the idea. The problems I found were:

--patches won't hold to those tubes. I know, some people say it is possible; and obviously if the tubes really do self-seal then patches arent necessary... but....

--the sealant doesn't work on high pressure tires; the threshold seems to be around 70 psi. Again, some people claim otherwise, but my experience is what it is.

--the sealant doesn't dry in the tube, but it will eventually dry in the valve stem, making it impossible to inflate.

I think I have them in my wife's 3-speed, which is a good use for them since she is willing to inflate the tires herself but is not willing to do more elaborate repairs. Otherwise, I've given up on them.
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Old 04-26-12, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Amesja
Yellow Jersey has them.
I have an extra...
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Old 04-26-12, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by rhm
I did that for a while, and thought it a great success, until the problems added up and I soured on the idea. The problems I found were:

--patches won't hold to those tubes. I know, some people say it is possible; and obviously if the tubes really do self-seal then patches arent necessary... but....

--the sealant doesn't work on high pressure tires; the threshold seems to be around 70 psi. Again, some people claim otherwise, but my experience is what it is.

--the sealant doesn't dry in the tube, but it will eventually dry in the valve stem, making it impossible to inflate.

I think I have them in my wife's 3-speed, which is a good use for them since she is willing to inflate the tires herself but is not willing to do more elaborate repairs. Otherwise, I've given up on them.
I use automotive sealant and have not had an issue with the valves getting fouled, key seems to be with following the directions and riding after application to distribute the sealant.

Good point that it does not work on high psi tyres or when you experience significant damage and I always carry a spare tube regardless.
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Old 04-26-12, 10:48 AM
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Yellowbarber - Some folks mount a freewheel on the threaded driver and install a RD to end up with an expanded gear range.

-G
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Old 04-26-12, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by yellowbarber
I picked this AW hub out of a parts bin last week. It's a '49, and the driver is threaded where there's usually a lock-ring. Any ideas what that's for?
I would love to find one of these and would look at building up and adding a 4-5 speed freewheel and a rear derailleur to give me the mother of all dual drives. Consideration has to be given to the reduction gearing in the AW to make sure the cog selection creates a minimum of gearing overlap and gives the optimal gearing.

One might also need the longer SA axle to provide adequate clearance for a multi speed conversion.
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Old 04-26-12, 12:24 PM
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I have one of those drivers (with a cog on it) if you want it. You will need a very long axle indeed.
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Old 04-26-12, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by DaytonaMike
Trying a post with a picture for the first time. Here is my 73 Raleigh Sports. I love this bike.
DaytonaMike, she looks very nice! It looks like you have the Kenda tires on the bike which are a nice choice. They work really well on the Raleigh Sports, are durable and attractively priced. Did you need to do much cleanup or was that essentially the way the bike came to you?

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Old 04-26-12, 12:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Andrew R Stewart
I built a frame for this SA alloy hub I had on my shelf for 30+ years. Decided to be a bit creative in the frame style... Andy.

Andrew, I like that quite a bit, especially with the integrated rack. You should post that in the framebuilders forum for them to see, if you haven't already. What tubing did you use? Also, what is the geometry?
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Old 04-26-12, 12:34 PM
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Originally Posted by rhm
Yeah! That's exactly it! I vote to ban. Humph.
+1 I wish I could figure out why I always agree with rmh and wahoonc. Is it that we're brothers from a different mother or did we have a Vulcan mind meld?
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Old 04-26-12, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver
I would love to find one of these and would look at building up and adding a 4-5 speed freewheel and a rear derailleur to give me the mother of all dual drives. Consideration has to be given to the reduction gearing in the AW to make sure the cog selection creates a minimum of gearing overlap and gives the optimal gearing.

One might also need the longer SA axle to provide adequate clearance for a multi speed conversion.
As with rhm, I have two that I'd be willing to trade for a 3-splined version if you'd like. A steel-body 40h dated 48 11 and an alloy body 36h dated 54 6. If you'd like to trade, I'd prefer steel for steel and alloy for alloy.

As an aside, I just discovered that I have 11 Sturmey AW hubs!
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Old 04-26-12, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by rhm
I have one of those drivers (with a cog on it) if you want it. You will need a very long axle indeed.
Would love that... considering you could squeeze a cyclo triple with 1/8 cogs on the splined driver with the longer SA axle, threading on a 5 speed might be doable and believe I have seen where this was done.

I have a Moulton F series in the works and a drive set up like this might just be the bomb for what will be a full on road bike that needs an internal hub to give you any kind of decent road gearing... was thinking a three speed with a dual drive would have been a good way to go with this instead of the stock 4 speed IGH as it would tighten up the gear steps.

Would of course have to swap the internals to a shell for 28 spokes as this is what the Moulton rims use.
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Old 04-26-12, 01:01 PM
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I also have a good number of AW hubs but all are splined and date back to '54... the '54 is a keeper as it is original to my '54 Raleigh and plan to rebuild the wheel.
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