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For the love of English 3 speeds...

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For the love of English 3 speeds...

Old 08-24-12, 11:13 AM
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[QUOTE=Prop Man;14647647I know it's not English--just think of it as Mr. Raleigh's American cousin. My 1959 Schwinn Paramount Tourist 3-speed[/QUOTE]

Lovely... Does the name "Paramount" imply anything about the makeup of the frame or quality of the components in this case?

edit: That doesn't read right. Does a Paramount Tourist 3-speed differ from the next level down in the lineup the way a Paramount 10-speed of similar vintage would differ from the next lower 10-speed model?
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Old 08-24-12, 11:30 AM
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Iceberg

Originally Posted by Velognome
Perfect! So every trade, every part found, cleaned and painted will be an improvement! This hobby can get addictive.....I sense this 3spd of yours will just prove to be the tip of your iceberg!
Ah, yes, definitely there's an iceberg. This project has been stalled and I hope with its completion I will have more fun and less procrastination ahead. I picked up a Dawes Kingpin last night. It is a rusty mess as well, but lighter than I would have thought. Am thinking maybe a new 8 speed hub... dare I speak of such a thing here...

Originally Posted by conradpdx
Then you have to carefully work the creases out with with hammer and dies, I usually do this on a sandbag. Of course then on a painted surface you'd have to repaint as the torch would burn the paint off...

...I can usually get the heat method to take about half the dent out before the pounding starts.
Thanks for sharing your expertise and for a great idea with the sandbag; I will try this. I have most of the dent out, but am not quite satisfied. Between the tricks you all have shared and the more realistic expectations you've granted me, I hope to have this on the road soon, and will follow with pictures... perhaps hazy ones to hide the remaining rust!

One thing I can share that may help someone is that Bike Works NYC on Ridge St had an original chrome chainguard which we snapped up, and he had other goodies too at least at the time, and the shop was a fun (and I would say 3-spd-friendly) place. You may be right that we will find better fenders some day, maybe in a similar way.
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Old 08-24-12, 11:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Super.bee
Am thinking maybe a new 8 speed hub... dare I speak of such a thing here...
No problem. We can just start a new thread: "For the love of English 8 speeds that used to be 3 speeds..."

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Old 08-24-12, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by clubman
Hey sts...just proofhide the top of the saddle. There's so many permutations of Brooks saddles and there's no real all encompassing history that I've seen.

The dull centre line is correct for early 50's Dunlop rims...sometimes you get lucky with stainless spokes too.
The dark cloud hanging over this purchase is lifting. A magnet sticks to the spokes. There is an oil port in the bottom bracket, Kingfisher(?), and the herons on the cranks have eyes. The cable housings are a smooth, cream/white (now that the years of grime are starting to lift) and seem to have a little sparkle to them.

Does Brooks still make a B72L saddle? I find only a B72 version on their site.

Please indulge me as I add that my first Raleigh, a lowly Sprite, was purchased less than a year ago. All of you have enabled me to now include 3 (!) Sports, a 1961 Royce Union (I think it rides as nicely as later Raleighs.), and a Dunelt I polished up and made road worthy for my husband. It's yet to be ridden, but looks great with it's rear rack and green canvas panniers.

When did Dunlop stop making bicycle tires? These have great tread and don't appear to have any dry rot. These tires and tubes hold air. Safe to ride?

I can't thank all of you enough. This is so much fun!
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Old 08-24-12, 04:01 PM
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No more information or free advice without posting decent pictures!

I think it was '67 when Dunlop told Raleigh to take a hike and opted out of the bike market.

If it's not on the website it's probably not in production but you never know. Many modern women's Brooks saddles appear with an "S" suffix as well.
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Old 08-24-12, 04:08 PM
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For a time Raleigh had considerable pull and had a good association with Dunlop who made an excellent living supplying bicycle tyres to Raleigh and other companies but when Raleigh pushed too hard and tried to dictate terms to Dunlop they decided that the bicycle tyre business was far less profitable than their automotive division and quit manufacturing what were some of the best bicycle tyres ever made.

After they stopped making bicycle tyres in the mid 60's there was a period when certain tyres were very hard to get and for some sizes like the EA1, there were no good quality racing tyres made until the 70's when Japanese tyre makers came around to making replacements that were on par with the old Dunlops.

I treasure my old Dunlop Gold Seal tyres on my Raleigh Lenton.. they are still wonderful after more than 40 years and roll out magnificently and I keep a small stash of replacements which should keep me in tyres for a good long while.
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Old 08-24-12, 05:24 PM
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Clubman, be nice! Half of my family lives in Bedford and I've been to Peggy's Cove. I'm working on the technology of posting pictures after I take them.

Last edited by slowtostart; 08-24-12 at 05:25 PM. Reason: response to poster
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Old 08-24-12, 08:45 PM
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Originally Posted by slowtostart
Clubman, be nice! Half of my family lives in Bedford and I've been to Peggy's Cove. I'm working on the technology of posting pictures after I take them.
Lobster seasons in...$5 lb off the gate of the local truck. Got any bike parts to trade?
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Old 08-24-12, 10:58 PM
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Originally Posted by clubman
Lobster seasons in...$5 lb off the gate of the local truck. Got any bike parts to trade?
Sweet... I love Lobster.

Used to be able to buy a lobster dinner in Freeport for $9.00 which included the works and ate my weight of those freshly caught and oh so tasty sea cockroaches and dove for them myself.
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Old 08-24-12, 11:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Super.bee
Thanks for sharing your expertise and for a great idea with the sandbag; I will try this. I have most of the dent out, but am not quite satisfied. Between the tricks you all have shared and the more realistic expectations you've granted me, I hope to have this on the road soon, and will follow with pictures... perhaps hazy ones to hide the remaining rust!
We like pic's and don't mind a little patina (ie rust).

And unless your use to using a torch I wouldn't recommend the steps I mentioned. There is a very fine line between just right and melting/cutting.
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Old 08-25-12, 02:34 PM
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My BSA 3 speed. I still haven't been able to ID the year. I'm guessing late 30's? The hub has no date that I can find. But a serial # on the frame near the hub is E32170.


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Old 08-25-12, 02:36 PM
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A lock on the fork. How cool.
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Old 08-25-12, 03:42 PM
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1980 Sports


IMG_8485 by flog00, on Flickr
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Old 08-27-12, 09:19 AM
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Sweet BSA! I'm interested to see the year of manufacture, as well. Where did you pick that beauty up?
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Old 08-27-12, 01:40 PM
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What would we do without the wealth of knowlege here? Please indulge me while I request another withdrawal from the vault. I spent more time going over my new 1956 Ladies Sports this weekend and comparing it to the more modern, 1970s, versions. What pupose would the small clip centered on the front hub have served? I did a very quick search and found nothing. Also, when I attempted to remove the rear rack I found that it is not attached in the fender eyelet, but is secured to the rear hub. It seems to be sturdier than later racks I have and the connector for the seat stay area has a solid v-shaped back and only one center screw secures that clamp to the rack, between the seat stays. Would that be correct for the model year? I know pictures would be helpful, but for right now I'll use my 1,000 words and hope they make some sense. On a positive note, all the gears are working and the tires are holding air.

As always, many thanks for all of your answers.
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Old 08-27-12, 01:46 PM
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Originally Posted by slowtostart
I spent more time going over my new 1956 Ladies Sports this weekend and comparing it to the more modern, 1970s, versions. What pupose would the small clip centered on the front hub have served?
That's an oil port. Like the rear 3-speed hubs, those front hubs are also oil-lubricated. A few drops every week or so will keep it going indefinitely.
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Old 08-27-12, 03:58 PM
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Originally Posted by PalmettoUpstate
At 772 you say:

I'm pretty much sold on these old Raleighs and I have a LOT of "saddle time" on to me - LOL. [5 coast-to-coast trips across the lower 48 between '71 & '73, mostly on Harleys etc.etc.etc.]

Who do you recommend for building these 650A bicycle wheels? I'm kinda anal about quality and I'd definitely want someone who could/would do a better job than me & me redneck friends....
Have you received a reply to this? I'll build wheels for you for a reasonable rate. I've put Sun CR-18 rims on three-speed bikes. It's worked out very well.

I'll be in High Falls, NY this coming weekend. Where are you?
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Old 08-27-12, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by wahoonc
Depending on the diameter of the housing you might be able to purchase on from someone like Yellow Jersey and disassemble it for the reflector. I have actually used a Dremel to cut a larger one down to fit before. Otherwise haunt Epay and wait for one to show up.

Aaron
+1 The cost of the repops or original reflectors is prohibitive. Cutting one to the proper size is cheap and relatively easy.
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Old 08-27-12, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by photogravity
+1 The cost of the repops or original reflectors is prohibitive. Cutting one to the proper size is cheap and relatively easy.
The Repops from Yellow Jersey are $~5 a piece.

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Old 08-27-12, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by slowtostart
What pupose would the small clip centered on the front hub have served? I did a very quick search and found nothing. Also, when I attempted to remove the rear rack I found that it is not attached in the fender eyelet, but is secured to the rear hub. It seems to be sturdier than later racks I have and the connector for the seat stay area has a solid v-shaped back and only one center screw secures that clamp to the rack, between the seat stays. Would that be correct for the model year? I know pictures would be helpful, but for right now I'll use my 1,000 words and hope they make some sense. On a positive note, all the gears are working and the tires are holding air.

As always, many thanks for all of your answers.
The clip on the front hub is the cover for an oil port, rotate it around a bit and an oiling hole will present itself. Campagnolo hubs preserved this aspect of design up through the 80s, and Shimano and Suntour did the same for some of their hubs. The bottom bracket of a Raleigh of this era will also have an oiling port.

The pre-'65 Raleigh Industries pedals were rebuildable affairs, lubricated with oil through a hole in the end cap. I would like to know if MKS rubber block pedals can be converted to oil lubrication, perhaps by drilling the end cap so as allow oil lubrication.

Last edited by jrecoi; 08-27-12 at 04:55 PM.
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Old 08-27-12, 05:05 PM
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Originally Posted by slowtostart
...the connector for the seat stay area has a solid v-shaped back and only one center screw secures that clamp to the rack, between the seat stays. Would that be correct for the model year?...
I think it's correct. Midland was an early popular marque, made of black tubular steel, mounted on the axles, and the additional plate steel seat stay clamp. Later, Raleigh used similar colour matched Prestube racks. They're a cut above the later alloy Esge racks.

They're desirable too. I saw a pristine Midland make $150 at auction.
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Old 08-27-12, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Prop Man
I know it's not English--just think of it as Mr. Raleigh's American cousin. My 1959 Schwinn Paramount Tourist 3-speed.
A thing of beauty indeed. I lust for one of these.

SEE: https://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d7...9Paramount.jpg
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Old 08-27-12, 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by noglider
Have you received a reply to this? I'll build wheels for you for a reasonable rate. I've put Sun CR-18 rims on three-speed bikes. It's worked out very well.

I'll be in High Falls, NY this coming weekend. Where are you?
Tom I'm way down South in the [former] land of cotton, Greenville, SC.

I don't know how shipping rates work out between NJ and SC but I'd wager that we could work something out that'd be agreeable to both.

I'm on a pretty rapid learning curve on this stuff, having just taken it up about a year ago, but I think I'd defer to someone with more "bench time" on something like doing wheels - at least for the present. I'm doing a leisurely read thru this most informative of threads - on pg 56 presently - and I really value most of the info/insights I get here. I'll try to send you my email address on the PM "back channel" here; if it doesn't work we'll go to Plan B. Tx.
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Old 08-27-12, 06:59 PM
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Originally Posted by wahoonc
The Repops from Yellow Jersey are $~5 a piece.

Aaron
That's the best price I've seen them! Thanks for sharing that information.
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Old 08-27-12, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by HercRider
Sweet BSA! I'm interested to see the year of manufacture, as well. Where did you pick that beauty up?
So am I. I cant find a date on the hub. All there is is that serial #..... I'm guessing late 30's. Well at least most of the bike.
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