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For the love of English 3 speeds...

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For the love of English 3 speeds...

Old 04-14-14, 01:26 PM
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Bunch a' enablers ^^^^^




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Old 04-14-14, 02:06 PM
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Originally Posted by michael k
Bunch a' enablers ^^^^^

Hell Yes!



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Old 04-15-14, 02:05 PM
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How repairable are the old Raleigh frames?

On the bike I've been slowly putting together (so much for "winter project"), I just found that the right seat stay is broken loose from the seat tube. I have no idea if it's welded or brazed, and whether it even can be reliably or economically repaired.
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Old 04-15-14, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by arex
How repairable are the old Raleigh frames? On the bike I've been slowly putting together (so much for "winter project"), I just found that the right seat stay is broken loose from the seat tube. I have no idea if it's welded or brazed, and whether it even can be reliably or economically repaired.
If it's one of the English-built frames it's probably brazed. Look closely where it pulled loose: do you see any brass? It's a relatively easy fix; the hardest part is getting the paint off the area that needs work.
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Old 04-15-14, 04:13 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnDThompson
If it's one of the English-built frames it's probably brazed. Look closely where it pulled loose: do you see any brass? It's a relatively easy fix; the hardest part is getting the paint off the area that needs work.
Looks like brass. Since I'm taking off paint and other stuff, I wonder if there'd be a point to preemptively re-brazing the other side, just to be safe.
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Old 04-15-14, 08:31 PM
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Originally Posted by arex
Looks like brass. Since I'm taking off paint and other stuff, I wonder if there'd be a point to preemptively re-brazing the other side, just to be safe.
May as well, as long as you're getting things hot...
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Old 04-15-14, 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Salubrious
Didja replace the oil in the hub? If its been sitting a while I give it a good dose of Kroil (a penetrating oil) and ride it a few miles. Missing gears seem to majically reappear...
If it doesn't yet have black, dusty spokes around the hub, I would first try 3-in-1 or a nondetergent motor oil. Those hubs retained the oil by the grease packed into the bearings.
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Old 04-15-14, 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted by garage sale GT
If it doesn't yet have black, dusty spokes around the hub, I would first try 3-in-1 or a nondetergent motor oil. Those hubs retained the oil by the grease packed into the bearings.
Why non-detergent, specifically?
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Old 04-15-14, 09:31 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnDThompson
May as well, as long as you're getting things hot...
Kinda what I was thinking. Thank you.
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Old 04-15-14, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by arex
Why non-detergent, specifically?
Most motor oil is designed to dissolve any sludge which forms. It will dissolve grease. Kroil sounds like it would dissolve grease.
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Old 04-15-14, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by garage sale GT
If it doesn't yet have black, dusty spokes around the hub, I would first try 3-in-1 or a nondetergent motor oil. Those hubs retained the oil by the grease packed into the bearings.
It's gotten several doses of twenty-weight turbine oil. While it sounds nice, like a well-lubricated SA hub should, it's still stubbornly two speeds. Alas.

If it bugs me too much before I manage to get my hands on a good cheap AW wheel, I have some PB Blaster I guess I could spray in there...
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Old 04-16-14, 03:10 AM
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Originally Posted by arex
Why non-detergent, specifically?
Some of the fancy pants oils with the additives can gum things up over time. In my experience as long as it is not a vegetable based oil you probably don't have much to worry about. Some people like to use synthetics or even ATF. Life is short, oil it up and ride. I use whatever is in my oil can by the shop door... currently Rotella T left over from a 55 gallon drum where were changing oil on the tractors and other heavy equipment on the place. If you really want to be picky make sure the oil in the hub is compatible with the grease in the bearings, it will reduce the leakage and keep the grease around a bit longer.

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Old 04-16-14, 05:27 AM
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Now I am not an expert but have been dealing with some hub issues over the past year...if I understand how things work correctly, since you have first you are not having trouble with the low gear pawls or springs. Are you sure you have 3rd and not second? if the clutch was not moving all the way back to its resting position it would give you 1st/2nd.....Did you check by watching that the sprocket is actually moving slower than the wheel in what you think is third?

Mechanically I am having a hard time imagining how you can't have second since it is the clutch in the right position that retracts the high gear pawls to give you 1:1 isn't it?
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Old 04-16-14, 08:48 AM
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I know 1st + 3rd seems weird, but that's what I've got. Sprocket moves faster than wheel, or sprocket moves slower than wheel. (Or, admittedly, if I hold the shifter just right/just wrong, sprocket moves and wheel doesn't - the dreaded intermediate/neutral. ) It was weird enough to make me wonder if I didn't actually have a two-speed coaster-brake hub in a TCW shell - but S-A didn't make such a hub, as far as I can tell.

This site: Troubleshooting Sturmey Archer 3-Speed Hubs ? Vancruisers.ca suggests broken (or frozen/gummed?) pawl springs might be to blame. Not a difficult fix if that's the case, but it's still a TCW and I'm still not enamored of the coaster brake.
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Old 04-16-14, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by garage sale GT
If it doesn't yet have black, dusty spokes around the hub, I would first try 3-in-1 or a nondetergent motor oil. Those hubs retained the oil by the grease packed into the bearings.
Originally Posted by arex
Why non-detergent, specifically?
Detergent oils are designed for use with internal combustion engines. The purpose of the detergent is to emulsify any water that has collected with the oil, e.g. from condensation, that might otherwise displace oil and provide inadequate lubrication. When the engine reaches operating temperature, the emulsified water is boiled out of the oil. When you use a detergent oil in a bicycle hub, any water that penetrates into the hub is emulsified, but without the high operating temperature of an internal combustion engine, it remains in the oil in an emulsified state, which can cause internal components to rust.

That said,I've used detergent oils in bicycle hubs without problems; just flush it with fresh oil after riding in wet conditions.
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Old 04-16-14, 11:37 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnDThompson
Detergent oils are designed for use with internal combustion engines. The purpose of the detergent is to emulsify any water that has collected with the oil, e.g. from condensation, that might otherwise displace oil and provide inadequate lubrication. When the engine reaches operating temperature, the emulsified water is boiled out of the oil. When you use a detergent oil in a bicycle hub, any water that penetrates into the hub is emulsified, but without the high operating temperature of an internal combustion engine, it remains in the oil in an emulsified state, which can cause internal components to rust.

That said,I've used detergent oils in bicycle hubs without problems; just flush it with fresh oil after riding in wet conditions.
Makes sense...thanks.
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Old 04-16-14, 12:30 PM
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Originally Posted by arex
How repairable are the old Raleigh frames? On the bike I've been slowly putting together (so much for "winter project"), I just found that the right seat stay is broken loose from the seat tube. I have no idea if it's welded or brazed, and whether it even can be reliably or economically repaired.
Yep, you can repair.

Before:


After:
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Old 04-16-14, 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by adventurepdx
Yep, you can repair.

Before:


After:
Nice! Turns out the other seatstay's cracked, too. Guess I just need to plan on a repaint, too, or a powdercoat.
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Old 04-16-14, 09:10 PM
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What model Raliegh frame has the broken seat stay?
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Old 04-16-14, 09:49 PM
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Originally Posted by pathdoc
What model Raliegh frame has the broken seat stay?
A '74 Raleigh Sports, not one of the high-end bikes...and yes, I'm realizing now that the effort and money I'm sinking into this project probably wouldn't have been worth it, if I'd known what I was in for when I first started. However, at this point I'm pretty much committed to seeing this through to the end; not a lot of the parts I've acquired would transfer very well to another frame, unless I found another bare Sports frame.

It's okay, though, lessons learned. This is going to be my fun bike for when I've shaken off enough weight to be able to ride it fast.
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Old 04-19-14, 03:50 PM
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I was just riding along on the Hercules this afternoon, about five miles into the trip, when suddenly the hub started dragging a little bit, and suddenly... I had second gear.

About ten miles later - so after about fifty total miles, two weeks, and probably six tablespoons of 20-weight oil - it consistently has all three gears. Yay for British engineering.

And about five miles after that it started to rain, whereupon the coaster speed attenuator actually proved marginally useful.
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Old 04-20-14, 03:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Ankheg
I was just riding along on the Hercules this afternoon, about five miles into the trip, when suddenly the hub started dragging a little bit, and suddenly... I had second gear.

About ten miles later - so after about fifty total miles, two weeks, and probably six tablespoons of 20-weight oil - it consistently has all three gears. Yay for British engineering.

And about five miles after that it started to rain, whereupon the coaster speed attenuator actually proved marginally useful.
Cool!
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Old 04-23-14, 09:02 PM
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Teaser
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Old 04-24-14, 05:15 PM
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Nice!


(right? I mean it hasn't got a mob boss's prosthesis welded to the chainstay or anything, yeah?)


Originally Posted by PedalTraveler
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Old 04-24-14, 06:49 PM
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Welp, we shipped our three-speeds to Florida. They'll live at my mother in law's place from now on so we can ride bikes when we visit. I was thinking of selling them, because while they're beautiful, they're not the kind of bike I like to ride much. Shipping to FL was my wife's brilliant idea. It cost us $87 each to ship them by Greyhound, and that's cheaper than a few rentals, and it's cheaper than buying bikes locally on Craigslist. Now I know why I married her.

Unfortunately, the twist shifter on the Hercules will need to be replaced. It's not working well any more. It's cool, but nothing beats the classic trigger shifter.

We went to the bus station in FL, unpacked and reassembled the bikes. My daughter and I rode them back to MIL's place, and I saw that a three speed is perfect for such a flat place.

The bikes are the oldest in the bike room at MIL's apartment building, easily.
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