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Notice anything funny about these lugs?

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Notice anything funny about these lugs?

Old 03-11-10, 01:36 AM
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Notice anything funny about these lugs?






It may take a few moments to dawn on you.
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Old 03-11-10, 02:13 AM
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Straight & boring. Oddly enough, unique & beautiful in its own way.
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Old 03-11-10, 02:39 AM
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The lugs and head tube are all one piece, or at least welded together.
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Old 03-11-10, 02:54 AM
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The weird thing is, what the point of the whole thing. The top and down tubes can just be welded directly on to the head tube to come up with a typical lugless bike frame.

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Old 03-11-10, 03:12 AM
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Originally Posted by mkeller234
The lugs and head tube are all one piece, or at least welded together.
Bingo. Instead of lugs, these are just sections of oversized tubing attached to the head tube. None of the other joints are so constructed.
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Old 03-11-10, 03:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Mos6502
Bingo. Instead of lugs, these are just sections of oversized tubing attached to the head tube. None of the other joints are so constructed.
Sweet, what do I win?
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Old 03-11-10, 03:22 AM
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What's up with the stem? I'm guessing the it is made of steel because it looks like it's rusted but it has a cloudy look like anodized aluminum.
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Old 03-11-10, 03:31 AM
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Originally Posted by mkeller234
What's up with the stem? I'm guessing the it is made of steel because it looks like it's rusted but it has a cloudy look like anodized aluminum.
That's a good question.
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Old 03-11-10, 03:34 AM
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If you're implying that there's no advantage to this design, you're mistaken. Much easier for the manufacturer to assemble these frames: they just cut the tubes to length rather than having to miter them.
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Old 03-11-10, 03:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Trakhak
If you're implying that there's no advantage to this design, you're mistaken. Much easier for the manufacturer to assemble these frames: they just cut the tubes to length rather than having to miter them.
They still would have to miter the "lug" though. So no advantage there... However, it should make a stronger joint since there is double the tube thickness.
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Old 03-11-10, 04:29 AM
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My city bike has the top, head, down, and seat tube all made from the same bent tube, no breaks.
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Old 03-11-10, 05:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Trakhak
If you're implying that there's no advantage to this design, you're mistaken. Much easier for the manufacturer to assemble these frames: they just cut the tubes to length rather than having to miter them.
Advantage is zero as they had to miter those small sections of tubes to weld them against the head tube anyway. Mitering is not avoided here. In the end it's just too much material, time and labor to put into that joint, You also end up with four instances of joining tubes together too instead of just two. Using jigs is not avoided either as there had to be a jig to line up the short tubes against the head tube. A lugless straight join with the head, bottom and top tube will still be the most efficient way of doing this.....if not we would have seen this design on more bikes.
The only way that his might make more sense is if the head lug was cast as one piece with the short tubes as they did on Vitus and other composite and Aluminum bikes. JMOs

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Old 03-11-10, 05:32 AM
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Actually I bet if you pulled the steer tube out and ran a finger in there you would find the tubes are just cut at an angle not mitered. The lug is deep enough that it wouldn't need to be that precise of a cut.

What brand is that bike? Its not a Joannou is it? Full shot available?
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Old 03-11-10, 05:46 AM
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T'was a Hawthorne.
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Old 03-11-10, 07:43 AM
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Looks like a fine line of rust bubbling through instead of a weld.
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Old 03-11-10, 11:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Mos6502
They still would have to miter the "lug" though. So no advantage there... However, it should make a stronger joint since there is double the tube thickness.

that is what I am thinking. the "lug" acts as sort of a short butting or even a sort of gusset to help strengthen the junction.

Bianchi tried something like this in about '94 '95 the SuperLugg. it was welded to the HT but had traditional lug style 'points' (Tanges?) on the sides to increase stiffness. I think had they used a real deal lug it might have been more impressive
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Old 03-11-10, 11:46 AM
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This International Bicycle Company has similar "lugs"





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Old 03-11-10, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Mos6502
Bingo. Instead of lugs, these are just sections of oversized tubing attached to the head tube. None of the other joints are so constructed.
One-piece, bulge-formed head tubes were fairly common on low to mid-level frames until TIG became popular. They'd start as a piece of sheet metal, then the top and down tube spigots were pressed into it, the sheet wrapped into a tube, welded closed, and the spigot ends finished. It made frame construction easier because the top and down tubes could be simply straight-cut at the head tube end to fit into the spigots.
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Old 03-11-10, 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by big_heineken
This International Bicycle Company has similar "lugs"





That is actually something completely different. That is technart frame (skyway/bridgestone) with cast aluminum lugs.

Originally Posted by JohnDThompson
One-piece, bulge-formed head tubes were fairly common on low to mid-level frames until TIG became popular. They'd start as a piece of sheet metal, then the top and down tube spigots were pressed into it, the sheet wrapped into a tube, welded closed, and the spigot ends finished. It made frame construction easier because the top and down tubes could be simply straight-cut at the head tube end to fit into the spigots.
This is true. But that's not what is happening on this Hawthorne. These "lugs" are just short sections of oversized tube slipped over the front ends of the top and down tube.
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Old 03-11-10, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Mos6502
This is true. But that's not what is happening on this Hawthorne. These "lugs" are just short sections of oversized tube slipped over the front ends of the top and down tube.
Lugs were fashionable, so the marketing department tasked the designers with finding a way to make it look like their frame had lugs without spending too much money on it.
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Old 03-11-10, 01:38 PM
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Try these head lugs on for size, and tell me what you think:



-Kurt
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Old 03-11-10, 02:29 PM
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some bikes actually had "lugs" that were cast in place around the tubes. Bridgestone? And bulge-formed one-piece head tube/lug combos were pretty common. In fact, there was some discussion about bringing them back on the framebuilder's mailing list.
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Old 03-11-10, 04:32 PM
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Originally Posted by cudak888
Try these head lugs on for size, and tell me what you think:



-Kurt
Let's see the inside of the head tube. If it's 3-piece (fully lugged), there'll just be a couple vent holes for the top and down tubes. If it's a one-piece headlug, there'll be a full-size opening to those tubes and you'll likely be able to see the ends of the tubes inside the sockets.
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Old 03-11-10, 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnDThompson
Let's see the inside of the head tube. If it's 3-piece (fully lugged), there'll just be a couple vent holes for the top and down tubes. If it's a one-piece headlug, there'll be a full-size opening to those tubes and you'll likely be able to see the ends of the tubes inside the sockets.
Take my word for it - one piece headlug.

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Old 03-11-10, 07:34 PM
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Originally Posted by cudak888
Take my word for it - one piece headlug.

-Kurt
I believe you.
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