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Show us your Raleigh Super Course!

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Show us your Raleigh Super Course!

Old 02-22-19, 04:52 PM
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[MENTION=446010]BocaJr[/MENTION], That Nervar crankset is pretty cool. One of the very few steel square-taper cotterless cranks ever made.
Campy made one (late-'60s, early '70s), and that's about it AFAIK (not counting later ultra-cheap or kiddie cranks)

Gnutti before that ('50s I think) made a steel cotterless, but with a tapered spline interface, not square.

An Ashtabula crank is technically cotterless, so maybe I need to say cotterless 3-piece cranks?

Oh yeah Profile BMX cranks and Bullseye were steel too, with weird proprietary attachment systems, not square taper.

Back on-topic -- I did see one of those Super Courses with the steel cotterless Nervar where the swaged-on spider came loose from the right arm in a way that the cranks could turn without the spider and rings turning. Stationary bike! We sold lots of those SCs though and I only saw one that failed, probably a rare problem.

-Mark Bulgier, Seattle
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Old 02-22-19, 05:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Piff
No no no, you simply can't describe your bike like that and leave us sans pictures. Please pm me!
OK let's try this again, I seem to have reached the majic 10-post threshold. Hold my beer...



Flickr album with a few more and larger photos here: https://flic.kr/s/aHsma2ofjH

-Mark Bulgier, Seattle
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Old 02-22-19, 05:40 PM
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Originally Posted by noglider
Welcome to BF, [MENTION=160106]bulgie[/MENTION]!
Thanks!! Great to be here.

I haven't read this whole thread so apologies if this has been covered but...

Anyone here ever seen a circa 1970 SC Mixte? I know by maybe '74-'75 SC mixte was a thing, but have only seen one of the ~70 vintage.
We had one for a while years ago, sorry I didn't take pictures but it was a real Coffee SC with a Reynolds sticker, and the script Super Course TT decal on the little mixte stay near the HT. I'm thinking 1970 because it had the oval head badge, which I have heard called the "Jubilee" badge. And the parts matched the spec in the '70 catalog.

Laurie didn't really love it, and she has lots of other bikes, so we got rid of it maybe 10 years ago. Got it free, sold it cheap after putting a lot of work into overhauling and tuning.

The 1970 catalog says a "Ladies model" [sic] was available, but they don't show a picture. Lady's or Ladies' frames are usually a step-through design though (very low "top" tube with no additional stays), not a mixte. We sold lots of Record and Gran Prix Lady's bikes and they were all step-through, not Mixte, if I'm remembering it right

-Mark Bulgier, Seattle
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Old 02-22-19, 09:27 PM
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Originally Posted by bulgie
Anyone here ever seen a circa 1970 SC Mixte? I know by maybe '74-'75 SC mixte was a thing, but have only seen one of the ~70 vintage.

-Mark Bulgier, Seattle
Mark, I found '71 or '72 SuperCourse mixte at a dump in Deer Isle, ME, a few years ago. We were vacationing there and didn't have enough room to hall the whole bike home, so I just took the frame and a few bits. My wife already has a Raleigh mixte, so this one went off to a new home via eBay:

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Old 02-23-19, 01:18 AM
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Originally Posted by nlerner
Mark, I found '71 or '72 SuperCourse mixte at a dump in Deer Isle, ME, a few years ago. We were vacationing there and didn't have enough room to hall the whole bike home, so I just took the frame and a few bits. My wife already has a Raleigh mixte, so this one went off to a new home via eBay:
Yep that's her -- or maybe one year later, because it has a Heron headbadge rather than the oval Jubilee badge on ours.

I just remembered one more thing about ours, it had a Weinmann brand h-bar stem, interesting design with a steel quill pressed into a cast Al alloy extension. Nice looking stem. I can't prove it was original, but everything seemed of one era, and all with the same patina -- I think the Weinmann stem was OEM.

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Old 02-23-19, 11:22 AM
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Cool old bike with a lot of stuff we don't usually see here.

I think it deserves its own thread with lots of close up pics. I'm still trying to wrap my head around this part...

Originally Posted by bulgie
...

Mid-'50s FW (wide range four-speed) alloy-shell rear hub that's been converted to be a 5-speed, with all the original '50s guts except for a couple parts from a later S5. Big sprocket for low gears because I'm old and slow!

The second shifter for the left side of the hub (high-low range) is a Cyclo of Birmingham, '50s vintage I think, on the toptube. I brazed on a second pivot for a pulley on the left, on the '50s pulley clamp under the seat lug.
...
...especially the two speed arrangement?
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Old 02-23-19, 11:25 AM
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[MENTION=160106]bulgie[/MENTION], I love it. So you have an old SA Dynohub™ and an FW hub, with four super low gears. More pictures, please!

My 1971 Super Course also has nothing original except for the headset, and I have to hope it never gives out. Luckily those headsets are well made.
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Old 02-23-19, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by noglider
[MENTION=160106]bulgie[/MENTION], I love it. So you have an old SA Dynohub™ and an FW hub, with four super low gears. More pictures, please!

My 1971 Super Course also has nothing original except for the headset, and I have to hope it never gives out. Luckily those headsets are well made.
Would love to see this because I am having a hard time wrapping my pea brain around this.
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Old 02-23-19, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by OTS
Would love to see this because I am having a hard time wrapping my pea brain around this.
Around which, the hubs or the headset?
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Old 02-23-19, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by noglider
Around which, the hubs or the headset?
Ah, around the hubs, sounds like a hybrid hub arrangement.
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Old 02-23-19, 01:12 PM
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Mark Stonich/Bikesmithdesign.com has instructions on converting an FW into a 5-speed hub, starting on p. 7 of this document. I bought the parts needed from Mark and did convert one FW. It was reasonably successful though it was a bit temperamental about staying in gear. That bike got sold off, but I do have the parts to do another conversion at some point.
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Old 02-23-19, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by nlerner
Mark Stonich/Bikesmithdesign.com has instructions on converting an FW into a 5-speed hub, starting on p. 7 of this document. I bought the parts needed from Mark and did convert one FW. It was reasonably successful though it was a bit temperamental about staying in gear. That bike got sold off, but I do have the parts to do another conversion at some point.
Thank you [MENTION=45088]nlerner[/MENTION] for the Mark Stonich link. I was about to write something along the lines of "I don't have time for a complete braindump on the subject, check the web, the truth is out there". AASHTA: https://www.sheldonbrown.com/sturmey-archer/s52.html

But here are some basics for people who don't know about olde English 4- and 5-speed hubs.

Starting with a 3-speed for background: they have a sun gear fixed to the axle, with 4 planet gears that mesh with the sun and with an outer toothed ring, that just fits in that big hub "can" with the spoke flanges. Right here an animation might help, but you can probably imagine that within that constraint (the diameter of the ring gear), the designer can choose different combinations of sun and planet sizes -- a smaller sun with bigger planets, or vice-versa. The ratios of those sizes determines whether it is a close-ratio "racing" hub like the Sturmey "AC" (close-ratio), "AM" (medium) or "AW" (wide). The AW was so much more popular than the others that if you see an old SA 3-speed it is about 99.9% likely to be an AW, or the variants like coaster brake, drum brake or dynohub rears that also used the AW ratios.

This set of hub, planets and outer ring is called an epicyclic or planetary gear train. As most often used, they can increase the gear ratio or decrease it, compared to the Normal gear, which is just the front chainring teeth divided by the rear sprocket teeth. With an AW, the ratio is 3/4, so Low is 75% of Normal, and High gets the reciprocal of 3/4 -- it's 4/3 of Normal, or 133%. "Second gear" on a 3-speed is just Normal, no step up or down.

A Sturmey 4- or 5-speed hub still has a single epicyclic gear train, but you get to choose between two different sun/planet sets, so it' like getting to choose between a narrow-range 3-speed and a wide-range 3-speed.

The 5-speed is simpler to comprehend because the two functions are separated out to two different shift levers. Cables go down to both the right and left sides of the hub. A 4-speed does it all with one lever, cable on the Right only, with some clever trickery inside the hub to switch the sun/planets. Downside is you lose the extra-high high gear, so it's a 3-speed with a lower Low added..

On the 5-speed, the right-side lever is a normal SA 3-speed trigger. Other shifter styles are possible but the trigger is most popular by far. It gives you Low, Normal and High gears, on whichever set of sun and planets have been selected by the left lever. I.e. if you leave the left lever alone, the hub is a 3-speed.

The left-side lever selects whether you want a narrow or wide range. It slides the two suns sideways on the axle to change which one is fixed to the axle, and thus is being used. The unused sun just floats on the axle, unbound.

Since normal is still normal whichever sun is used, it is completely unaffected by the left lever position. What the left lever does is choose between your two available High gears and your two available Low gears. You follow? Two Lows and two Highs plus one normal gives you 5.

Now there's another complication in how the suns get slid sideways.

One way has the suns spring-loaded to go to the right, and an indicator chain pulls them to the left when you apply tension on the cable with the left lever. The indicator chain used is just like the familiar one that goes in the Right side on the ubiquitous AW 3-speed.

The other way has the suns spring-loaded to go to the Left, and a pusher rod that pushes them to the right. The pusher rod is actuated by a bell-crank to turn the cable tension into a pushing force. This is just like the old Shimano 3-speeds worked, if you've ever seen one of those -- they used a bell-crank and a pusher rod on the right side. In fact this is a popular "hack" for people converting 4-speed hubs to 5-speed -- the bell-crank conversion is easier, but real SA bell-cranks are rare nowadays, and expensive when they come up on eBay. So some people use a Shimano bell-crank on the left side of their SA 5-speed.

I might be getting too much into the details. I only meant to cover why there are two levers and how that makes for 5 gear ratios. Did I answer everyone's questions?

-Mark Bulgier, Seattle
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Old 02-23-19, 07:10 PM
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Originally Posted by noglider
[MENTION=160106]bulgie[/MENTION], I love it. So you have an old SA Dynohub™ and an FW hub, with four super low gears.
Not quite. The rear hub still says FW on it, but it has been converted to a 5-speed, so it is essentially a Sturmey S5 now. The extra gear I got is a higher high, which enabled me to gear down the Normal ratio lower without completely giving up on downhills and tailwinds.

-Mark Bulgier, Seattle
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Old 03-16-19, 08:55 PM
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First of all, I'm on my second Super Course. My '73 has been on here several times. It was my first ever bike build from a found and trashed frame. It was great fun building it, and its a great ride. I was proud to do last year's Eroica CA on it. So when a gold '78 popped up on local CL for $20, I grabbed it. I've been ticking off the build issues as I go along. It came with no shifters, brake levers, derailleurs, crank or wheels. I've got all that worked out - except shifters. I love the Suntour bar ends on the green one, so I planned to install them on the gold one. No go. Turns out the wall thickness of the bars are so thick, I can't get the shifters to go into the bars. I see several bikes of similar vintage as mine here, many with Suntour bar end shifters. I'm thinking these bars are original, as is the Raleigh branded stem. I measure an o.d. of 24mm on these bars with an I.d. of 19.8mm. The Suntours I have are 20.6 mm diameter. Is it worth hogging them out a little, or are there any other bar end shifters that might fit these bars? The bars on the gold bike are much wider than the bars on my '73. You can almost fit the green bike's bars inside the span of the bars on the gold '78. Did they evolve into wider bars with a thicker wall thickness in the mid to late 70's. I'm confused... Anybody?






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Old 03-24-19, 08:09 PM
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I just bought a Super Course frame a week or so ago, ('71 or '72), and I don't know what to do about the brazed-on rear brake cable stop. All the cable adjusters I am familiar with are 6 mm threaded, but this has a 4 mm unthreaded hole. Where do I find a 4 mm threaded cable adjuster, or do I just use a 5 mm to 4 mm step down cable end ferule?
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Old 03-24-19, 08:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Ol Danl
I just bought a Super Course frame a week or so ago, ('71 or '72), and I don't know what to do about the brazed-on rear brake cable stop. All the cable adjusters I am familiar with are 6 mm threaded, but this has a 4 mm unthreaded hole. Where do I find a 4 mm threaded cable adjuster, or do I just use a 5 mm to 4 mm step down cable end ferule?
You can often pay a ridiculously high sum for one of those adjusters on eBay or you can just use a ferrule. Mine doesn’t even fit in the hole but works just fine. I can only make adjustments at the caliper but that’s no big deal. It looks like this.
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Old 03-24-19, 08:59 PM
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Thanks. I've got a ferrule that fits. That may be what I'll use. I don't understand why there's no threads in the hole, anyway.
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Old 03-24-19, 09:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Pcampeau

You can often pay a ridiculously high sum for one of those adjusters on eBay or you can just use a ferrule. Mine doesn’t even fit in the hole but works just fine. I can only make adjustments at the caliper but that’s no big deal. It looks like this.
Here’s the rest of the bike since I don’t think I’ve posted it here yet. It’s a 1968 badged as a Raleigh with Carlton decals on the down tube.
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Old 03-24-19, 09:15 PM
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Really nice. Is that the first year for the Raleigh Super Course?
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Old 03-24-19, 09:20 PM
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68 is the first appearance in the catalog, yes. But the serial number on mine seems to date it to late 67.
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Old 03-25-19, 06:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Ol Danl
I just bought a Super Course frame a week or so ago, ('71 or '72), and I don't know what to do about the brazed-on rear brake cable stop. All the cable adjusters I am familiar with are 6 mm threaded, but this has a 4 mm unthreaded hole. Where do I find a 4 mm threaded cable adjuster, or do I just use a 5 mm to 4 mm step down cable end ferule?
I bought a pair of Problem Solvers inline barrel adjusters for this purpose. I just used the 'male' half, and tapped the hole in the bridge with whatever threading the adjuster was made for. It seems to be working fine after many years now. Having the other one in the parts box turned out to be good luck, too, and I used it in another project.
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Old 03-25-19, 12:14 PM
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Thanks. Another possibility.
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Old 04-14-19, 02:06 PM
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70's Red Raleigh Super Course

I was admiring so many great SC bikes on this forum, and have come to the conclusion that
it's time to find a new home for my 1970's red Raleigh Super Course.
I haven't ridden in over 15 years and this beauty needs some TLC, overhaul, new tires, etc.
What great memories of rides around my home town of Rochester, NY
[I'm in the Boston area now, and like it or not, this bike is just taking up room in my kitchen]
If you know of someone who has a passion for these classic bikes, please let'em know.]
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Old 04-14-19, 02:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Ol Danl
Thanks. I've got a ferrule that fits. That may be what I'll use. I don't understand why there's no threads in the hole, anyway.
The original threaded adjuster has a lockring/nut, so oldschool cable tension holds it in place once adjusted.
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Old 04-14-19, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Duradasih
I was admiring so many great SC bikes on this forum, and have come to the conclusion that
it's time to find a new home for my 1970's red Raleigh Super Course.
I haven't ridden in over 15 years and this beauty needs some TLC, overhaul, new tires, etc.
What great memories of rides around my home town of Rochester, NY
[I'm in the Boston area now, and like it or not, this bike is just taking up room in my kitchen]
If you know of someone who has a passion for these classic bikes, please let'em know.]
What size is it? Can you post pictures? Actually, you can't post pictures here until you have ten posts here, but you could post them somewhere else. Your bike will make someone happy, so thanks for asking.
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