Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

What are the top end C&V road bikes from each Japanese manufacturer?

Notices
Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

What are the top end C&V road bikes from each Japanese manufacturer?

Old 12-20-10, 10:12 AM
  #51  
rat fink
Iconoclast
 
rat fink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: California
Posts: 3,183

Bikes: Colnago Super, Fuji Opus III, Specialized Rockhopper, Specialized Sirrus (road)

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by KonAaron Snake View Post
I have no idea how accurate this is over all, but a couple folks I've spoken to think the 3rensho road bikes are not desirable and suffer from a too track bike'ish influence. I did have the chance to buy a 3rensho road bike in my size and passed on it after riding it. I was not impressed. I know the track bike is a whole other story.
Please elaborate. Was it the handling that made it feel too trackish? Not desirable from a riders POV, or collectible (because they are the road and not track version)? I'm curious.
rat fink is offline  
Old 12-20-10, 10:13 AM
  #52  
Chicago Al 
Senior Member
 
Chicago Al's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Chicago, the leafy NW side
Posts: 2,518

Bikes: 1974 Motobecane Grand Record, 1987 Miyata Pro, 1988 Bob Jackson Lady Mixte (wife's), others in the family

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 70 Post(s)
Liked 52 Times in 31 Posts
(ahem)


Really need to do some better pictures.

Centurion does seem to have changed their top offerings a lot (Professional, Turbo, Equipe, Prestige 1985, Ironman Master, Prestige 1989) maybe trying to find the 'sweet spot' of a premium bike they could sell enough of to make it profitable. Of course they presumably had the problem of writing the specs then sourcing everything including the frame, while for Miyata et al it was in-house.

I wasn't paying attention to cycling at the time, but wasn't a 'premium' Japanese bike still regarded as something of an oxymoron well into the 80s? Not saying it was true, just the perception. I took a Miyata on a C&V ride here last year and one of the participants told me that back in the day they were considered nice but 'blue collar.'
__________________
I never think I have hit hard, unless it rebounds.

- Dr Samuel Johnson
Chicago Al is offline  
Old 12-20-10, 10:21 AM
  #53  
OzarkKing
Senior Member
 
OzarkKing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Lake Ozark, MO
Posts: 53

Bikes: 1987 Fuji Titanium, 1983 Fuji Touring Series IV, 1977 Panasonic Touring Deluxe, 1994 Mountain Cycle San Andreas

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Quick sidenote (other than noting that there are some sweet bikes on this thread): What is the little spikey nipple thing in this picture? I just picked up a Cilo frame this morning that also has one...
OzarkKing is offline  
Old 12-20-10, 10:25 AM
  #54  
norskagent
car dodger
 
norskagent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: garner/raleigh nc
Posts: 3,416
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 47 Times in 29 Posts
Frame pump peg
__________________
1989 Schwinn Paramount OS
1980 Mclean/Silk Hope Sport Touring
1983 Bianchi pista
1976 Fuji Feather track
1979 raleigh track
"I've consulted my sources and I'm pretty sure your derailleur does not exist"
norskagent is offline  
Old 12-20-10, 10:28 AM
  #55  
KonAaron Snake 
Fat Guy on a Little Bike
 
KonAaron Snake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 17,117

Bikes: Two wheeled ones

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1217 Post(s)
Liked 198 Times in 113 Posts
Originally Posted by rat fink View Post
Please elaborate. Was it the handling that made it feel too trackish? Not desirable from a riders POV, or collectible (because they are the road and not track version)? I'm curious.
Please understand I'm going predominantly from things I've heard from other riders. Their argument was that the 3Rensho road bikes had a geometry and feel that was too track bike'ish. They found them twitchy and uncomfortable on longer rides. I rode one for about 2 miles and it didn't do much for me, certainly not enough to justify the $1700 asking price. It didn't have the responsive magic I feel when the right bike is in my hands (like the Sachs or Merlin). It felt a little spongey to me. I also wasn't wild about the aesthetics and found it plain looking.

I'm not an expert on 3Renshos or their collectibility, but my impression is that they're well worth the investment from that perspective. They seem to have a strong following and a lot of value potential.
KonAaron Snake is offline  
Old 12-20-10, 10:30 AM
  #56  
KonAaron Snake 
Fat Guy on a Little Bike
 
KonAaron Snake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 17,117

Bikes: Two wheeled ones

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1217 Post(s)
Liked 198 Times in 113 Posts
Originally Posted by Chicago Al View Post
(ahem)


Really need to do some better pictures.

Centurion does seem to have changed their top offerings a lot (Professional, Turbo, Equipe, Prestige 1985, Ironman Master, Prestige 1989) maybe trying to find the 'sweet spot' of a premium bike they could sell enough of to make it profitable. Of course they presumably had the problem of writing the specs then sourcing everything including the frame, while for Miyata et al it was in-house.

I wasn't paying attention to cycling at the time, but wasn't a 'premium' Japanese bike still regarded as something of an oxymoron well into the 80s? Not saying it was true, just the perception. I took a Miyata on a C&V ride here last year and one of the participants told me that back in the day they were considered nice but 'blue collar.'
They had that reputation because they were comparatively inexpensive and didn't have the hand built cache.
KonAaron Snake is offline  
Old 12-20-10, 10:57 AM
  #57  
Picchio Special
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lancaster County, PA
Posts: 5,060

Bikes: '39 Hobbs, '58 Marastoni, '73 Italian custom, '75 Wizard, '76 Wilier, '78 Tom Kellogg, '79 Colnago Super, '79 Sachs, '81 Masi Prestige, '82 Cuevas, '83 Picchio Special, '84 Murray-Serotta, '85 Trek 170, '89 Bianchi, '90 Bill Holland, '94 Grandis

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Originally Posted by KonAaron Snake View Post
Please understand I'm going predominantly from things I've heard from other riders. Their argument was that the 3Rensho road bikes had a geometry and feel that was too track bike'ish. They found them twitchy and uncomfortable on longer rides. I rode one for about 2 miles and it didn't do much for me, certainly not enough to justify the $1700 asking price. It didn't have the responsive magic I feel when the right bike is in my hands (like the Sachs or Merlin). It felt a little spongey to me. I also wasn't wild about the aesthetics and found it plain looking.

I'm not an expert on 3Renshos or their collectibility, but my impression is that they're well worth the investment from that perspective. They seem to have a strong following and a lot of value potential.
I can understand the ride quality not being everyone's cup of tea. I do, however, find the overall design and aesthetics quite appealing - things like the offset fork crown and dropout junctions are pretty sweet and distinctive. My brother had a 3rensho road bike he built up with all Suntour Superbe Pro, and I saw it up close on many occasions.
Picchio Special is offline  
Old 12-20-10, 11:22 AM
  #58  
wrk101
Thrifty Bill
 
wrk101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Mountains of Western NC
Posts: 22,599

Bikes: 86 Katakura Silk, 87 Prologue X2, 88 Cimarron LE, 1975 Sekai 4000 Professional, 73 Paramount, plus more

Mentioned: 79 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 906 Post(s)
Liked 316 Times in 237 Posts
Originally Posted by Chicago Al View Post
(ahem)

I wasn't paying attention to cycling at the time, but wasn't a 'premium' Japanese bike still regarded as something of an oxymoron well into the 80s? Not saying it was true, just the perception. I took a Miyata on a C&V ride here last year and one of the participants told me that back in the day they were considered nice but 'blue collar.'
Probably so. When I was looking to upgrade from my Schwinn Continental in the mid 1970s, my dream bike was a Nishiki (don't remember the exact model). I guess you would put me in that blue collar market. For a few dollars more than a Continental, you could get a much lighter bike, with alloy rims, alloy cotterless crankset, cromoly frame, etc. So my initial interest in Japanese bikes was based on value. You could get a lot of bike for the money, compared to what European and US bikes were selling for.

The values were really compelling.


Later I began to appreciate the workmanship of many Japanese bikes, like my handbuilt Lotus Classique (1983).
wrk101 is offline  
Old 12-20-10, 12:01 PM
  #59  
balindamood 
Wrench Savant
 
balindamood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: 61 Degrees North
Posts: 2,252

Bikes: Yes

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 14 Times in 7 Posts
Please understand I'm going predominantly from things I've heard from other riders. Their argument was that the 3Rensho road bikes had a geometry and feel that was too track bike'ish. They found them twitchy and uncomfortable on longer rides. I rode one for about 2 miles and it didn't do much for me, certainly not enough to justify the $1700 asking price. It didn't have the responsive magic I feel when the right bike is in my hands (like the Sachs or Merlin). It felt a little spongey to me. I also wasn't wild about the aesthetics and found it plain looking.
I am going to have to agree with you. I have a 3Rensho SRA, and it is a monster. It is the fastest thing I have, but will cut like a knife in any direction by just thinking about it. For criteriums, nothing is better. But if I am going on a long slog through the country side, I have a Colnago Super, Alan SR, PX-10, or Panasonic Proffesional which are much better for the purpose. I put my recently aquired Geoffrry Butler, Kabuki DFD, Allez, and Mercian Superlight in the same catagory as the 3Rensho, but no where near as quick. It is kinda like having a Ferarri F40 in the garage. Fun on weekends, but you wouldn't want to drive it to work every day.

Gratuitous picture:

__________________
"Where you come from is gone;
where you are headed weren't never there;
and where you are ain't no good unless you can get away from it."
balindamood is offline  
Old 12-20-10, 04:39 PM
  #60  
BlankCrows
Avenir Equipped
 
BlankCrows's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,148

Bikes: Chesini X-Uno, etc.....

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Elev12k View Post
Exactly! That is what I read on the frame: Zebrakenko (and Zebra Bicycle) Golden Sports Olympic Ace

https://www.flickr.com/photos/39479610@N08/

I doubt whether the Zebrakenko brand was ever seriously representated on the European market. I wouldn't be surprised if mine was for testing water purposes or so.
I think T-Mar has mentioned before that there was no clear documentation that the Zebra name which showed up later was in fact the same company as Zebrakenko. This bike seems to be a great bridge linking the Zebrakenko and Zebra brand names, having both names on it.
BlankCrows is offline  
Old 12-20-10, 04:58 PM
  #61  
martl
Strong Walker
 
martl's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Munich, Germany
Posts: 985

Bikes: too many

Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 179 Post(s)
Liked 158 Times in 100 Posts
not sure if Zunow had anything else than a "top line", but in my opinion, the "Z1" definitely is a top frame.

martl is offline  
Old 12-21-10, 12:13 PM
  #62  
T-Mar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 20,861
Mentioned: 561 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3761 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1,176 Times in 874 Posts
Originally Posted by BlankCrows View Post
I think T-Mar has mentioned before that there was no clear documentation that the Zebra name which showed up later was in fact the same company as Zebrakenko. This bike seems to be a great bridge linking the Zebrakenko and Zebra brand names, having both names on it.
Actually, I always had that bridge. The circa 1975 Zebrakenko ads mention Zebra Bicycle. This and the similarity in name always made it a good probability that they were simply renamed but there was nothing concete. More digging showed the most modern reference for the Zebrakenko brand being 1984 and the earliest Zebra brand reference being 1985. While the timeframe seemed to be too much of a coincidence and greatly improved my confidence, I was really hoping for some objective tie, like the both brands having the same distributor for 1984 and 1985. Unfortunately, the distributor names and locations are different. The only tie was that they were both in New York City but given that NYC is a big business center and is home for lots of other bicycle importers and distributors, that didn't prove anything. The bottom line is that I'm not 100% certain that it was a simple name change but almost everything points in that direction.

Speaking of confidence levels, the Olympic Ace pics show a Crane rear derailleur as opposed to Dura-Ace. That increases the odds of it being pre-1977 while the style of oil clip on the hubs decreases the probability of it being from 1973. So now, the most likely era is 1974-1976.

I also dug back through my archives and found out that Zebrakenko had sponsored the Japanese Olympic cycling team prior to the mid-1970s, so the model name likely stems from that sponsorship and the Dura-Ace components.

Last edited by T-Mar; 12-21-10 at 12:16 PM.
T-Mar is offline  
Old 12-21-10, 01:31 PM
  #63  
rat fink
Iconoclast
 
rat fink's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: California
Posts: 3,183

Bikes: Colnago Super, Fuji Opus III, Specialized Rockhopper, Specialized Sirrus (road)

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by KonAaron Snake View Post
Please understand I'm going predominantly from things I've heard from other riders. Their argument was that the 3Rensho road bikes had a geometry and feel that was too track bike'ish. They found them twitchy and uncomfortable on longer rides. I rode one for about 2 miles and it didn't do much for me, certainly not enough to justify the $1700 asking price. It didn't have the responsive magic I feel when the right bike is in my hands (like the Sachs or Merlin). It felt a little spongey to me. I also wasn't wild about the aesthetics and found it plain looking.

I'm not an expert on 3Renshos or their collectibility, but my impression is that they're well worth the investment from that perspective. They seem to have a strong following and a lot of value potential.
Thanks for your input. I wonder if that is the same thing that my Colnago Super is afflicted/blessed with. While I haven't yet been able to check it, I have been told that my Super should have between a 74 and 76 degree HTA. It certainly has very precise front end geometry... but that is something I like about it! So, I figure that is why it's so much more sensitive to steering input than my other two bikes.

I wonder if this trait of being 'too track bike-like', that I tend to seek in a frame, is the common denominator between the bikes that C&V folk don't tend to be a fan of.

Originally Posted by balindamood View Post
I am going to have to agree with you. I have a 3Rensho SRA, and it is a monster. It is the fastest thing I have, but will cut like a knife in any direction by just thinking about it. For criteriums, nothing is better. But if I am going on a long slog through the country side, I have a Colnago Super, Alan SR, PX-10, or Panasonic Proffesional which are much better for the purpose. I put my recently aquired Geoffrry Butler, Kabuki DFD, Allez, and Mercian Superlight in the same catagory as the 3Rensho, but no where near as quick. It is kinda like having a Ferarri F40 in the garage. Fun on weekends, but you wouldn't want to drive it to work every day.
It's interesting that you mention your Colnago Super as part of the more docile group. IIRC, yours is a ~early 80s frame. Perhaps, by then, they had toned down the crit/track geometry and made it more road geo.

I've noticed that people on C&V tend to regard De Rosa highly, especially, for their magical ride qualities. I wonder if De Rosa was one of those companies that never made their frames with the more aggressive experimental geometries that were popular among high end builders in the late seventies. Food for thought, anyway.
rat fink is offline  
Old 12-21-10, 01:50 PM
  #64  
mickey85
perpetually frazzled
 
mickey85's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Linton, IN
Posts: 2,470

Bikes: 1977 Bridgestone Kabuki Super Speed; 1979 Raleigh Professional; 1983 Raleigh Rapide mixte; 1974 Peugeot UO-8; 1993 Univega Activa Trail; 1972 Raleigh Sports; 1967 Phillips; 1981 Schwinn World Tourist; 1976 Schwinn LeTour mixte; 1964 Western Flyer

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
You know, in looking at these, they're absolutely gorgeous. I'm more of an English bike nut (whose stable has only three and a half English bikes for a dozen or so Japanese/Taiwanese bikes), and these are all on my list now!
mickey85 is offline  
Old 12-21-10, 07:31 PM
  #65  
Collin2424
Beach-Bound
 
Collin2424's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Bay Area, California
Posts: 650
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Man I love the Univega Super Speciale and the Competizione. I have a Super Strada that could be top of the line, depending on whether you prefer Campy Record or Dura Ace 7200.

Did anyone mention the Centurion Turbo? Full Suntour Superbe.

This is an awesome thread, because I'm always looking for top of the line Japanese bikes Just bought a 1986 Schwinn Peloton which was made by Panasonic. Technically, wasn't it Schwinn's top of the line Japanese bike that year?



Pro-Miyata is hiding in the background. But that's one down from top of the line so it's garbage.

-Collin-
Collin2424 is offline  
Old 12-21-10, 07:38 PM
  #66  
KonAaron Snake 
Fat Guy on a Little Bike
 
KonAaron Snake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 17,117

Bikes: Two wheeled ones

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1217 Post(s)
Liked 198 Times in 113 Posts
Originally Posted by Collin2424 View Post
Man I love the Univega Super Speciale and the Competizione. I have a Super Strada that could be top of the line, depending on whether you prefer Campy Record or Dura Ace 7200.

Did anyone mention the Centurion Turbo? Full Suntour Superbe.

This is an awesome thread, because I'm always looking for top of the line Japanese bikes Just bought a 1986 Schwinn Peloton which was made by Panasonic. Technically, wasn't it Schwinn's top of the line Japanese bike that year?



Pro-Miyata is hiding in the background. But that's one down from top of the line so it's garbage.

-Collin-
I agree...garbage! Please send it to me and I'll dispose of it for you
KonAaron Snake is offline  
Old 12-22-10, 04:03 AM
  #67  
Collin2424
Beach-Bound
 
Collin2424's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Bay Area, California
Posts: 650
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by KonAaron Snake View Post
I agree...garbage! Please send it to me and I'll dispose of it for you
Sure, says the Team-Miyata owner!!! Mine is like the Oprah Winfrey to your Halle Berry!!!
Collin2424 is offline  
Old 12-22-10, 06:26 AM
  #68  
shrinkboy
Senior Member
 
shrinkboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 629
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
when racing in the mid 80s, the standard setup around these parts (north texas) was one of the italian classics, colnago/masi/guerciotti/gios/grandis (mine), etc with campy nuovo record/super record on high flange hubs (criterium setup) with mavic or fiamme sewups-- you'd see a guy show up with a japanese bike and ask yourself why he didn't stretch the extra few hundo's for the italian gear. it was definitely, though not accurately, seen as second tier.

Originally Posted by Chicago Al View Post
(ahem)


Really need to do some better pictures.

Centurion does seem to have changed their top offerings a lot (Professional, Turbo, Equipe, Prestige 1985, Ironman Master, Prestige 1989) maybe trying to find the 'sweet spot' of a premium bike they could sell enough of to make it profitable. Of course they presumably had the problem of writing the specs then sourcing everything including the frame, while for Miyata et al it was in-house.

I wasn't paying attention to cycling at the time, but wasn't a 'premium' Japanese bike still regarded as something of an oxymoron well into the 80s? Not saying it was true, just the perception. I took a Miyata on a C&V ride here last year and one of the participants told me that back in the day they were considered nice but 'blue collar.'
shrinkboy is offline  
Old 12-22-10, 06:27 AM
  #69  
shrinkboy
Senior Member
 
shrinkboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 629
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
and i'd love to find a 60/61cm Schwinn Peloton
shrinkboy is offline  
Old 12-22-10, 07:05 AM
  #70  
KonAaron Snake 
Fat Guy on a Little Bike
 
KonAaron Snake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 17,117

Bikes: Two wheeled ones

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1217 Post(s)
Liked 198 Times in 113 Posts
Originally Posted by Collin2424 View Post
Sure, says the Team-Miyata owner!!! Mine is like the Oprah Winfrey to your Halle Berry!!!
I'm fairly sure it's pretty much the same bike with different paint and components. For a solid 10 years my favorite bike was a Miyata 916...which is one down from the Miyata Pro, and it's a bigger step than the Team to the Pro. Miyatas are just wonderfully stiff, comfortable bikes. I also think the Pros look better.
KonAaron Snake is offline  
Old 12-22-10, 10:25 AM
  #71  
Collin2424
Beach-Bound
 
Collin2424's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Bay Area, California
Posts: 650
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Oops, I missed the Centurion Turbo right above. Beautiful bike. Not my first choice for riding in the snow, but beautiful bike

-Collin-
Collin2424 is offline  
Old 12-22-10, 02:03 PM
  #72  
Catnap
zungguzungguguzungguzeng
 
Catnap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Williamsburg, Brooklyn
Posts: 1,284

Bikes: Zunow, Jo Routens, Bridgestone, Mercier, Cannondale

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 28 Times in 10 Posts
I'm a huge fan of collectible handmade Japanese steel. Here's my top ten list:

Zunow
Nakagawa
Ravanello
Cherubim
Katakura Silk
Araya
Toei
San Rensho / 3Rensho
Kalavinka
Nagasawa
Makino

The last four are better known for their track bikes, but all have made gorgeous and extremely aggressive road frames. Toei is a highly respected name in touring bikes. Nakagawa and Ravanello are both one-man shops, and I believe Nakagawa worked for Zunow in the 80's. Zunow and San Rensho are no longer in business. There's a company called Zunow East that still uses the logo and name, but the frames are not that special. Araya, commonly known for their wheels, also made steel frames for a time. Very rare stuff, and the Japanese market values all of these highly, making them even rarer in the states.
Catnap is offline  
Old 12-22-10, 02:09 PM
  #73  
ColonelJLloyd 
Senior Member
 
ColonelJLloyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Louisville
Posts: 8,382
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 109 Post(s)
Liked 6 Times in 5 Posts
Anyone mention Kuwahara yet? I know he was most famous for BMX bikes, but my LBS has a really nice lugged road bike that I'd consider buying if it were my size.
__________________
Bikes on Flickr
I prefer email to private messages. You can contact me at justinhughes@me.com
ColonelJLloyd is offline  
Old 12-22-10, 02:15 PM
  #74  
ScottRyder 
Photographer
 
ScottRyder's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: The other Cape, Cape Ann
Posts: 3,145
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 96 Post(s)
Liked 84 Times in 45 Posts
Originally Posted by ColonelJLloyd View Post
Anyone mention Kuwahara yet? I know he was most famous for BMX bikes, but my LBS has a really nice lugged road bike that I'd consider buying if it were my size.
I had a Kuwahara built Nishiki Cresta at one point. It was very nice, both in construction and ride quality.

Scott
__________________
ClassicFuji.posthaven.com.archive

IG @scottrydercycling
IG @scottryderphoto























ScottRyder is offline  
Old 12-22-10, 02:18 PM
  #75  
Picchio Special
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lancaster County, PA
Posts: 5,060

Bikes: '39 Hobbs, '58 Marastoni, '73 Italian custom, '75 Wizard, '76 Wilier, '78 Tom Kellogg, '79 Colnago Super, '79 Sachs, '81 Masi Prestige, '82 Cuevas, '83 Picchio Special, '84 Murray-Serotta, '85 Trek 170, '89 Bianchi, '90 Bill Holland, '94 Grandis

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Originally Posted by Catnap View Post
I'm a huge fan of collectible handmade Japanese steel. Here's my top ten list:

Zunow
Nakagawa
Ravanello
Cherubim
Katakura Silk
Araya
Toei
San Rensho / 3Rensho
Kalavinka
Nagasawa
Makino

The last four are better known for their track bikes, but all have made gorgeous and extremely aggressive road frames. Toei is a highly respected name in touring bikes. Nakagawa and Ravanello are both one-man shops, and I believe Nakagawa worked for Zunow in the 80's. Zunow and San Rensho are no longer in business. There's a company called Zunow East that still uses the logo and name, but the frames are not that special. Araya, commonly known for their wheels, also made steel frames for a time. Very rare stuff, and the Japanese market values all of these highly, making them even rarer in the states.
This is a good list. Do you know if Samson makes/made any road bikes? The Samson frames I've seen are extremely well made.
I also think Alps, Hirose, and Watanabe deserve mention. An Alps pass hunter is one of my "grail" bikes, though it will have to be a used one as the shop has closed.
Picchio Special is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.