Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

PX-10 Simplex hanger problem, now with pictures

Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

PX-10 Simplex hanger problem, now with pictures

Reply

Old 12-20-10, 07:58 AM
  #1  
jonwvara 
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
jonwvara's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Washington County, Vermont, USA
Posts: 2,814

Bikes: 1966 Dawes Double Blue, 1976 Raleigh Gran Sport, 1975 Raleigh Sprite 27, 1980 Univega Viva Sport, 1971 Gitane Tour de France, 1984 Lotus Classique, 1976 Motobecane Grand Record

Mentioned: 37 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 248 Post(s)
PX-10 Simplex hanger problem, now with pictures

This issue has been mentioned on a couple of different threads, but I'm starting another one since I now have photos. I'm fixing a PX-10 for a friend that has a partially butchered Simplex hanger. The old Simplex derailleur was busted (merde!) so the guy at the LBS took an electric drill and a 15/32 bit and bored out the original hole so he could insert one of those threaded "dropout savers." Then he bolted on a Shimano Tourney derailleur--the ugliest derailleur ever made, it looks like to me. Not sure why that worked on the Simplex hanger, but it did. I can't stand to leave it there, though--it's too hideous.

Here's my main question: Can I install a new dropout saver (the old one was so tight I wrecked it trying to get it out) and then install a Simplex RD in the 10 mm (threaded) mounting hole? It seems to me that that SHOULD work, but I've never actually seen an intact Simplex hanger before, and I have my doubts about this one. As you can see in the photos, the crudely drilled hole is not at all centered in the dropout, but is offset by a couple of millimeters toward the back. Was the original hole supposed to be centered, and the off-centeredness is a result of the butchery? If so, is that amount of non-centeredness likely to matter?

My plan had originally been to use a Huret Duopar RD with a mounting claw--I have one set up for the Huret-style mount--which I think can be installed without further violence to the integral Simplex hanger. The problem is the frame looks awful with both an integral hanger and a claw. I'm very reluctant cut off the integral hanger, though. (Although as I admitted to miamijim, I almost wish the LBS had cut it off, because it would make everything easier. And if it had happened before the bike came to me, it would be on someone else's conscience, not mine.)

But they didn't, so the hanger stays, which means going back to Simplex. Since this is a "geezerizing" project, I need a long-cage version. That would be what, an SX410GT or SX610GT? Does anyone have one that they'd be willing to part with, for cash or some sort of trade? Either of those derailleurs will handle a 34-tooth large cog, yes?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg
Suth Suntour FW.jpg (100.6 KB, 54 views)
File Type: jpg
PICT0398.jpg (101.1 KB, 37 views)
File Type: jpg
PICT0399.jpg (102.0 KB, 56 views)
File Type: jpg
PICT0401.jpg (101.6 KB, 53 views)
__________________
www.redclovercomponents.com

"Progress might have been all right once, but it has gone on too long."
--Ogden Nash
jonwvara is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-10, 08:20 AM
  #2  
Grand Bois
Senior Member
 
Grand Bois's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Pinole, CA, USA
Posts: 17,421
Mentioned: 22 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 427 Post(s)
The hole was centered, but the back of the hanger has been reshaped. Do I see a stop? It's hard to tell with that busy background. If there is a stop in the correct place you can use most any derailer.

In my experience, Simplex long cage derailers suck. With the exception of Huret Duopar, most all long cage derailers sucked except for Suntour until their patent on the slant parallelogram expired.
Grand Bois is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-10, 08:27 AM
  #3  
jonwvara 
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
jonwvara's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Washington County, Vermont, USA
Posts: 2,814

Bikes: 1966 Dawes Double Blue, 1976 Raleigh Gran Sport, 1975 Raleigh Sprite 27, 1980 Univega Viva Sport, 1971 Gitane Tour de France, 1984 Lotus Classique, 1976 Motobecane Grand Record

Mentioned: 37 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 248 Post(s)
Originally Posted by Grand Bois View Post
The hole was centered, but the back of the hanger has been reshaped. Do I see a stop? It's hard to tell with that busy background. If there is a stop in the correct place you can use most any derailer.
You're right, it's a bad picture with a lot of glare. But the outside of the hanger has not been filed or altered. There's no stop, and the chrome is untouched. The only issue is the big hole, which as you can see is clearly off-center.

Maybe the Duopar with the hanger is the way to go after all.
__________________
www.redclovercomponents.com

"Progress might have been all right once, but it has gone on too long."
--Ogden Nash
jonwvara is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-10, 10:11 AM
  #4  
Grand Bois
Senior Member
 
Grand Bois's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Pinole, CA, USA
Posts: 17,421
Mentioned: 22 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 427 Post(s)
I think you may be right. I think the Duopar is hideous, but they say they work well. At least you'll be keeping it French.

I'd like to try polishing the titanium version.
Grand Bois is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-10, 10:43 AM
  #5  
Kimmo
bike whisperer
 
Kimmo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Melbourne, Oz
Posts: 7,770

Bikes: https://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=152015&p=1404231

Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 303 Post(s)
I'd be tempted to make a stop and threads out of braze.
Kimmo is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-10, 11:03 AM
  #6  
MalcolmsFrejus
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 232

Bikes: Franklin Custom Road, Frejus TDF,Bianchi CromoLite Reparto Corse, Trek 470, Specialized Hardrock

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
That really is the ugliest derailler ever made.
And I've got a TY-15 and a Positron II in the stash somewhere.......
I remember reading in a Cyclo-Pedia Catalog scan where it was suggested you saw off the hanger and use the claw. Can't find it now but it was mentioned that you leave enough metal after sawing to shape the drop out with a file to match the other side.
MalcolmsFrejus is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-10, 01:03 PM
  #7  
JohnDThompson 
Old fart
 
JohnDThompson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Appleton WI
Posts: 19,755

Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.

Mentioned: 83 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1445 Post(s)
Originally Posted by jonwvara View Post
You're right, it's a bad picture with a lot of glare. But the outside of the hanger has not been filed or altered. There's no stop, and the chrome is untouched. The only issue is the big hole, which as you can see is clearly off-center.

Maybe the Duopar with the hanger is the way to go after all.
The off-center hole is not a functional concern. Simplex derailleurs were designed to use a 9mm unthreaded hole; a 10mm threaded hole is not a problem.

If you have problems with the lack of a stop tab on the dropout, you can always tighten the mounting bolt securely in the proper position so the derailleur can't rotate out of position.

N.B. This does make wheel changes more difficult since you will likely need to loosen the mounting bolt to remove the rear wheel, but how often do you really do that? Just make sure you carry the proper wrench with you in case you flat.
JohnDThompson is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-10, 02:46 PM
  #8  
jonwvara 
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
jonwvara's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Washington County, Vermont, USA
Posts: 2,814

Bikes: 1966 Dawes Double Blue, 1976 Raleigh Gran Sport, 1975 Raleigh Sprite 27, 1980 Univega Viva Sport, 1971 Gitane Tour de France, 1984 Lotus Classique, 1976 Motobecane Grand Record

Mentioned: 37 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 248 Post(s)
Originally Posted by Grand Bois View Post
I think you may be right. I think the Duopar is hideous, but they say they work well. At least you'll be keeping it French.
Duopars DO work really well--I've got one on my TdF. It shifts perfectly onto and off of the 14-38 Suntour freewheel I use with it. Cover your eyes.
__________________
www.redclovercomponents.com

"Progress might have been all right once, but it has gone on too long."
--Ogden Nash

Last edited by jonwvara; 12-20-10 at 02:47 PM. Reason: spellin'
jonwvara is offline  
Reply With Quote

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service