jet sanchEz

Tomorrow, I am looking at a decal-less bike that looks a lot like a Cinelli Super Corsa but, that of course means it could be a decal-less Windsor Pro. What are the differences between the two? The bike has Campy drops, did the Windsor Pro use Campy drops? Is a Cinelli bottom bracket a dead giveaway that the bike is a Cinelli?

Thanks guys.

TheOtherGuy

Windsor doesn't have the sloping fork crown, and will have serial # stamped into side of seat tube, up near the seat lug. Also, no oval hole in the seat lug sides on the Windsor. Later Windsors will also have a bunch of drain holes drilled in a circular pattern under the BB shell, but the early ones don't.

bobbycorno

And IIRC, old Cinelli SC's took a 26.2 seatpost, while Windsors were all 27.2.

SP
Bend, OR

TheOtherGuy

Nope.. Only the late Windsors took a 27.2. I forgot what the early ones were, but think it may have been 26.8.

jet sanchEz

Great info guys, thanks. I forgot entirely about the holes in the sides of the seat lugs, those are for the Cinelli "C" buttons, right? I guess this bike is legit as those are there and have the buttons in them.

It is a later model, a 1990 frame, I am told. Here is a pic of the drops which are much shorter than any Windsors that I can find online (that mark that looks a bit like a crack in the chain stay is the end of some tape that was used as a chain slap guard).

Picchio Special

Those come in with the holes in the lugs, i.e. those without the 3 holes in the lugs lack the side ovals as well. Just pointing that out for folks who may access this thread later while conducting their own ID quest.

mtnbke

Always my favorite C&V posts.

One of my favorite quotes: A 944 is a Porsche, the way a Windsor is a Cinelli.

TheOtherGuy

...and 944s can be great cars, as the right Windsor Pro can be a great bike. I've had one since 1975 (the Windsor, not the Porsche)

unworthy1

I've never seen a Windsor Pro with short Campy DOs, the early ones (which may have a 26.8 or 27.2 seatpost, but definitely NOT 26.2) had long 1010A dropouts. I'm not that familiar with what Cinelli was doing in 1990 (did they offer a frame called Super Corsa that year?) but based on the one pic it could be either a real one or some other Italian bike with faked (and now missing) decals. Don't think it's a Windsor in any case. This could be yet another mis-identified bike: "it has a Cinelli BB shell, therefore it's a Cinelli".

bobbycorno

Except that the 944 was designed and built by Porsche, and the Windsor has no ties at all to Cinelli, AFAIK.

SP
Bend, OR

bobbycorno

...and just to continue the Porsche analogy, true Cinelli snobs have the same attitude about the "flying C" bikes that true Porsche snobs have about the 924, 944, etc.

SP
Bend, OR

Picchio Special

I'd be curious to know whether Cinelli ever used those hideous (sorry) taped-style dropout junctions. This one of Stefan's:

https://www.speedbicycles.ch/showBike.php?enr=257

And this one of Ray's:

https://www.raydobbins.com/cinellisc/photos/photo41.html

And this one:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/4530616...n/photostream/

don't employ that time-saver technique.

All apparently from the 80's, and hardly an exhaustive representation. But still makes me wonder ...

unworthy1

I doubt it, but all I can add is that the even later (year 2000) SCs I saw at American Cyclery did not...and I agree it looks cheap. Unless there was a period of cost-cutting in the '90s, I'd bet against this as a real Cinelli, until more convincing pics are shown.

jet sanchEz

Well, it does have the Flying C buttons on the sides of the seat lug and I found these photos of a 2002 Cinelli Super Corsa that does appear to have the taped-style dropout junctions. What do you guys think?

https://www.bikecult.com/works/archive/cinelscJS.html

unworthy1

I stand corrected, looks like the post-Cino Super Corsas did use that type of stay treatment. But I still prefer the look of the mid '80s frames Picchio posted. If the deal is good enough, I wouldn't let a little thing like that put me off.