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1998 Schwinn 60th Anniversary match Paramount, no 853 decal!

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1998 Schwinn 60th Anniversary match Paramount, no 853 decal!

Old 04-05-11, 07:56 PM
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County
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1998 Schwinn 60th Anniversary match Paramount, no 853 decal!

I just purchased a 1998 Schwinn 60th Anniversary match Paramount, and now that I've got it home, I just realized that there doesn't seem to be the 853 sticker on the seat tube. All other decals are present, and I'm certain it is an authentic frame. Also, it obviously was not scratched off. My only guess would be that it is a repaint, but it looks so stock. Is there a chance it could have left the factory without it? I f you need more or better pics, please let me know.
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Old 04-05-11, 10:01 PM
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The Match built Paramounts were in the 1999 and 2000 catalogs, and there do not appear to be Reynolds 853 decals on the frames pictured in the catalogs. I've seen several of these bikes in the flesh and don't recall seeing tubing decals on any of them. They were certainly made with 853 tubes, but I wouldn't be surprised if your frame never had a decal. I don't know where the bikes were painted, but the Serotta built titanium Paramounts and the Match built 853 Paramounts shared the same geometry and paint schemes, so I'm guessing they were likely painted by someone other than Match.

Anybody have a 60th anniversary Match built Paramount with an 853 tubing decal?

HERE are three Match Paramounts on Photobucket, and no tubing decals are visible.

Very nice bikes, BTW.
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Old 04-05-11, 10:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Scooper View Post
Anybody have a 60th anniversary Match built Paramount with an 853 tubing decal?
Yep. Don't have any direct pictures at the moment, but these should suffice until then:





I am, however, missing the circular Schwinn logos that fit into the shoreline of the seat lug. I believe those are stick-ons, no?

-Kurt
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Old 04-05-11, 11:01 PM
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Not sure about the year. This link:
http://www.trfindley.com/flschwinn_1.../1998_02a.html
shows it in the 1998 catalog.
They added the silver for 1999:
http://www.trfindley.com/flschwinn_1...0/1999_49.html
Perhaps the early ones ] didn't have the decal?
I can't find a photo to verify.
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Old 04-05-11, 11:58 PM
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Silver catalog '99 is still sans-decal, but it's probably a '98 painted in silver (or digitally tinted) for the catalog.

-Kurt
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Old 04-06-11, 04:39 AM
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I've seen Kurt's "853" decal with my own eyes. I can attest he did not photoshop it into the picture!

Scooper mentioned the paint. At least on Kurt's, whoever did the work did not do the best job. Too bad they were not sent to Waterford for finishing.
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Old 04-06-11, 04:55 AM
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Kurt, there's a bird pecking at the seat tube.....it may have chipped away the circular Schwinn decal.
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Old 04-06-11, 08:11 AM
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Originally Posted by pastorbobnlnh View Post
Scooper mentioned the paint. At least on Kurt's, whoever did the work did not do the best job. Too bad they were not sent to Waterford for finishing.
The base coat is fine; it's the clear on these Match Paramounts that aren't worth a nickel. It has the same resilience as Italian chrome.

Oh, well - it makes it lighter

-Kurt
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Old 04-06-11, 11:00 AM
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So it seems that some do have the decal and some don't. So it's not something you think I should be worrying about?
One more side question, does anyone know what these weighed built up with the Dura Ace group?

Also, your opinions. These models were built at a time when no one was racing steel bikes. Are these built more as collector pieces, or do their rides hold their own. What I'm getting at is, were these bikes built to be ridden, or just looked at? Will it ride nicely?

-Brian
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Old 04-06-11, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by County View Post
So it seems that some do have the decal and some don't. So it's not something you think I should be worrying about?
Not at all. If it doesn't have it, it probably never did.

Originally Posted by County View Post
One more side question, does anyone know what these weighed built up with the Dura Ace group?
Though I don't have figures for you, these 853 Paramount framesets are very light - enough so that I'm building that silver example up as a weight weenie build.

Originally Posted by County View Post
Also, your opinions. These models were built at a time when no one was racing steel bikes. Are these built more as collector pieces, or do their rides hold their own. What I'm getting at is, were these bikes built to be ridden, or just looked at? Will it ride nicely?
Though I haven't ridden my own example yet, it was definitely made to be ridden. They're beautiful and wall-art-worthy, but quite a few C&V machines are, and they're still meant for one thing - riding. For that matter, in the realm of high-end frames, I've found that a good tire choice will render a difference in ride quality far greater than the frame.

That said, I was rather surprised to see that the lugwork on these frames aren't much to behold; hence, they're not worthy of wall art, in my book. Ride it.

-Kurt
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Old 04-06-11, 11:22 AM
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[QUOTE=County;12467726]One more side question, does anyone know what these weighed built up with the Dura Ace built up?/QUOTE]

I've got a newer 853 Waterford with D/A that weighs 18.2 lbs with a CF fork and threadless headset as well as pedals and cages. So I assume your bike with D/A should come in slightly under 21 lbs.
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Old 04-06-11, 04:55 PM
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Just got a data point in for the half-built 853 Paramount, with a heavy clincher and UG freehub on the back, no less:

18.18 lbs.





I'm happy.

-Kurt
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Old 04-06-11, 07:04 PM
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I've got a 2000 that doesn't have the 853 sticker. It's a 54cm; before I built it up I weighed it. Frame = 1905gm and the fork = 630gm. The seat tube logos are textured stickers and they fall off easily.

I also have a 2000 Waterford and the 853 decals came with the warranty papers for me to attach if I wanted to. Perhaps the Match frames were sold the same way?
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Old 04-06-11, 09:22 PM
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@Kurt
What components do you have on there already? That's a pretty good weight. I would be really cool to get a fully geared steel below 20lb.
I really like the silver color the best, btw; looks great!

@nihonric
Thanks for chiming in, now I know that at least some others don't have the decal. I'm not worried about, I just wanted to make sure it wasn't a repaint or something.
2535g for frame and fork seems pretty good.
How do you like the ride of yours?

Last edited by County; 04-06-11 at 09:29 PM.
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Old 04-06-11, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by County View Post
What components do you have on there already? That's a pretty good weight. I would be really cool to get a fully geared steel below 20lb.
I really like the silver color the best, btw; looks great!
The Paramount's current component mix is as follows:
-Campagnolo Record 10-speed square-taper crankset w/Record cartridge BB (only CF bit on the bike)
-CLB brake calipers
-Aluminum 700C fork (stamped Prologue w/ steel steer tube)
-Campagnolo Chorus FD (IIRC)
-Huret Jubilee first-gen rear derailer
-Generic headset off a Jamis sport bike fork
-Oddball Italian seatpost (name in the morning; forgot the spelling) w/Selle San Marco saddle
-Zoom 250g steel stem w/TI-finish (NOS)
-ITM bars (NOS)
-Mavic SSC shifters (one is from a Simplex SLJ set)

On the bike at present, but not for long:
-Mavic front tubular rim 36h with spoke eyelets ready to pull through, Campagnolo (Nuovo-era) Record hub, Vittoria (?) tubular
-Rear Mavic MA40 clincher 32h w/Shimano 600 UG freehub + matching steel freehub cogs; Bontrager tire, no tube; tire is flipjunk. It is there purely to protect the wheel.

Not on the bike at the moment:
Everest 6-speed aluminum freewheel

Tentative build revisions include polished NISI tubular rims, front and back (cheapos without eyelets to keep the weight down) on Campag or Miche hubs OR Saavedra clinchers (the clincher hoops are lighter than Mavic tubulars) with the same hubs. I need to locate some plastic-body Mafac brake levers too.

-Kurt
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Old 04-07-11, 01:05 AM
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Very nice ride County but I'm not real sensitive to the subtle differences in frames. Not twitchy and not a slug either. I replaced it with the Waterford because it's a little small for me. I had it down to 19.3 lbs with '05 Centaur, a carbon fork and sewups.
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Old 04-07-11, 10:08 AM
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The red '98 I purchased new didn't have the 853 decal, but my wife's silver '99 came with one. Maybe the difference in years, or maybe the difference in colors?

The original Schwinn brochure listed the weight of a Dura-Ace 58 cm bike at 19.5 pounds. Bicycling magazine had the same weight in their comparision test in June, 1998. Ron Kiefel wrote a nice review of the Match Paramount, which was compared to four other bikes in the test. Bicyclist magazine also ran a comparision article in which the Match did really well.

I love these bikes - mine feels as good to me now as it did 13 years ago. Hope you enjoy yours!
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Old 04-07-11, 01:52 PM
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Originally Posted by cudak888 View Post
Just got a data point in for the half-built 853 Paramount, with a heavy clincher and UG freehub on the back, no less:

18.18 lbs.





I'm happy.

-Kurt
18.18 pounds??.....Uhmmm...... no pedals, no brake levers, no flront brake cable, no bar tape and caps, no bottle cage and bottle....helium in tires??.... add maybe another pound please...

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Old 04-07-11, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Chombi View Post
18.18 pounds??.....Uhmmm...... no pedals, no brake levers, no flront brake cable, no bar tape and caps, no bottle cage and bottle....helium in tires??.... add maybe another pound please...
I'm hoping that I can save a pound with the replacement rear wheel - mind you, those freehubs weigh a ton.

Might go with Benotto tape on this one. Latex tubes, if clincher.

-Kurt
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Old 04-07-11, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by cudak888 View Post
I'm hoping that I can save a pound with the replacement rear wheel - mind you, those freehubs weigh a ton.

Might go with Benotto tape on this one. Latex tubes, if clincher.

-Kurt
Yes, Latex tubes are nice I used them for many years (Specialized latex tubes) to get that little bit more off the wheels. Problem is trying to find them these days as no shops seem to stock them anymore and if you do find them they have such long valve stems.
White Benotto cellos will look great on that bike!

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