non-fixie 

Well, we found the pink and blue. It was nice to meet you again, @Munny, and we had a wonderful day in the Condroz. Thanks for the heads-up. We did suffer somewhat, but that may have been due to all the nice beers we had along the way at the "food" stops.

BTW, I put up a report and some pics here.

juvela

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@LucasHartong - Keep forgetting to ask: is shell 68mm BSC or 70mm BSC? You sound convinced of a cyclocross intended application. Have you checked shell height, be it higher than your road bicycles? Cantilevers to not necessarily always indicate a cyclocross application. How is the under bottom bracket cable routing done? Is there a guide solely for a rear cable or for both a front and a rear?

Thank you. Looks great!

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LouB 

I'm posting this for Hank Cunningham of Helotes Bicycle:

I've had this Chas de Vocht bicycle for 37 years and I'd like to show you some of the interesting features and quirks' It was built around an Adler 3 speed transmission in Antwerp, Belgium. I've seen lots of pictures of Adler bicycles with this transmission but never have I seen another brand using it. This bike is a lot sportier than the Adlers.
It's a three speed fixed gear and by moving the shifter to a midpoint between gears it coasts! I received a box of spares with the bike and a manual for the transmission. In the box was a three speed Simplex freewheel, extra brake cables, brake blocks, toe clips, patch kits and all of it is pre-world war 2. I think the bike was built in 1937.

The bike is set up for cantilever brakes and from looking at pictures I think they must have been Bowdens. There is a fork mounted cable stop that has the Bowden script,as well. There is no evidence that brakes were ever installed on this bike. If the owner rode it as a fixed gear it's pretty easy to get it stopped, if he put the freewheel on the double sided rear hub and flipped the wheel he'd need the brakes! When you're coasting the crank arms stop rotating but the drivetrain keeps going! The bike uses 571 mm tires so I've been using 26x1 3/4 tires

(think Schwinn middleweight).

Here's my questions: Has anyone ever seen a Chas.de Vocht before? Have you seen cantilever brake mounts like these?

Hank Cunningham

Helotes Bicycle

3speedslow

Damn, that's wild! A 3 speed gear inside the crank case.

LucasHartong

Hi,

There was no guide at all under the bottom bracket, just one bare cable. I didn't want the cable and frame metal to devour eachother, so I decided to line the cable with a 'sleeve'. That way the gearing is much easier too.

capnjonny 

Here are some pics of an old Flandria that was just donated to the Bike Exchange.

I didn't find a serial no yet . It had a Bike license dated 1980 but I am pretty sure it is older than that.

I just finished striping all the parts of the frame. It has Campagnolo dropouts. The running gear is Suntour friction, the wheels are Arya 27 x 1 1/4" and the brakes and levers are Mafac racer.

I will be cleaning up the frame and doing some judicial touch up and then repacking all the bearings and putting on. new cables and covers. I think I will re use most of the hardware except probably replacing the 5 speed Suntour "Perfect 5 speed freewheel with a 6 speed Hyperglide. This should make a good Eroica bike.

3speedslow

Cool! Dig that long wheelbase.

non-fixie 

^ Nice Flandria! Hope to see more of it when you're done.

juvela

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Frame's lugs, crown, paint and transfers look to be the same as those on the Portuguese built contract cycles from the early 1970's. However, have never before seen one of those wearing Campag ends.

Three other colours at this time were white with black trim. bright orange with black trim and deep green flamouyant with black trim.

Thinking 1971 for a date.

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capnjonny 

I did a lot of cleaning on the Blue Flandria today.

Frame weighed 6.34 lb with both stear tube bearing races and drive side bottom bracket cup in place.
Rear derailleur

capnjonny 

yesterday I tore down the Flandria and today I cleaned a lot of parts.

Frame weight - w/ upper and lower steer tube bearing races and Bottom bracket drive side cup - 6.34 lb

Lugs - Campagnolo

Rear derailleur - suntour Vista long cage. (uses the Gt steel pully assembly and some aluminum parts
Freewheel - Suntour Perfect 5 spd 14-32
Front derailleur - Suntour pro comp
Shifters - Suntour frame mount "Power Shifters"
Brakes - Mafac "Racer" center pull brakes / Mafac levers w/o hoods.
Wheels - Araya 27 x 1 1/4" alu. rims on Shimano hubs with Galv. spokes.
Stem - SR with turned down neck.

On the non drive side rear dropout stamped 179557

On the drive side stamped 7/80 so perhaps it was built July 1980?

juvela

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Mechanicing tip: the bicycle's Sakae Ringyo Silstar chainset takes the odd three degree taper bottom bracket spindle. If the spindle is worn out it may take a bit of looking to locate a replacement. Likely a number such as 5F or 3(S). Usage tip: this set has unusually thick chainwheel spacers. Evidently done to permit rider to run the small/small gear combination without the chain rubbing on the inner face of the outer chainwheel. Arrangement makes for a vulnerability to getting chain jammed between chainwheels. Always make large to small chainwheel shifts "crisply." Use only conventional full width 3/32" drive chains.

Dating: you mentioned biycle has a license with a 1980 date. The 7/80 marking you found was most likely put in by the licensing agency at the time of licensing.

Fittings would put the machine at about 1971 but we of course do not know when built up or by whom.

Are you able to make detail images of seat lug area, fork crown and bottom bracket area?

Thank you.

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non-fixie 

The build spec sounds very much like "American market" to me. Were these regular imports in the US?

juvela

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capnjonny -

The Vista marking on the bicycle's rear mech tells us that it erstwhile abided elsewhere. Vista is a brand of bicycle made in Japan for Columbia of the U.S.



Vista Bicycles

Another indication that it was assembled of bits is the parts mix. While the gear ensemble is a coherent Maeda one the wheel hubs are Shimano. Maeda's hub partner in their keiretsu was Sanshin Matsumoto.

The bicycle's frame looks just like the Portuguese contract build Flandrias we received a good number of here in the U.S. during the bike boom of the early 1970's...save for two features. The half chrome stays and the Campag 1010 ends set. Note that the frame's chainstay bridge is an ESGE plate style just like the lower model Flandrias. Not often one encounters a frame with Campag 1010 ends and an ESGE chainstay bridge.

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non-fixie -

Cannot recall seeing a frame exactly like this in the U.S. previously. The paint, transfers, lugs, crown are just the same as the base model Portuguese built bikes we received. However, the half chrome stays and Campag 1010 ends set is puzzling; especially when paired with the ESGE chainstay bridge which can be seen in this photo, when enlarged.



Your red "Raleigh" probably has the same lugs, crown, seat stay treatment and chainstay bridge as this frame.

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capnjonny 

a couple of other details I didn't mention before

There is a sheet metal mounting plate for a kick stand welded to the frame.

The rear derailleur is a Vista branded Suntour Gt with a mix of alu and steel parts.

I am surprised that they used Suntour derailleurs and Araya wheels if it is and early 70's model.

The 74 red flandria I built up a while ago had a Shimano record ace series 1 Group and my research indicated that 74 was the first year they switched to the Japanese made drive train. I would have thought they would have used Shimano through out their product line. Makes me wonder about the Mafac brakes too.

Any other Flandrias of this vintage out there? if so what hardware did they use?

capnjonny 

here are some detail shots of the blue Flandria

capnjonny 

and here are a few photos of the red Flandria I did last year

juvela

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Thanks very much for these additional pictures capnjonny.


Have not before seen a Flandria with this rear centrepull bridge/hanger.


Interesting that fork constructed with NERVOR steerer.


The letter P on the seat lug may be for Portugal.


Seat stay treatment same as found on Portuguese built base models.

Frame's welded fork crown and spot welded housing stops are other features usually associated with lower models.

The wishbone/omega symbol stamped into the shell indicates the city which performed the licensing.

Note that the licensing agent who put in the 7/80 marking got the numeral 8 upside down.

Fine job with the pictures.

This undated manufacturer's brochure looks to date from near the time of the blue cycle. Possible model described as the F12 may be it. Your blue machine appears just a bit earlier than the red.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/strong...&new_session=1

Further things you can check on to advance your investigation -

Seat post diameter.

Since bottom bracket fittings are now out you can inspect interior of shell to examine the interiors of the four tubes joined there. Are they seamed, seamless, or mixed?

Hope this helps you a bit.

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JohnSqual

Hello,

Went to pick up a Groene Leeuw bike this Monday. I've been looking for a decent one for at least 5 years - had a couple of near misses over the years, but this one was (more or less) my size and the price was reasonable.

The qulaity of Groene Leeuw bikes is to say the least variable I've seen some right dogs. But this is one of the better ones I think - full Reynolds 531, Campag Drop outs (with no mudguard eyelets), and nice cut-out lugs.

The bike is all original (except the Yellow cork bar tape, which will have to go...). It has Shimano 600, the pre-Arabesque version, with an SR Crankset and Dia Compe brakes. Seller said it belonged to his father who used it for solo tours and not much else. I have a couple of other groupsets that could also go on there, but I will probably leave it as it is.

It's actually a little bit small for me (seller said 58cm seat tube, but that was CT). But I will try to fix that with a longer stem and seatpost.

One thing I am wondering about is the paint and decals: the paint is cracking slightly, with a maze of fine little lines. I quite like it, it is a nice patina, but how can I protect it? Car wax? Clear coat? Same for the decals: they are OK, but need to be protected. I think you can get an enamel lacquer for modelmaking decals. Would that be any use?

hobbs1951

Not exactly Belgian but a frameset built to celebrate the shop owners son's successes racing in the low countries (Belgium and Holland), the rider is called Keith Butler (son of Stan Butler, co-director of Allin of Croydon).

Called the Belgique, built from a tubeset similiar to Reynolds SL but before that set was commercially available - it was more expensive than a Hetchins in 1964.

You'll not see another, it came from my friend Jim Davey, relative of the cycling Olympian Charlie Davey.

John.

thumpism 

Here's a bad photo of a Flandria that showed up at our co-op. Nice old bike. It has Campy-looking Triplex shifters.
Flandria.JPG

thumpism 

And here's some pix of the little 500A Flandria I used to have. Gave it to a buddy to give to his little nephew but that never happened.
Flandria DS.jpg

Flandria NDS.jpg

Flandria and Mark.JPG

Munny

Some years ago, I sold all my Green Lions to the specialized GL collector (Mieke)
Although, I might still have a part of a real team bike: The fork of Carmine Preziozi when he ran for Watney.
What a bike with a yellow fork (from different special origin) on a green frame ...

When I need to deal with short size, I prefer to use long cranks. I have some sets of Campa cranks of 180 and I like them.

I like cracking paint
Here a picture of my Colibri (Belgian brand of Charleroi) that I treated - as original - with colored clear coat

JohnSqual

Haha, yes I know Mieke (I think everyone in Belgium who collects bikes does). I also sold her a very nice Groene Leeuw that was far far too small for me (53cm), and I gave her an old frame to say thanks for taking my bike to L'Eroica.

Not sure if long cranks would work on this bike, it seems to have a very low bottom bracket - I was scraping my heels on the ground when I rode it home.

So the clear coat won't eat the water slide transfers?

Munny

I don't know which clear coat you are going to use so I can't be affirmative
I've used cans of various brands with little adverse effects

When I need to do a full paint job, I use 2k cans for it's strenght and apply it over the transfers I print (water slide)
Lesonal 2k Cans

On 1 bike however (Belgian very old brand), after about 5 years, I saw a fading effect on the transfer.
Was the waterbased ink not dry enough? I can't say. But varnishing the printout is part of the process