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NINE NOS Centurion frames

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NINE NOS Centurion frames

Old 11-01-11, 06:36 PM
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clubman 
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NINE NOS Centurion frames

In the ebay capitalist behaviour thread, someone outed Pedalr's marketplace and I found these. For real? Cheap. Wish I wasn't short.

https://pedalr.com/items/707
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Old 11-01-11, 06:47 PM
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Weird geometry: 62 st x 56 tt
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Old 11-01-11, 06:47 PM
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+1, if it was 56cm, I'd buy two, just to have twins. Or maybe 5, because Kurt has 4 Paramounts.

Last edited by RobbieTunes; 11-02-11 at 09:19 AM.
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Old 11-01-11, 07:33 PM
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That's Dallas/Citizen Chain who tapped into the legendary Lost Bike Shipment and has been selling off the mother lode for some time now; I've purchased one of his Centurion Elites and some NOS build parts from him a couple of years ago and I think all those larger Centurions had disproportionately short top tubes but mine was in totally mint condition.
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Old 11-01-11, 08:30 PM
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Is not that weird. Taller the frame the shorter it gets or the frame gets too flimsy. Besides are japanese so are even shorter.

Originally Posted by thinktubes View Post
Weird geometry: 62 st x 56 tt
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Old 11-01-11, 10:54 PM
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Originally Posted by thinktubes View Post
Weird geometry: 62 st x 56 tt

IIRC, this was due to limitations in stock lug geometry. You can make a frame taller just by lengthening the seat tube and head tube. Making it longer means a different BB shell and lower head lug.

It's close to the same geometry as my Mississippi Schwinn LeTour: https://home.comcast.net/~jeff_wills/...tour%20004.htm. (The LeTour is longer by 1cm.) Maybe I'll get one to "upgrade" the LeTour.
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Old 11-01-11, 11:33 PM
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Those are really good frames! Very low-trail fork, incredibly stable, nice smooooove ride. Befor mine was stolen, it was about my favorite bike. Mind you, I paid about 1/9 of the asking price for my frame but these are still a screaming deal.
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Old 11-02-11, 12:07 AM
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This is the second time I have seen Champion No.5 listed as double butted, but all frame tube references I can fine list it as PG.

Anyone want to buy one, cut it in half and find out once and for all?
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Old 11-02-11, 06:27 AM
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Ooooh this has me thinking 3 speed again. You people have got to stop doing this to me.
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Old 11-02-11, 06:54 AM
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Nice frames for the $ !
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Old 11-02-11, 07:09 AM
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Those are close to my size, but I really don't need/want 4. Anybody want to group buy?
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Old 11-02-11, 07:15 AM
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Is this the fabled Centurion frame where they made like 5 sizes and all of them had a 56cm top tube?
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Old 11-02-11, 07:23 AM
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Originally Posted by balindamood View Post
This is the second time I have seen Champion No.5 listed as double butted, but all frame tube references I can fine list it as PG.

Anyone want to buy one, cut it in half and find out once and for all?

I have an Elite from that year. The Tange #5 tubing sticker says PG. Anyway it rides great, and I'm not even heavy (6', 165lb).
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Old 11-02-11, 07:24 AM
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Originally Posted by JReade View Post
Those are close to my size, but I really don't need/want 4. Anybody want to group buy?
It is $125 per frame is what I get from looking at the page not 4, but if it is I would take 4 for that kind of money in a hart beat and I'm broke lol.

We have one NOS 25" Centurion frame at our shop for sale cheap, it is missing the fork and I think it is a low end frame, it was to be a warranty repair but the customers bike was stolen before the frame came in but warranty did cover the frame because all they wanted you to do is destroy the old one so nobody could ride it. I know it has no braze on's or RD hanger and the name begins with a A. Great for a single speed project just a hair to tall for me though.
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Last edited by Glennfordx4; 11-02-11 at 07:33 AM.
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Old 11-02-11, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeff Wills View Post
IIRC, this was due to limitations in stock lug geometry. You can make a frame taller just by lengthening the seat tube and head tube. Making it longer means a different BB shell and lower head lug.

It's close to the same geometry as my Mississippi Schwinn LeTour: https://home.comcast.net/~jeff_wills/...tour%20004.htm. (The LeTour is longer by 1cm.) Maybe I'll get one to "upgrade" the LeTour.
I don't think so. I could be wrong, but using my not that advanced knowledge of geometry, if you expand all the dimensions proportionately, the geometry would not change. Also, I thought I heard that it is not that hard to slightly tweak the geo on lugs.

I seem to recall an interview with Grant Peterson (I think?) where he mentioned that a lot of frame builders wanted to keep their wheelbase pretty short because that was what was selling back then. Hence no top tube longer than 56cm. In the 70s and early 80s, you would just throw a leg over the top tube and if you had an inch or so between the top tube and your undercarriage, then the bike "fit". I remember being fitted in high end bike shops this way.
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Old 11-02-11, 09:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Rocket-Sauce View Post
I don't think so. I could be wrong, but using my not that advanced knowledge of geometry, if you expand all the dimensions proportionately, the geometry would not change. Also, I thought I heard that it is not that hard to slightly tweak the geo on lugs.

I seem to recall an interview with Grant Peterson (I think?) where he mentioned that a lot of frame builders wanted to keep their wheelbase pretty short because that was what was selling back then. Hence no top tube longer than 56cm. In the 70s and early 80s, you would just throw a leg over the top tube and if you had an inch or so between the top tube and your undercarriage, then the bike "fit". I remember being fitted in high end bike shops this way.

Jeff is right- as you lengthen the top tube, because the intersection of the DT/HT stays fixed (at the lower head lug) you change the angle between the DT and the ST and the DT and HT, which has to be accounted for in the lower head lug and BB. It's a minor change in angle though, for a 2-3cm change in TT length.
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Old 11-02-11, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Zaphod Beeblebrox View Post
Is this the fabled Centurion frame where they made like 5 sizes and all of them had a 56cm top tube?
Centurions had fables?

Wow.
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Old 11-02-11, 10:12 AM
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Centurions had fables?
you told me one about the Black Ironman Frames!!
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Old 11-02-11, 10:30 AM
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Seriously... I haven't had N+1 fever like this in a while. I've been wanting to do a 3 speed for a looong time. Someone talk me down.
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Old 11-02-11, 10:45 AM
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56cm top tube may not be short depending on the seat tube angle. My 64cm '86 Ironman has a 57cm top tube. But it also has a 74.5 degree seat tube angle. If it had a 72.5 seat tube angle, that would translate to about a 59cm top tube. Both bikes should ride the same except one bike would have a 2cm offset post and the other would have a zero set back post. Rider would stay in the same position.
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Old 11-02-11, 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by newenglandbike View Post
I have an Elite from that year. The Tange #5 tubing sticker says PG. Anyway it rides great, and I'm not even heavy (6', 165lb).
Tange 5 is PG, Tange 2 is double butted. I thought Tange 2 was just called Champion tubing. Does anyone know what Champion #5 is?
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Old 11-02-11, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by acoffin View Post
Tange 5 is PG, Tange 2 is double butted. I thought Tange 2 was just called Champion tubing. Does anyone know what Champion #5 is?
Before someone who really knows the answer steps up, I'll answer with a confident maybe that Champion #5 was/is either the predecessor/successor of Tange Infinity, both tubing sets rated for riders of any weight.
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Old 11-02-11, 11:05 AM
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Also, for standard diameter tubing on a 62cm bike, 9-6-9 is pretty much right on.
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Old 11-02-11, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by 20grit View Post
Seriously... I haven't had N+1 fever like this in a while. I've been wanting to do a 3 speed for a looong time. Someone talk me down.
No chance of that Jack. Get yerself an IGH wheelset and you are off to the (bicycle) races.

That would make a real purdy 3 speed runabout.
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Old 11-02-11, 11:45 AM
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You just had to go and post this didn't you. Now i'm going to have to buy one.
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