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Holdsworth Professional Sprint
I recently acquired this bike and I am trying to confirm its year. I believe it is from 1976, however when I checked the locknuts on the Campy hub they say '71. They could have been replacements but the fellow I got it from believed them to be original. I have been to nkalgariff site and to yellow jersey and have done some searching but have been unable to confirm the year. I would appreciate any help. The serial # is 60410, and the pics:
http://i242.photobucket.com/albums/f...30839Large.jpg http://i242.photobucket.com/albums/f...30840Large.jpg http://i242.photobucket.com/albums/f...30848Large.jpg http://i242.photobucket.com/albums/f...30847Large.jpg http://i242.photobucket.com/albums/f...30846Large.jpg http://i242.photobucket.com/albums/f...30843Large.jpg http://i242.photobucket.com/albums/f...30841Large.jpg |
I can't help you with dating the bike. But I can tell you that it is beautiful, and congratulations on aquiring it!
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Lucky dog! A beauty.
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Kind of a late reply here, but I have to wonder if this is indeed a c.1971 but not the Holdsworth Pro track frame but rather its clone - the Claud Butler International. Reason I wonder this is because the serial number does not follow any recognizeable Holdsworth pattern, but does fit for a '71 Claud. I have a 1968 Claud and in process of trying to make sense of its number I have deduced "Claud" Holdsworthy factory frames were given a distinct sequential numbering system from the "Holdsworth" frames during the period from 1966 to 1976.
See: https://www.flickr.com/photos/767624...7648723035788/ The Holdsworth Pro and CB International track frames were essentially identical. Perhaps the original owner wanted a Pro and not the Claud version or perhaps at some point someone simply decided to call it what it really is. From pics it has less chrome than usual for 1971 but I believe from description in Kilgariff's catalog factory finish was to choice. Granted chrome did became "dear" by mid 70's and it would have been typical to have chrome just on dropouts by that point. Or perhaps some of deteriorating chrome was later painted over during a respray? In your photos is that perhaps chrome showing through under some of fork and stay scratches? See: http://www.nkilgariff.com/CBcats/Cat...ernational.jpg http://www.nkilgariff.com/HoldsCats/Cat1971/Pro71.jpg D |
Originally Posted by allend
(Post 17861463)
... I have a 1968 Claud and in process of trying to make sense of its number I have deduced "Claud" Holdsworthy factory frames were given a distinct sequential numbering system from the "Holdsworth" frames during the period from 1966 to 1976. ...
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Having just been looking at a lot of Holdsworth data, I would agree, the frame number is way to high. The Claude explanation makes sense to me.
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Originally Posted by rhm
(Post 17861489)
Interesting! Did they start at 0001 in 1966? My Olympic Sprint is doubtless from the mid 60's and has the number 1492, which would thus put it in 1966?
I don't think we can say anything definite re your frame from this number (1492). It does not seem to fit into Holdsworth, Claud or for that matter Grubb serial # sequencing for the period ~1965 to 1976. In ~1965 it appears the Holdsworthy factory developed a new sequential numbering system for their Clauds apparently beginning with 5, but unknown if first number was perhaps 50001. The closest number I have found is a Torino with number 51333 which is likely a 1966. (See link to Flickr page explanation in prior post.) According to the Lightweights Cycle Catalogues Vol l by the John Pinkerton Memorial Publishing Fund the Claud numbering system after Holdsworthy takeover in 1957 until "early" 60's, incorporated a single digit for year of manufacture followed by number of build for year. I have found examples and it appears this system was used until the sequential system I describe above was adopted in ~1965. Your frame has Prugnat lugs which I don't believe were used by Holdsworth until 1964. I hesitate to comment as this is purely conjecture but I wonder if #1492 signifies January 1964 and the 92nd Claud frame for the year. On other hand your fork crown appears to be different than in Kilgariff's '64 catalog pics. (I really know little re details of frame construction other than what one can find on Kilgariff's site.) Is this the original fork? Perhaps the frame was built or simply branded by a smaller shop with their own number. Maybe its not a Claud at all. Some numbers just don't make sense and I have been told that some builders just used random numbers. Could the builder's name have been Chris Columbus? :) Hopefully facts will become clear with time. Meanwhile, fun trying to figure it out. D |
Originally Posted by allend
(Post 17861932)
I don't think we can say anything definite re your frame from this number (1492). It does not seem to fit into Holdsworth, Claud or for that matter Grubb serial # sequencing for the period ~1965 to 1976. In ~1965 it appears the Holdsworthy factory developed a new sequential numbering system for their Clauds perhaps beginning at ~50001. The closest number I have found is a Torino with number 51333 which is likely 1966. (See link to Flickr page explanation in prior post.) According to the Lightweights Cycle Catalogues Vol l by the John Pinkerton Memorial Publishing Fund the Claud numbering system after Holdsworthy takeover in 1957 until "early" 60's, incorporated a single digit for year of manufacture followed by number of build for year. This system appears to be used until the sequential system I describe above apparently was adopted in ~1965. Your frame has Prugnat lugs which I don't believe were used by Holdsworth until 1964. I hesitate to comment as this is purely conjecture but I wonder if #1492 signifies January 1964 and the 92nd Claud frame for the year. On other hand your fork crown appears to be different than in Kilgariff's '64 catalog pics. (I really know little re details of frame construction other than what one can find on Kilgariff's site.) Is this the original fork? Perhaps the frame was built or simply branded by a smaller shop with their own number. Maybe its not a Claud at all. Some numbers just don't make sense and I have been told that some builders just used random numbers. Could the builder's name have been Chris Columbus? :) Hopefully facts will become clear with time. Meanwhile, fun trying to figure it out.
A few responses to your questions... both asked and unasked: --The Columbus angle is helpful for remembering the serial number, but beyond that, well... --My fork steerer is stamped with the same number, using the same letter stamps, as my frame; so I don't doubt its originality. --On the internet I have seen photos of bikes that are basically like mine, none of them securely dated, but clearly in the era we're discussing (approximately 1963-1971) with a few distinct variables: ----either Claud Butler or Freddie Grubb branding; ----fork crown occasionally as shown in the published brochures (as you see on the Kilgariff site) but usually like mine; ----fork ends usually have eyelets, but occasionally (mainly Freddie Grubb) don't. Possibly they've been removed. |
You have done a lot of research and have put a lot of TLC into this beautiful frame!
Perhaps my interpretation of serial number being that of a 1964 Claud is not just conjecture but is correct. Wonder what one of experts on that other site (CR) or VCC or Hilary Stone might have to say re interpretation of number. D |
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