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And while I'm on the topic of Italian road bikes ...

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And while I'm on the topic of Italian road bikes ...

Old 12-16-11, 07:17 PM
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tsappenfield
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And while I'm on the topic of Italian road bikes ...

If you had the cash, would you pay $2000+ for an Italian road bike from an ebay auction? I've noticed recently that there seems to be a proportionately large number of vintage Colnago Super road bikes advertised on ebay USA, but for sale by sellers from Germany. These machines look perfect. Is it just coincidental that so many have appeared at one time, or were the German's in the 1970's in love with this bike and then grew old, tired, poor and are now unloading them? More importantly, how wise is it to purchase such an expensive bike sight unseen, no-return policy, ebay protection, and a seller rating of 100%? Just wondering.

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Old 12-16-11, 07:27 PM
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For the right one, yes.
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Old 12-16-11, 08:00 PM
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This bike came from a German seller. Wasn't $2K but still a lot of money.

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Old 12-16-11, 08:09 PM
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Three of my bicycles are from Bayern, and actually from a small village that lies on the border with Austria.

My next De Rosa is coming from Bolzano in Italy.

"Correct" bicycles are where you find them, and I don't worry about borders at this point.
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Old 12-16-11, 08:12 PM
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I forgot, this Frejus came from Munich. The Cinelli came from Berlin.

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Old 12-16-11, 08:18 PM
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Originally Posted by iab View Post
This bike came from a German seller. Wasn't $2K but still a lot of money.

Easily one of my favorites on this forum.
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Old 12-16-11, 08:42 PM
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Nope.
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Old 12-16-11, 09:52 PM
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As BBM mentioned, it depends on the bicycle.

The De Rosa frameset I purchased is a little unusual, and nowhere near $2000 in final cost to me.

But it is EL-OS, which is what I wanted for my next De Rosa.

Ready for pickup next spring when we visit for a wedding.

It'll take a few forum members to sort out the lineage details when she arrives though.

As far as gorgeous restorations go, take a gander at Poprad's Colnago.

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...=colnago+super

Gorgeous bicycle, and he will have lifetime memories from participation at L'Eroica.

Tough to beat as for as cool experiences go.

...and maybe well worth the higher costs.
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Old 12-16-11, 10:26 PM
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There's a lot of European racing bikes in Europe.
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Old 12-16-11, 11:18 PM
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I just missed a really nice late 70's Moto from France. Looked like it was going to slip through the Ebay un-bid. I put a marker on it with 12-hours to go, but someone sniped it and got a real steal. I was almost disappointed.
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Old 12-17-11, 12:19 AM
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Originally Posted by tsappenfield View Post
If you had the cash, would you pay $2000+ for an Italian road bike from an ebay auction?
For the right one - and I have a specific idea of what "the right one" means - I would in a heartbeat. For that one bike, I wouldn't even blink.
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Old 12-17-11, 12:49 AM
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I have a colnago super and I would never pay 2k for one.
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Old 12-17-11, 05:59 AM
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Make no mistake about it, right now is the best time to purchase a vintage road bicycle. They will cost more tomorrow!

I have watched prices for vintage road bicycles climb steadily for years now. At the moment, the bar is being raised on prices and not too much is selling but that will change.

It is just like the increase in gasoline prices. We all run out and buy a bicycle to help reduce our transportation costs, but, sooner or later, we are back driving the family cage, paying the higher gas prices and thinking little of it. So too will we learn to accept the increased value of vintage bicycles. And...

For the most part, this Bike Forums group of people is special. Not the kind of special our moms told up we all were, but special in the fact that we know we can find bicycles, for less than is being asked, in many places. However...

The uninformed buyer (the newbie) will pay the higher prices and that will drive prices even higher. Where will it end? Not sure but two grand for a high end bike today will look pretty darn good tomorrow.

At least, that is the way I see it.
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Old 12-17-11, 08:36 AM
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$2000? Maybe, but it would have to have 1.5 - 2 mph built into it, with an invisible climbing gear,
and still be a better bike than a wide variety of $750-$1250 bikes that are available or can be built.

The OP said Italian road bikes, and for my $2000, it would need to be pretty close to 2x10 Record or Chorus.
I'f I'm going to spend two bikes worth of money, it would have to be modern grouped, no compromise there.
So what I really take from it is how much would I spend for a daily rider frame.

As an investment or to hold value, I don't know and yield to those here who seem to know.
I completely understand the concept of an OEM $2000 vintage/classic road bike.
For me, that would be a luxury item and rarely ridden, and I need a zero-turn mower a lot more.
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Old 12-17-11, 08:58 AM
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A question for you biding on EU bicycles from overseas.Do you pay import custom cost as a function of buying price?It would be very high for a bicycle in this price range...Thanks
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Old 12-17-11, 10:41 AM
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I have never paid any customs' duty. And I paid way too much for a bike out of Italy. Since I insist on paying for shipping insurance, that number is on the customs' form.
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Old 12-17-11, 11:42 AM
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Originally Posted by tsappenfield View Post
Is it just coincidental that so many have appeared at one time,TSapp
They're all over the place. What kills me is that I asked about buying one of the frames pictured below and was told, "no, they're eye candy", but no so long ago they were nothing more than old stock and the owner probably would've given them away. As for the Bianchi's I was told, "make me an offer". I didnt.


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Old 12-17-11, 12:03 PM
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Like anything, it depend upon the bike. I would not pay $3000-10,000 for current carbon fiber models, and I would not pay $2000 for most Itailian bikes (or any bike for that matter). There are Italians that are worth it, as there are French, Brittish, Japanese, Canadian, Dutch, and American. It simply depends upon the bike.

As for how comfortable I am buing a bike, effectively unseen, via Ebay from accross the pond...I live in Alaska. Frankfurt is closer to here than Washington DC, it is just a different pond. It is honestly easier to get bike frames and wheels off Ebay from Europe because they are already marketing to Americnas and the shipping is a fixed, known quantity. It is cheaper to send a bike to Alaska from Paris than it is from Seattle via UPS or FedEx (in fact, nearly 3X). USPS from the lower 48 is 10-20% less. Many sellers won't ship to Alaska via USPS because it is more of a PIA. I cannot count the number of times that a seller would contact me after the auction asking for nearly twice the shipping posted simply to get it here. I normally abliage assuming they are using USPS. The others that use the stupid UPS cost caplulator are equally as difficult. I recently let a frame I really wanted go because the seller would not commit to USPS, and the shipping calulator was quoting $198. I would of happliy paid about $100 for it at USPS rates, and it sold for $22.

What really irks me are the Ebay sellers in the US, selling a chainring or other smaller part, who WON'T ship to Alaska or Hawaii. It is not a function of working the shipping out, I am not even able to bid on them at all, and most sellers who I have contacted looking for "permission" cannot figure out how to change it to allow my bid to be accepted.

I have never had issues with duties comming this direction, but I have had some problem shipping stuff to Italy which seems odd compared to some other far-flung locations.
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Old 12-17-11, 12:17 PM
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I cant understand why people are so hesitant to buy off ebay, the whole system is set up for buyers, sellers get bent over....

if its a bike you want and you feel comfotable with the description and pictures, them who would you not go for it.
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Old 12-17-11, 12:55 PM
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I am pretty sure that I know the auctions you are talking about. They appear to be from the same collector and are all around the same price. If you look at the interior of the home that they are photographed it would appear that the seller isn't desperate for money. They have been on ebay for a very long time. If they were listed with a low starting price and reserve they would have all sold a long time ago for pretty good money.

I bought a '73 Molteni Orange Colnago Super frame/fork from a German seller, no problem with the transaction.


Originally Posted by tsappenfield View Post
If you had the cash, would you pay $2000+ for an Italian road bike from an ebay auction? I've noticed recently that there seems to be a proportionately large number of vintage Colnago Super road bikes advertised on ebay USA, but for sale by sellers from Germany. These machines look perfect. Is it just coincidental that so many have appeared at one time, or were the German's in the 1970's in love with this bike and then grew old, tired, poor and are now unloading them? More importantly, how wise is it to purchase such an expensive bike sight unseen, no-return policy, ebay protection, and a seller rating of 100%? Just wondering.

TSapp
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Old 12-17-11, 02:39 PM
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Originally Posted by vjp View Post
If they were listed with a low starting price and reserve they would have all sold a long time ago for pretty good money.
Or maybe not - it seems as though he is a little out to lunch as regards the value of components, period-correctness and condition.

Case in point: his metallic blue 81/82 Super is mostly Campy Gran Sport, lacks hoods, has a later model 3ttt bar and stem combo, a later model Campy aero seatpost and a low-end Dolphin saddle. He wants 1950 USD for it - and the frame has nicks and such, too. For the money he wants, full-period correct, top of the line components and a near-mint frame/fork should be expected.

I'm echoing the late Sheldon Brown's "guideline condition" when it comes to this assessment. I'm not saying one cannot outfit a Colnago Super from the 80s in this way - but to expect to get nearly 2000 USD is in my opinion a pipe dream of the highest order.

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Old 12-17-11, 05:05 PM
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I'm echoing the late Sheldon Brown's "guideline condition" when it comes to this assessment
It is easier to flip an immaculate Huffy than a ragged-out Masi in this corner of the world (even if they were listed at the same price).
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Old 12-21-11, 11:59 AM
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I've heard in Italy they only want the latest & greatest, and don't value the vintage stuff the way we do here. I would guess that ebay seller couldn't get half as much in Europe. While I love looking at those bikes, I'm not into wall hangers or collectibles- it has to be functional, and that means it has to fit, work right, and I'll probably change some components, too. So I probably wouldn't buy off ebay unless it was a bargain.
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Old 12-21-11, 12:24 PM
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Don't forget the Japanese buyers with bottomless pockets that employ an army of third party buyers to get the stuff they want.

If there is a bike that I want, I'll pay what it is worth. lovely little weasel word, "worth".

If I can afford it.

It's why I try to stay away from eBay, too much temptation there.

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Old 12-21-11, 12:25 PM
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I'm echoing the late Sheldon Brown's "guideline condition" when it comes to this assessment
I started reading Sheldon's Guideline Condition close to ten years ago. Is the article subject to updating? If not, the information contained there, today, might not be too relevant, in my opinion.

That comment is not intended as a slander to Sheldon and the great information resource he has been good enough to provide.
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