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Affordable High Flange Alternatives to Campy Record Hubs?

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Affordable High Flange Alternatives to Campy Record Hubs?

Old 05-20-12, 07:25 PM
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suncake
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Affordable High Flange Alternatives to Campy Record Hubs?

For purely aesthetic reasons, like many other CV'ers, I'd like to have high flange hubs (120/126mm rear) on my '74 Raleigh International I'm building up. However, the market price for HF Campy Record hubs is a little rich for my blood.

I was hoping to poll C&V's knowledge of affordable (yet still quality) alternatives, and hopefully find some stuff that's flown under the radar (so we can then collectively over-inflate those as well ).

I'm quite smitten with my Normandy Luxe Competition hubs, which tend to go a little cheaper than the Campys (oblig pic below).

I've heard great things here about SunTour's sealed hubs (Superbe, Sprint). Ebay tends to agree, considering they go for even more than the Records. The Sansin/Sunshine/Specialized labeled versions don't seem any cheaper.

Does a HF version of the Maillard 500/700 exist? What else fits the bill?

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Old 05-20-12, 07:46 PM
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There was a Maillard 700 high flange. Most of them have black plastic dustcaps, which I don't like. Newer models have the metal labyrinth seal, like the low-flange ones that exist more plentifully. Toward the end, there are some really nice high-flange Maillard 700s (but with silkscreened logo on the barrel, not the foil sticker). I have a front and would really like a rear to match. BF member Robatsu was selling a pair on eBay, but I missed out on that.
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Old 05-20-12, 07:54 PM
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Sunshine made some higher-end high-flange hubs. Quite difficult to find though.

-Kurt
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Old 05-20-12, 08:52 PM
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Originally Posted by cudak888 View Post
Sunshine made some higher-end high-flange hubs. Quite difficult to find though.

-Kurt
I have two pairs of those and currently use one of the rears on my Peugeot. I am thinking of using one pair as pseudo-Campagnolos for Capo #1, which currently has anachronistic low-flange Campagnolo hubs. The big appeal of Capo #2 is that it came w/ its original Campagnolo high flangers.
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Old 05-20-12, 09:15 PM
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Suzue made a high-flange hubset. I picked up a NOS/NIB pair a few years ago. They appear to be of similar quality to the Normandy. Not up to Campy but good, I think.

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Old 05-20-12, 10:31 PM
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There are no alternatives. Accept no substitutes (no wait, that's a Porsche thing)....
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Old 05-20-12, 10:54 PM
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Whats your range? I have a set but there 120 spaced.
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Old 05-20-12, 11:36 PM
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Well for me, particularly, after realizing how quickly the costs of building a wheel add up, I'd have a hard time spending more than $50 on a used hub set. I've seen pairs of LF Record hubs go for less than that (rarely), but single HF record hubs consistently go for more than that on ebay. Hence why I usually ignore them. My frame could accommodate 120 or 126, nominally 120 I believe.

I'm curious though--when people talk about the inferiority of non-Record loose-ball hubs, is it primarily with respect to longevity, spec tolerance, or materials used? It's hard for me to imagine my freshly packed Luxe Competitions (without pitting on the cones/races) spinning "better" in a noticeable way. Is it just that Records are less likely to suffer worn cones/races?

Last edited by suncake; 05-20-12 at 11:48 PM.
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Old 05-20-12, 11:43 PM
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While I intended this thread to be more of a general compendium of lesser-known or unfairly ignored HF hubs, I should mention my particular application: 32 or 36h, 700c Sun CR18/M13 boxy rim, light touring/rando. So that rules out any hubs with a history cracked flanges (not that I know of any). I'm not committed to building a wheel either, I'd happily take a cheaper well-built one, I'm just trying to compile the candidate hubs.

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Old 05-21-12, 12:17 AM
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Shimano made some too, although I bet they're even harder to find than the Suzues. I have seen exactly two sets ever in person. One set was on the Volkscycle Mark100, and another was on my black Competition when I got it. I saved the wheels, and may yet use them on something. The rims are kinda ugly though. Araya weinmann knockoffs with a satin finish. Well, I guess they are not ugly so much as Ho Hum boring to look at,,,,BD


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Old 05-21-12, 12:33 AM
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Originally Posted by suncake View Post
I'm curious though--when people talk about the inferiority of non-Record loose-ball hubs, is it primarily with respect to longevity, spec tolerance, or materials used? It's hard for me to imagine my freshly packed Luxe Competitions (without pitting on the cones/races) spinning "better" in a noticeable way. Is it just that Records are less likely to suffer worn cones/races?
Campag Record hubs have really precise tolerances on the entire axle assembly, right down to the cups and even the surfaces in the hubshell where the cups are pressed in.
The result is extremely predictable and consistent adjustability, with none of the freeplay that lesser hubs show at certain rotational positions of the wheel.
The quality of the steel raceways and balls is also good enough to last many tens of thousands of miles, again this is very high standards.
Then there is the fit of the dust shields, which is very protective of the innards, and the overall finish.
Campy Record hubs are the best part of the gruppo imo.

I have seen Luxe Competition hubs that had crudely machined bearing surfaces, and the dust shild is basically a simple piece of flat stock, but otherwise these are also pretty good hubs.

The later Spidel, Edco, Roval and 700 Team hubs, all apparently made by Maillard, did rival Campag's axle accuracy and smoothness, while upping the ante with a stronger, finer-thread axle.
The 1970's Sansin Pro-Am hi-flange hubs are where it appears that Campag got the idea for their C-Record hi-flange hub flange profile. Early Dura-Ace hubshells also featured similar broad cutouts.

One more hubset that I have been particularly impressed with is the Viscount hi-flange sealed-cartridge-bearing hubset.
After the slippery brass driveside locknut is replaced with steel, these hubs last a long time while looking much like Campag's.

Last edited by dddd; 05-21-12 at 12:43 AM.
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Old 05-21-12, 12:39 AM
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^^^ very informative, thanks dddd

On a slight tangent, were the prices for high end Japanese hubs (Superbe, Sansin, Suzue, Sunshine, S*) always so dear, or is this a recent turn of events?
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Old 05-21-12, 01:14 AM
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Sansin Pro-Am hubs came on some relatively modest machines like the Centurion Super Elite, so must have been relatively affordable.
The Superbe hubs came from the same factory and appear to have the same design. Sansin made Sunshine, Suntour and Specialized hubs.
Suzue and Shimano were the other two major Japanese hub manufacturers.
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Old 05-21-12, 03:10 AM
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Campy Nuovo Tipo. They seem to be everywhere around here.
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Old 05-21-12, 05:04 AM
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Someone has a nice looking pair of wheels Argent 10 rims and Suzie hubs over in the apprasail section.

I do agree the price for Campi HF is way high esp the Sherrif star. I am seriously considering selling mine to fund the purchase of the Electra Ticino hubs. but then I have the whole spacing issue for Campi V Shimano...
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Old 05-21-12, 06:06 AM
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Originally Posted by 753proguy View Post
There are no alternatives. Accept no substitutes (no wait, that's a Porsche thing)....
A lady test driving a new 911 almost turned in front of me, I will blame the Morroni label and other window paper on the car for blocking her view, should have rolled the window down... not bad looking car. Then a guy past through the neighborhood with a new McLaren... now that was cool looking and great sounding.

Back to hubs, there were some modest Sanshin and before that Sunshine hubs that "look the part" they are often laced to 27" rims of some sort that came on lower level enthusiast machines way back. They seem pretty scarce today, probably got trashed when it was easier to replace a damaged wheel with a prebuilt unit at the local bike shop.

That reminds me, way back in 1974 I showed my ability to build wheels pretty quickly, so I built countless from various hubs and Rigida steel rims...for exchange use at the shop, it was cheaper at the time to pay me to build them than to buy and pay freight on prebuilts.
The owner offered me $2. per wheel piece work to build as many as possible, I declined as while it was "zen" to do it my fingers would not have held out. Not to mention some of those Rigida rims were wapped from the factory.

To the original poster, a pretty light rim you show in the mage of that bundle of parts...
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Old 05-21-12, 06:10 AM
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Originally Posted by ftwelder View Post
Campy Nuovo Tipo. They seem to be everywhere around here.
You are fortunate, on ebay they can get pretty pricey in pairs, often to Record levels, pun intended.
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Old 05-21-12, 07:03 AM
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I've got a set of high flange Campy Tipo hubs that are reasonably priced.

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Old 05-21-12, 08:11 AM
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The Normandy Luxe Competition hubs have a reputation for having soft cones. In my experience with them they deserve it.

I don't have a problem with the plastic dust caps on the Maillard 700s. Mine are 38 years old. I think they're much better hubs than the Normandys.
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Old 05-21-12, 08:17 AM
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While the up front costs of Camoy hgh flange hubs is high they also hold their value. Parts can be found for them as well. Y can buy Record axles, cones and races, you cant do that with any other hub.
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Old 05-21-12, 08:19 AM
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I also like the Lambert cartridge bearing hubs.
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Old 05-21-12, 08:26 AM
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Look for complete wheelsets, they're often reasonably priced plus you get the spokes, rims, and sometimes tires and freewheel.
No love for Normandy Sport's here? Cheap, available, good-looking if you shine 'em up, and decent quality.
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Old 05-21-12, 08:39 AM
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I have a set of Shimano hubs, not sure of the type, HF, 36 holes laced to fat 27" rims. Indestructible and heavy, very very heavy. The look nice too, especially for a shimano part. The levers are good old shimano ugly though.
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Old 05-21-12, 09:12 AM
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There have been Gnuttis on ebay at times pretty cheap. A Campagnolo set can be had for 100 or so, expensive but they'll outlast you. The Tipos are almost as good as someone mentioned but seem to bring almost the same price. Any of the Japanese ones will probably be pretty good. There was a pair of Lambert on ebay recently, don't know what they went for. I have a couple pair of the Normandys, but haven't built them up yet.
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Old 05-21-12, 10:59 AM
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I have a pair of Dura Ace HF hubs, and the quality seems quite comparable to Campy. Only other ones I've seen are NOS on eBay for big$$$.
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