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Why would you do this to a Paramount ?
I know it's his bike, and his money, and all the other arguments.
But really, why would you do this to a '68 Paramount ? This is an authentic 62 cm Schwinn Paramount from 1968, which I bought in its original condition with all original components. It took me a while to find a frame size large enough for me (I'm 6' tall), and I wanted the fully chromed frame style. I own a Rivendell bicycle, my regular ride, and even though it too is a chrome-moly, lugged frame, its ride quality is so superior to the Paramount's that I wanted to update the Schwinn. I decided to remove and store all the original components, including the seat. . . and turn the bike into the kind of bicycle Schwinn would produce today. Of course, anytime you wish, you can reinstall the original parts- they're included with the bike. I worked through Rivendell to get all the great components they fit to their peerless cycles -- Nitto, Brooks, Shimano, Sugino, etc. -- adapted to fit on the Paramount. One of their expert mechanics worked off-hours to install, adjust and tune the Paramount. It's a gorgeous machine, really -- and rides like a dream. Smooth and quiet, brakes that silently and forcefully stop you, a derailleur that shifts butter-smooth, a second set of interrupter levers for dual-hand positioning- and fenders with mud flaps! Hand-built wheels by Rich Lesnik. . . Phil Wood hubs -- the crème de la crème! I simply don't have the time to ride the bike; it has been a two-year long project, and I have ridden it no more than 25 miles total. A rough estimate, on the low side, of what I've invested: over $3,200. Not bad for a very rare example of American Schwinn's finest offering, a collectible bike that can keep up with anything, looks that drop jaws, and an engineered ride that is pure pleasure. Serious folks only, please. Asking $2,000. http://listhd.com/user_images/7459155.jpghttp://listhd.com/user_images/9006702.jpghttp://listhd.com/user_images/3711764.jpghttp://listhd.com/user_images/7727216.jpg http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/bik/3065169891.html |
To make it more enjoyable to ride?
It's not like he painted a mustache on the Mona Lisa.... |
Looks like an exceptionally well thought out and executed project. Vintage frame + modern drivetrain = win.
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Why not? (Timothy Leary's last words -- I'm not kidding)
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Originally Posted by bigbossman
(Post 14405728)
To make it more enjoyable to ride?
It's not like he painted a mustache on the Mona Lisa.... |
Originally Posted by RFC
(Post 14405744)
Why not? (Timothy Leary's last words -- I'm not kidding)
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Originally Posted by Barchettaman
(Post 14405742)
Looks like an exceptionally well thought out and executed project. Vintage frame + modern drivetrain = win.
I've ridden a number of Paramounts, and have a couple now. They are pretty functional as originally specced. |
Originally Posted by 3alarmer
(Post 14405758)
So in your opinion this is an improvement in functionality ? I honestly do not see it as such.
I've ridden a number of Paramounts, and have a couple now. They are pretty functional as originally specced. |
It is just a bike (le gasp)
not like he made it into a fixed gear and chopped all the braze-ons and derailer hanger. My friend has the same frame in the same size and I want it so bad. I can't have it, but if it were mine I might do the same thing. |
Looks eerily similar to what I did with my '73 Paramount P13-9 frame, triple crank, aero levers, and barcons - even the same cable routing. Mine has a Deore mtb RD on it and a 7-speed freewheel with a Grand Cru wheelset. I run the Ultegra barcons in friction mode and with the Hyperglide freewheel on the back and the pinned/ramped chainrings in the front, it shifts like silk, almost totally silent. I went that guy one better (or worse, depending on your point of view) and used a threadless stem adapter. Of course, back in the day, I used Suntour barcons with the same frame, same cable routing as now.
No cross levers or fenders on mine, however. |
Schwinn built the Paramount frame with the goal of producing the best on the market. "Paramount" is a name that had a significant meaning to the people that were involved in it's construction.
I think this model was the Cougar and someone removed the stickers. |
Had it been ridden regularly over the years, one would expect component wear and updating , probably with the best in mind, as well as some personalization, I would think .
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Why would you do this to a Paramount ?
My question is: Why *wouldn't* you do this to a Paramount? It appears to be a rider and he saved all the parts for a future owner.
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I'm with you 3alarmer. That's a shame. Something of that vintage and pedigree needs vintage parts. That bike hurts my eyes.
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I'm not seeing the problem - he updated a bike to modern, BETTER (and yes, modern stuff works better from nearly any objective measure but durability) parts to enjoy it more. The best laid plans of mice and men - he didn't ride it. That happens to a LOT (dare I say most?) bikes sold. He even kept the original parts! This is no sacrilege and he even made it look pretty sharp...I actually like what he did here.
Taking a grinder to the derailleur hanger would be a sacrilege. It's a Paramount - it's a nice bike, but it's not a Confente or something irreplaceable. This doesn't offend me at all. As far as performance, I'm a big fan of combining modern parts spec with steel...I also like the aesthetics. |
My father and I used to have the same argument over cars and trucks. He was an antique auto collector and owned several vintage vehicles restored to pristine condition. While I appreciate a perfect frame-up restoration, I also enjoy seeing custom work and in my late teens and early 20s rodded a 1963 Chevy pickup and a 1953 Chevy Deluxe with the help of some friends from a nearby car club and body shop. Neither was radically altered, but got engine, suspension and drivetrain upgrades; Frenched license plate frames, antenae mounts, and body seams; and custom paint jobs and interiors. On the pickup, we moved the fuel tank from behind the seat (never a good design idea in the first place) to custom dual tanks under the oak planked box.
I was very happy with the results, especially on the pickup, but my father was horrified that we had "ruined" vehicles that should have been restored "the way they were meant to be" as if Moses had brought the original designs down from the mount on stone tablets. Neither of the vehicles was particularly rare, a classic, or even in complete pristine original condition (the pickup was actually fairly rough to start with and missing most of its chrome). I can see and appreciate both approaches. The only time I get unsettled is when someone who doesn't have a clue takes a classic bike and irreverseably screws it up for the sake of "customizing" it. |
Looks like a nice bike. No shame in improving a great frame with nice modern components.
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Nothing wrong with the modifications, but he sure made it ugly. But, he's including the original parts, which is a pretty square deal for 2k. I'd sell the new parts to subsidize the cost of buying and restoring the original...
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I look at it from a different perspective. The Campy NR/ Weinmann brake Paramount has an aesthetic all its own. And to top it off this one is chrome. Performance wise i will always be partial to the Campy NR group. And hasn't the tan saddle/bartape thing been done to death.
But also consider that the Nitto bars on my Peugeot are driving me nuts. Gotta find some Pivo French rando bars. |
Originally Posted by KonAaron Snake
(Post 14405907)
I'm not seeing the problem - he updated a bike to modern, BETTER (and yes, modern stuff works better from nearly any objective measure but durability) parts to enjoy it more. The best laid plans of mice and men - he didn't ride it. That happens to a LOT (dare I say most?) bikes sold. He even kept the original parts! This is no sacrilege and he even made it look pretty sharp...I actually like what he did here.
Taking a grinder to the derailleur hanger would be a sacrilege. It's a Paramount - it's a nice bike, but it's not a Confente or something irreplaceable. This doesn't offend me at all. As far as performance, I'm a big fan of combining modern parts spec with steel...I also like the aesthetics. It's not like anything he did is irreversible. For $2,000 with the original parts even the price is pretty reasonable, in my opinion. Again, it's not like it's a Confente or even a Confente replica, so to get this upset is befuddling. |
Originally Posted by bibliobob
(Post 14405968)
Nothing wrong with the modifications, but he sure made it ugly. But, he's including the original parts, which is a pretty square deal for 2k. I'd sell the new parts to subsidize the cost of buying and restoring the original...
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Originally Posted by photogravity
(Post 14406005)
This is one of those rare times when we agree with each other, Aaron. :)
It's not like anything he did is irreversible. For $2,000 with the original parts even the price is pretty reasonable, in my opinion. Again, it's not like it's a Confente or even a Confente replica, so to get this upset is befuddling. Looks fine to me, but I don't ride or own Schwinns. Wouldn't kick a Match built Paramount out of the stable though. No biggie folks. |
Originally Posted by photogravity
(Post 14406005)
This is one of those rare times when we agree with each other, Aaron. :)
It's not like anything he did is irreversible. For $2,000 with the original parts even the price is pretty reasonable, in my opinion. Again, it's not like it's a Confente or even a Confente replica, so to get this upset is befuddling. Agree or not, I'd ride with you...especially if it were on that Bilenky! I love your tandem selection...Davidsons, Bileky's, Jack Taylors... |
Originally Posted by photogravity
(Post 14405899)
My question is: Why *wouldn't* you do this to a Paramount? It appears to be a rider and he saved all the parts for a future owner.
Because it cost a boatload of money, and seems to have been driven by the need to feel "special" ? Because it appears not to be "an improvement" as evidenced by its continuing non use ? Because .......................................well, you get my drift, I think.:p |
Originally Posted by photogravity
(Post 14406005)
Again, it's not like it's a Confente or even a Confente replica, so to get this upset is befuddling. To do this project as described, with a boatload of cash invested, a "special" relationship with your very own Rivendell mechanic, and a completed project that you "lack the time to ride".......that, sir, is befuddling.....................................:roflmao2: |
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