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'92 Paramount PDG Series 5 or '88 Panasonic DX-5000

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'92 Paramount PDG Series 5 or '88 Panasonic DX-5000

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Old 07-04-12, 02:48 PM
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exapkib
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'92 Paramount PDG Series 5 or '88 Panasonic DX-5000

The title says it all--looking for a daily commuter/backup bike. I've been wanting to find some vintage steel for this use (nothing too fancy, but something fun to ride).

Both bikes are within my budget. Both mostly stock setups. Both seem to be in very good shape.

Anything that would sway you one way or the other?

Happy 4th of July all!

Thanks----
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Old 07-04-12, 02:59 PM
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Tubing, condition, components and wheels. That would sway me.
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Old 07-04-12, 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by teetime View Post
Tubing, condition, components and wheels. That would sway me.
Fair enough. Here's what I'm looking at (like I said--the bikes are both basically stock):

Panasonic
Tubing: Tange Prestige Tange/
Components: Shimano 600
Wheels: Shimano 600 hubs/Ukai rims

Schwinn
Tubing: Tange/Paramount Precision OS
Components: Shimano 105
Wheels: Shimano 105 hubs/Campy Omega Strada rims

As I said, I'm mostly interested in a daily rider. This bike will be my ride for my (short--about 4 miles each way) commute, and also a backup for the occasional weekend escape.
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Old 07-04-12, 04:15 PM
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Schwinn
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Old 07-04-12, 04:33 PM
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I had that version Paramount - great bike!
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Old 07-04-12, 07:44 PM
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Fit? That's the first thing.

Assuming that's equal, then that's a tough call.

Frame-wise, Tange Prestige is light, precise, and probably a higher quality level than the Schwinn,and better paint from Panasonic. The Tange OS, however, had the benefits of a lot of money and time spent by the PDG getting it right, and the 5 and 7 series were produced to pretty high standards in Japan. They probably have the same fork. You'd almost have to ride them to make a good decision. (For some reason, I thought that the DX6000 was the Prestige-framed bike) Based on my experience with a Prestige-framed bike and a Series 7, I'm calling it even. If the fork is the lugged Prestige fork on the DX, I'd give that frame the nod, because I really don't think you're going to notice much performance difference.

Component-wise, the 2x7 600 is reliable, simple, and nice, excellent hubs. Upgrading from the UG 7sp cassette to 8/9/10 would require buying the freehub and swapping it in, but that group has nice features, finish, and performance. Calipers would be single pivot. My info shows the 105 would be the DT-shifted 2x8, and I believe the single-pivot calipers, also. Upgrading would be easier, as the 8-sp freehub would accept a 9 and 10 later on, if you wanted to. Many consider that 105 group equal to the earlier 600, and I don't disagree with that. Because of the upgrade factor, I'd give a very slight edge to the newer 105, but my experience with the hubs makes that reluctant. Tricolor 600 hubs are ace.

Now that we're still fairly "even," let's look at the rims: The nod would go to the Campy Omegas. Take the wheelsets as a whole, and the rims (and most likely, the spokes, too) would point me at the 105/Campy set. Proven performers, and basically, the wheels are what are putting you in touch with the pavement. Hubs can be packed and adjusted so the difference between them is negligible, but from the hub out, those parts make a difference.

Given what you've presented, if the conditions are the same, assuming bars/stems/hoods/saddle are not an issue, I'd have to lean towards the Schwinn, by a little bit, that being the 8-sp hub and wheels. If the wheels on the DX had been, say Wolbers or Araya Hard anodized, I'd have taken the DX, even with a 7-sp rear.

Paint job: Schwinn, but we're not talking aesthetics.

I've had the privilege to ride two different Prestige frames, and two different Schwinn OS bikes, a 2 and a 7.
It's still a pretty tough call. All were upgraded to modern components, and it's still a coin toss in my mind.

If it's strictly commuter-backup, look and see how solid those Ukai wheels are. They may be the choice to make it to work and back over potholes, etc. If it's strictly a workout-backup, maybe go with the somewhat lighter Campy wheels, if they're not going to be asked to do urban cyclo-cross.
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Old 07-04-12, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by exapkib View Post
Fair enough. Here's what I'm looking at (like I said--the bikes are both basically stock):

Panasonic
Tubing: Tange Prestige Tange/
Components: Shimano 600
Wheels: Shimano 600 hubs/Ukai rims

Schwinn
Tubing: Tange/Paramount Precision OS
Components: Shimano 105
Wheels: Shimano 105 hubs/Campy Omega Strada rims

As I said, I'm mostly interested in a daily rider. This bike will be my ride for my (short--about 4 miles each way) commute, and also a backup for the occasional weekend escape.
Assuming that the 2 bikes are pretty much otherwise equal (they both fit you and you like the color), then I'd go for the bike that has standard reach brakes (as opposed to short reach brakes). Perhaps they both take standard reach brakes; perhaps neither one does in which case this won't matter. But assuming that one takes longer reach brakes then the other, that bike will also take a fatter tire which really matters since you want the bike primarily for commuting.
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Old 07-04-12, 09:00 PM
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I basically have both bikes, a 1992 Paramount Series 5, and a 1987 Schwinn Prologue (both bikes were made by Panasonic) . The Prologue has the Tange Prestige frame bike, very similar to the DX5000.

Both of mine are upgraded quite a bit. The Series 5 is now all Shimano 600/Ultegra, 8 speed STI, while the Prologue is almost all 9 speed Dura Ace.

It would be tough for me to pick a winner between these two. The Prologue has better paint, and much better decal work.



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Old 07-04-12, 09:01 PM
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Wow--thank you for the very informative replies. I'm going out to take a second look at the Schwinn tomorrow morning.

From the information here (and from my initial impressions of both bikes) I think price will end up being the deciding factor.

If you have any other thoughts, please chime in.

@Robbietunes--turns out both bikes have seven-speed clusters, so both are equally removed from upgrades to newer drivetrains. Thanks again for your really helpful reply.
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Old 07-04-12, 09:31 PM
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Don't worry too much about the seven speed limitations. Both are quite upgrade-able, and I am running higher speeds on both of them now.

In general, on resale, the Schwinn name (and the Paramount name in particular) will get a stronger response than Panasonic. I have several Panasonic bikes, they really made great ones. But when it comes time to sell them, the response is always underwhelming.
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Old 07-04-12, 09:47 PM
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Originally Posted by wrk101 View Post
Don't worry too much about the seven speed limitations. Both are quite upgrade-able, and I am running higher speeds on both of them now.

In general, on resale, the Schwinn name (and the Paramount name in particular) will get a stronger response than Panasonic. I have several Panasonic bikes, they really made great ones. But when it comes time to sell them, the response is always underwhelming.
That's a good thing when being on the buying end. To the OP, Your weight might be the key to picking the best frameset, If you are on the light side , the Prestige , if heavier the OS tubing.
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Old 07-04-12, 09:58 PM
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Thanks again for the insights!

@wrk101--The photos are great! Thanks. Any other comments on the ride of these two tubesets?

@Mr. Smedley--weight is such a tricky thing when talking with cyclists--isn't it? I migrate from about 150 to about 160 and back as the seasons change each year. Am I to understand from your comments that the Schwinn will be a stiffer ride? I ride exclusively on a CAAD9, and I'm anticipating that both of these will ride considerably smoother than that one. Am I on target?
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Old 07-04-12, 10:48 PM
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Where are the pics of the bikes
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