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The Italian Card Game

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Old 10-17-12, 12:15 AM
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calamarichris
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The Italian Card Game

So DeRosa has the hearts.


Colnago has the clubs.



Which (Italian?) makes have (had?) the diamonds and spades? And why? Anyone know anything about the history of these logo choices?

Bonus question: I seem to remember another make having the heart, but can't remember which.
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Old 10-17-12, 12:22 AM
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Veloh
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I think Ciocc has all four.
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Old 10-17-12, 01:07 AM
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Mario Confente gets the spades:

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Old 10-17-12, 01:20 AM
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Some nice pics, chris. Quattro Assi (four aces) obviously used the whole set, Andycapp just beat me to Confente. Here's a list of 900 Italian brands, with links - good luck http://italiaanseracefietsen.wordpress.com/merkenlijst/
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Old 10-17-12, 05:29 AM
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I'd like to know who has the blue clovers and purple horse shoes.
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Old 10-17-12, 05:39 AM
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The people bicycle racing are like that the people playing poker sometimes. Everyone is eventually looking at everyone else trying to read them, whos strong, whos faking it and so fourth. Thats my theory to all the card suits being engraved into lugs and parts.
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Old 10-17-12, 06:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Veloh View Post
I think Ciocc has all four.
Yep.

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Old 10-17-12, 07:02 AM
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I'm surprised we don't see more icons from the other traditional Italian card games of Briscola and Scopa?
Swords, cups, coins, horses
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Old 10-17-12, 09:25 AM
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Diamonds show up on the Italvega made by Torpado as well as some Torpadoes, (later migrated to Univega frames made by Miyata). A diamond was also used on some Pogliaghis.
There's a budget line from Colnago (it was Colner) that used a spade instead of a club (the "club" was said to originally represent a flower, not represent a suit of playing cards, but after Ernesto used one it was off to the races).

Italuminum: that link is a great resource, thanks for posting it!

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Old 10-17-12, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by KonAaron Snake View Post
I'd like to know who has the blue clovers and purple horse shoes.
Lucky Charms?
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Old 10-17-12, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by unworthy1 View Post
Diamonds show up on the Italvega made by Torpado as well as some Torpadoes!
Italvega fork on my Titan...
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Old 10-17-12, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Italuminium View Post
Some nice pics, chris. Quattro Assi (four aces) obviously used the whole set, Andycapp just beat me to Confente. Here's a list of 900 Italian brands, with links - good luck http://italiaanseracefietsen.wordpress.com/merkenlijst/
Wohhhhh! Now that's a link!

My eyes are going to twitch after I'm done with this one!

I'm in love with the DeRosa girl. Such classic Italian good looks in the Sophia Loren style. Of course she's well into her 50's by now and probably a plump, grey haired Nonna. I'll bet she's a great cook though!
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Old 10-17-12, 02:56 PM
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Silly Rabbit - Cioccs are for kids!
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Old 10-17-12, 03:07 PM
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Originally Posted by thinktubes View Post
Yep.

I have seen this same outline card suit graphic used elsewhere in non Italian items.
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Old 10-17-12, 09:55 PM
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Giovanni "Ciocc" Pelizzoli's racing nickname was "Poker Face", hence the four aces logo.

However, Segnore Pelizzoli claims that "Ciocc" is a meaningless nickname shared by his father and grandfather:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJHwPqn2jY0

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Old 10-17-12, 11:39 PM
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Google produced a couple older threads on the subject. No huge revelations but...

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...-playing-cards

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...amp-card-suits


And a quote pulled from the 2008 link:
Originally Posted by caterham View Post
my take on it-

window cutouts helps the builder to see the penetration and flow of the braze into the lug

a unique window cutout was/is perceived as a sign of a quality builder and serves as an expression of art/individualism/identity (ie-the builder could charge more money for his work)

a unique cutout or lug can serve as a company logo/builder identification- in italy, unique cutouts and engravings would become the preferred premium builder's signature, whereas in the UK, where commercialism in sports was long regarded as crass, builder identification generally focused more on creative lug profiling and shaping, a few would curve their stays & forks etc.

a card suite cutout is relatively easy to do and the forms are instantly recognised

tho some designs may have some symbolic tie to the builder or his background, imo, many of the stories and explanations were fabrications soley to justify the builder's particular chosen logo shape.
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Old 10-17-12, 11:47 PM
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I'm making (albeit slow) progress on brazing a frame of my own. I've been trying to come up with a design that hasn't been used to embellish it a bit. Anyone know of a builder that used the "US" shown below? If not I may just have to use that...

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Old 10-18-12, 01:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Andycapp View Post
I'm making (albeit slow) progress on brazing a frame of my own. I've been trying to come up with a design that hasn't been used to embellish it a bit. Anyone know of a builder that used the "US" shown below? If not I may just have to use that...


Maybe you could ask:

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