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how to service an early 70s Raleigh Grand Prix?

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how to service an early 70s Raleigh Grand Prix?

Old 08-25-13, 06:46 PM
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chapel
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how to service an early 70s Raleigh Grand Prix?

So, my dad was impressed with how well I fixed up my brother's bike that he asked me to help him get this roadworthy for him:
a 1973 Raleigh Grand Prix

http://www.pedalroom.com/bike/1973-r...and-prix-13223



Neat saddle:

My dad said this is a part he wants to keep badly.
crazy:


Centrepulls


Simplex derailleur


[img\http://www.pedalroom.com/p/1973-raleigh-grand-prix-13223_15.jpg[/img]



Does anyone make replicas or close approximations of these tires?


From what I can tell, it needs new brake cables... but I don't know if I can replace the housings coming out of the brake hoods? they look like they've got some sort of plastic thing that holds them to the top of the hood? They're Weinmann/Carlton levers.

I also think the bottom bracket needs service. This isn't going to be easy, is it...
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Old 08-25-13, 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by chapel View Post
From what I can tell, it needs new brake cables... but I don't know if I can replace the housings coming out of the brake hoods? they look like they've got some sort of plastic thing that holds them to the top of the hood? They're Weinmann/Carlton levers.

I also think the bottom bracket needs service. This isn't going to be easy, is it...
It's a straightforward complete overhaul of a neglected but not obviously abused 40 year old Brit-bike.
It seems to be "all there" so "all" it needs is a complete dis-assembly of all bearing surfaces (HS,BB,Hubs) inspection & re-pack w/ fresh grease and bearings as necessary.
Replace all cables, housing & brake pads. Fresh ferrules will come w/ the new brake cables.
New rim strips, tires & tubes are inexpensive & readily available, take the wheels to a LBS while you have the tires off to be tensioned/trued if not straight & round.
Lube the chain, oil the FW, replace if skipping.
Patiently rub the top only of the saddle w/ quality leather conditioner, repeat, repeat. Dad is not crazy.
Remove seatpost & stem, grease & re-install. Re-tape bars.
While it's wheels and doo-dads are removed go after the chrome & paint job w/ auto products designed for the same purpose.

A good old school maintenance guide covers all the "how to" and you will need some specialized tools.

http://www.amazon.com/Bicycle-Repair...%27+bike+guide

There are worse ways to spend your time & it's for your Dad, get cracking.

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Last edited by Bandera; 08-25-13 at 07:18 PM.
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Old 08-25-13, 07:17 PM
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Like BANDERA said! Those chrome rims look to be in trouble....make sure they are not too rusty inside...if so, they may not be safe. If it is just surface rust on the outside and can be buffed off, OK....but old steel rims sometimes are not worth the effort if they are too far gone. Good cleaning and lubing, looks pretty solid, just a bit neglected
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Old 08-25-13, 07:24 PM
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Originally Posted by RubberLegs View Post
Like BANDERA said! Those chrome rims look to be in trouble....make sure they are not too rusty inside...if so, they may not be safe. If it is just surface rust on the outside and can be buffed off, OK....but old steel rims sometimes are not worth the effort if they are too far gone. Good cleaning and lubing, looks pretty solid, just a bit neglected
RL,

They do look a bit doomed, but I don't have a spoke wrench on them. Fresh 27" alloys are a big upgrade and an inexpensive pay-back for all the nonsense dear old Dad went through and it saves overhaul(s).

http://www.amazon.com/Sta-Tru-Silver...%22+bike+wheel

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Last edited by Bandera; 08-25-13 at 07:27 PM.
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Old 08-25-13, 07:27 PM
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I'm thinking maybe I'll give him my 27" wheels if necessary. Would wheels from an 87 Centurion work on this? Could I move his 5 speed freewheel over?
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Old 08-25-13, 07:32 PM
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I would think the Centurion Wheels would work, might be a bit wider, is it 5, 6 or a 7 speed? If it is more speeds, you will need to spread the frame a bit, but it should work. Alloy rims MUCH better, give the gal new life and MUCH better braking
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Old 08-25-13, 07:36 PM
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mine is a 6 speed. 126mm rear spacing.
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Old 08-25-13, 07:37 PM
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All the chrome bits can be cleaned op in a mild acid bath, most hardware stores sell it as rust stain remover, just dilute it a little and soak the chrome parts for a day or so and the rust will vanish.

Be careful with the Wright, I had one like that an in trying to soften it I ruined it, the Wright (at least the one I had) has fairly thin leather.

Also be careful with the fasteners on the bike, odds are they're Whitworth sizes which means that none of your standard or metric tools will fit them properly.
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Old 08-25-13, 07:42 PM
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seriously?
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Old 08-25-13, 07:42 PM
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Originally Posted by chapel View Post
I'm thinking maybe I'll give him my 27" wheels if necessary. Would wheels from an 87 Centurion work on this? Could I move his 5 speed freewheel over?
If they are 27", sure. Plenty of spring in that 120 frame to fit 126.
But why would you cheat your poor old father of a more modern drivetrain when he always made sure you and your brother had plenty of cough medicine & cigarettes as children?
No, wait. That was my dad.........
Swap Centurion FW & chain w/ '87 wheels, why not?

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Old 08-25-13, 07:51 PM
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Originally Posted by FORDSVTPARTS View Post
Also be careful with the fasteners on the bike, odds are they're Whitworth sizes which means that none of your standard or metric tools will fit them properly.
None of the Simplex, Normandy or Weineman components are but the seat post binder, saddle clamp and other bits & bobs are.
Nothing the judicious use of an adjustable can't handle.

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Old 08-25-13, 08:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Bandera View Post
None of the Simplex, Normandy or Weineman components are but the seat post binder, saddle clamp and other bits & bobs are.
Nothing the judicious use of an adjustable can't handle.

-Bandera
I was just giving him a heads up about the presence of the Whitworth fasteners so he wouldn't be wondering why his tools didn't fit.
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Old 08-25-13, 08:11 PM
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Originally Posted by FORDSVTPARTS View Post
I was just giving him a heads up about the presence of the Whitworth fasteners so he wouldn't be wondering why his tools didn't fit.
They can be an unexpected "Gottcha". Whit-What????

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Old 08-25-13, 08:11 PM
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What Bandera said, basically -- though if there's nothing wrong with the cable housing, I say lube it up and keep it (change the cables themselves, though).

For removing rust from chrome: I find the easiest way is to use a bronze-wire brush wheel. A big one on a drill for the large areas, a small one on a Dremel for little bits. (But yeah, if you switch to alloy wheels, there'll be a lot less rust to deal with.)

Those brake pads look like the Mafac model; you can get new Kool Stop rubber inserts (the best) here: http://sheldonbrown.com/harris/brakeshoes.html#refill

For the saddle, I've had pretty good luck with Lexol leather conditioner.
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Old 08-25-13, 08:28 PM
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chapel,

What you got here is a Dad who used Down Tube Controls, proving that there are still men in this world.

Pics of the restoration please and my Best to your Old Man.

-Bandera
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Old 08-25-13, 08:39 PM
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Regarding the bottom bracket, those cotters look like they have the red raleigh R on them. They are easily bent and expensive to replace. The tool for cotters is expensive too, $55. I'd find an LBS to handle that for you, like Harris Cyclery.
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Old 08-26-13, 04:58 AM
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Originally Posted by FORDSVTPARTS View Post
I was just giving him a heads up about the presence of the Whitworth fasteners so he wouldn't be wondering why his tools didn't fit.
Much appreciated.
I thought we were past British standards by the 70s... stubborn people, aren't they

Originally Posted by brianinc-ville View Post
What Bandera said, basically -- though if there's nothing wrong with the cable housing, I say lube it up and keep it (change the cables themselves, though).
The front housings look solid. What do you use to lube the housings?
The rear housings for the rear brake is perished though. I'll need to replace that one.

For removing rust from chrome: I find the easiest way is to use a bronze-wire brush wheel. A big one on a drill for the large areas, a small one on a Dremel for little bits. (But yeah, if you switch to alloy wheels, there'll be a lot less rust to deal with.)
What about cola and foil method? worked brilliantly on my bike.

Those brake pads look like the Mafac model; you can get new Kool Stop rubber inserts (the best) here: http://sheldonbrown.com/harris/brakeshoes.html#refill

For the saddle, I've had pretty good luck with Lexol leather conditioner.
Yeah, he's good with leather conditioning.

Originally Posted by Bandera View Post
chapel,

What you got here is a Dad who used Down Tube Controls, proving that there are still men in this world.

Pics of the restoration please and my Best to your Old Man.

-Bandera
Yeah, he's old school. Came up as an apprentice machiner at General Electric under his father. Worked for GE for 35 years, got sick of all the 20-something kids coming in with 'engineering' degrees telling him how to do his job and moved to a few other places. He was telling me he'd probably put over 1000 miles on that bike before he put it in the shed in 1988. He says the only non-original part on it is the chain. I guess he used to do races a lot... though admitedly he said it was mainly because of the promise of free beer at the end of the race.

Originally Posted by oddjob2 View Post
Regarding the bottom bracket, those cotters look like they have the red raleigh R on them. They are easily bent and expensive to replace. The tool for cotters is expensive too, $55. I'd find an LBS to handle that for you, like Harris Cyclery.
Yes, they have the red R on them. I was looking to find a cycle shop nearby that can handle these older bikes. I feel like the BB is in desperate need of service. Luckily, Harris Cyclery isn't terribly far away.

We're going to a bike swap meet on Monday. We hope to make some connections.
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Old 08-26-13, 05:21 AM
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This LBS has great reviews and is closer.

http://www.yelp.com/biz/centraal-cycle-beverly

One other thing, I don't think anyone mentioned. You ought to find a Suntour Vx or similar RD an FD. Fairly cheap, you'll need them when the Simplex crack due to age.

White lithium grease or Park grease the cables where they contact the housing. Spend the extra for stainless steel.

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Old 08-26-13, 05:27 AM
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I haven't gone to see them yet. I was making my way down to them the other day when my wife recalled me
I'll ask if they have any vintage experience.
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Old 08-26-13, 05:39 AM
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Anyone Else Thinking This?

Please replace the cable housings. Today's lined housings are superior and give better performance. Keeping old rusted housings...eeeewww?

Have an experienced shop remove the cotters for you. You can service the bottom bracket bearings then. Cotter removal is not a job for the inexperienced.

I'd go further. Replace the Simplex derailleurs and matching shifters. Remove them carefully, clean them thoroughly and lubricate them, and take excellent photos. After you've sold them on eBay, use the proceeds to buy SunTour Vx derailleurs front and back. Include the ratcheting PowerShifters for the downtube. Better performance, appearance and durability. Your net costs won't be much, if any.

Yes, the wheels should be replaced, but finding a set that's rear spaced at 120mm will be tougher. I'd contact Harris Cyclery and see what options they can offer. Or, have your local wheelbuilder re-string the hubs onto alloy rims? Remove the freewheel before cutting out the rear hub, though. You can service and shine the hubs before the rebuild.

For the saddle, I would be hesitant to use a leather conditioner. Do some research on the internet on old leather saddle care. For new saddles, something like SnoSeal or Proofhide is recommended. For bringing an older saddle to life without softening it to the point of stretching... I'm not sure. Be careful and do your homework before proceding.

Again, new cable housings throughout. You'll be able to use brake housing for the friction shifting system, too, making it just one transaction. You can buy the housing by the foot on eBay in grey.

Good luck. PG

Last edited by Phil_gretz; 08-26-13 at 05:52 AM.
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Old 08-26-13, 05:40 AM
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Myself, I would not reuse old housing that may well be over 40 years old. Instead, I would replace with modern lined housing. I buy it by the roll at Niagara Cycle, 50 feet for about $12. I would also use stainless cables.
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Old 08-26-13, 05:46 AM
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I just tried this recently, mixed this bottle with about a gallon of water and threw a bunch of rusty bits in overnight, next day I pulled the parts out and gave them a rinse and quick wipedown with WD-40.



I'd also suggest simply replacing all the cables with stainless and the housings with modern lined housings, they work better and look better.
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Old 08-26-13, 05:47 AM
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I'll see what I can find. I've still got a bunch of white housing from my build I can use too. The housing on this is weird. It's got like striations cut into the outside. looks real old. I don't mind replacing the housing. It just looked like it fit into the lever housings with something special and not just a regular ferrule. The hoods don't roll back, they're just hard plastic
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Old 08-26-13, 05:49 AM
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I actually am reusing the old ribbed housing on a Super Course MK II. Zero rust, no cracks in cover. It's the exception, not the rule.

The MSDS on the Whink product is hydrochloric acid. Try Savogram wood bleach, available at Ace. Oxalic acid, less caustic, equally cheap.

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Old 08-26-13, 06:04 AM
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the front housings are clean and crack free. Not sure about internals.
The rear housing for the rear brake is completely cooked and would need replacement.
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