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C&V Cleats in the 21st Century

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C&V Cleats in the 21st Century

Old 02-24-14, 09:49 AM
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tiger1964
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C&V Cleats in the 21st Century

OK, I promise this is the year I start riding more -- a lot more. The first thing is I really cannot fit in my shoes anymore, and there are far more holes in the leather now than the factory put there despite a couple of trips to shoe repair to have them patched up..

So I walked into a shop nearby, where I once worked in 1974, holding my Detto Article 7's that I bought while I worked there, w/TA "Long Anquetil" cleats that I had proudly riveted on myself as a 17-year-old. The "kids" in the shop didn't even recognize them as bike shoes, but gamely showed me the latest offerings. I found I take a 45 now, and found a set that didn't look too space-alien except instead of shoe strings there's a wire of sorts with a ratchet tightening knob and I can live with that.

But they could not show me any non-clipless cleats. Well, I could go with the new technology, but I guess I'd have to buy 4-5 sets of new pedals (and don't think they'd know French thread from French toast) if i wanted to eventually ride all of my bikes, so I'm inclined to stay with "The Old Ways" if possible.

So, after a search here and on-line and finding a gazillion hits on "cleats" but nothing on pre-clipless, is there a cleat today that will work w/old pedals and toes clips/straps? BTW, the shoe (forgot the name) had a "dual pattern" for 2 or 3 bolts. My wife's late-90's shoes (her previous shoes having been cut off by the paramedics after her wreck) have such cleats but I cannot pilfer hers -- but at least at one point, they existed.
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Old 02-24-14, 09:55 AM
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I think I have a pair of plastic (nylon?) cleats that mount with three bolts, so perhaps to a Look style shoe, but the business side of the cleat is an old school slot. Is that what you're looking for?

Otherwise, I know a forum member who has outgrown his 45's with the slotted cleat and would doubtless pass on to you a nice old pair of shoes.
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Old 02-24-14, 10:01 AM
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Yellow Jersey has slotted cleats that mount on modern pedals:



One caveat: many modern shoes are too tall to fit in vintage toeclips, so be prepared to shop around for different toeclips.
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Old 02-24-14, 10:14 AM
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One issue I've encountered - caveat, I'm suing a different brand than the YJ's - is cleat slippage on my selected shoe using this 2-bolt arrangement. I can tighten cleat bolts - I have no problems with my usual SPD or SPD-SL, but these have vexed me. Not really sure if it's the bottom surface of the shoes, the cleats or the shoe's screw inserts. On my shoes, the screw inserts have some forward/aft adjustability, but the cleat holes are fixed/not slotted. My solution (I haven't tested them yet) is gluing a small piece of sandpaper to the bottom of the cleat. Hopefully your cleat/shoe combo won't be an issue.

My cleats look kind of like these:
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cleat_TAPROP.jpg (19.3 KB, 6 views)

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Old 02-24-14, 01:15 PM
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By the way, I recall for years gone by a little tab that attached to the back of the pedal to ease flipping the pedal around... are those available anywhere?

Originally Posted by JohnDThompson View Post
Yellow Jersey has slotted cleats that mount on modern pedals:

One caveat: many modern shoes are too tall to fit in vintage toeclips, so be prepared to shop around for different toeclips.
Thanks, founds their sight (and, oddly, they also say they have the original Anquetil cleats but I don't how I could possibly mount them). No idea what the center-to-center distance is for "Look Compatable" drilling. Thanks for the warning about shoe height.
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Old 02-24-14, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by tiger1964 View Post
By the way, I recall for years gone by a little tab that attached to the back of the pedal to ease flipping the pedal around... are those available anywhere?
Yes, look on Ebay. You'll find them cheap.
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Old 02-24-14, 02:43 PM
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Absolutely right that most modern shoes have soles that won't allow them to fit in the usual space with a clip and strap. I have two "modern" shoes that do fit properly, with Look three bolt patterns. I have the Adidas Addistar and the Vittoria 1986. I use that same Yellow Jersey two-bolt cleat. The Vittoria 1986 actually came with a set of similar (to the Yellow Jersey) slotted cleats, right in the box. I find that the Yellow Jersey cleat has a slightly undersized slot that makes them more difficult to engage and dis-engage smoothly. The Vittoria version has a little more bevel and engage more smoothly. I emailed Vittoria's US customer support group, who are about 30 miles from my house, on how i could get more of their cleats but I never got a reply. BTW, I like the 1986 shoes very much, very light too!

I also have several pairs of original shoes and it has become ever harder to get cleats to fit.

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Old 02-25-14, 06:14 AM
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Looks like Vittoria has an entire line of classic style shoes, though the 1986 mentioned doesn't seem to be among them.
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Old 02-25-14, 06:59 AM
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Originally Posted by rhm View Post
Yes, look on Ebay. You'll find them cheap.
Any idea on what they are called or what brand? To ease searching..

Originally Posted by leaping_gnome View Post
Absolutely right that most modern shoes have soles that won't allow them to fit in the usual space with a clip and strap. I have two "modern" shoes that do fit properly, with Look three bolt patterns. I have the Adidas Addistar and the Vittoria 1986. I use that same Yellow Jersey two-bolt cleat. The Vittoria 1986 actually came with a set of similar (to the Yellow Jersey) slotted cleats, right in the box. I find that the Yellow Jersey cleat has a slightly undersized slot that makes them more difficult to engage and dis-engage smoothly.
Maybe I should take at least one pedal w/clip back to the bike shop to see if I can make it fit. That slot, I presume practical to re-size the slot with a file?
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Old 02-25-14, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by tiger1964 View Post
Originally Posted by rhm View Post
Yes, look on Ebay. You'll find them cheap.
Any idea on what they are called or what brand? To ease searching....
"pedal flip" was the second thing I tried, and it worked.
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Old 02-25-14, 08:05 AM
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Originally Posted by tiger1964 View Post
Maybe I should take at least one pedal w/clip back to the bike shop to see if I can make it fit. That slot, I presume practical to re-size the slot with a file?
The plastic that those cleats are made from doesn't take kindly to a file. At least in my experience. Maybe someone has a better technique?
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Old 02-25-14, 10:20 AM
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I have tried the Yellow Jesey 3 bolt cleats. They work fine, but after having used a floating cleat for the past 25 years, it was a bit rough on the knees.

I therefore present you with this.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/River...3#!/CorsaCleat
A 3 bolt slotted cleat with float. My friend is making the prototype, and we all used them at L'Eroica in 2013. All I can say is that they were amazing.
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Old 02-25-14, 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Bikegeek1968 View Post
....I therefore present you with this.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/River...3#!/CorsaCleat
A 3 bolt slotted cleat with float. My friend is making the prototype, and we all used them at L'Eroica in 2013. All I can say is that they were amazing.
Now that's a great idea.
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Old 02-25-14, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by rhm View Post
"pedal flip" was the second thing I tried, and it worked.
MKS still makes them, so if eBay isn't your thing, your LBS could probably order a set for you:

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Old 02-25-14, 10:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Bikegeek1968 View Post
I have tried the Yellow Jesey 3 bolt cleats. They work fine, but after having used a floating cleat for the past 25 years, it was a bit rough on the knees.

I therefore present you with this.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/River...3#!/CorsaCleat
A 3 bolt slotted cleat with float. My friend is making the prototype, and we all used them at L'Eroica in 2013. All I can say is that they were amazing.
Interesting idea. I've never needed float (yet!), but these certainly look like they'd do the trick.
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Old 02-25-14, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnDThompson View Post
Interesting idea. I've never needed float (yet!), but these certainly look like they'd do the trick.
The guy is a great mechanical engineer, and he has been building the proto's by hand. Each one is machined out of aluminum and some sort of high density nylon. Once the shape is finalized the nylon portion will be made from a mold, the aluminum slot will still be machined. I'll have to check what his timeline is for a full production run. I know things slowed down a bit after we got back from Italy.

As for the ride quality, it feels like you are on a modern floating pedal. The pivot point if well placed, and the toe strap sort of acts like a centering spring. As other members have mentioned, modern shoes have a higher stack height and toe box volume, so you really need to find some extra large clips, and you even have to bend them a bit to fit around your shoe. I used some XXL MKS clips. If the tip of your shoe is touching the front of your toe clips, you will shread the shoe due to the pivoting motion the cleat allows, so keep that in mind. Those are really the only drawbacks. The ride and ease of use were outstanding.
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Old 02-25-14, 11:42 AM
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Nice project on the floating cleats. Keep us posted.
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Old 02-25-14, 06:54 PM
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I probably have a set or two of the metal Anquetil cleats still in the plastic bag. PM if that's of any interest to you.
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Old 02-25-14, 07:07 PM
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TA Anquetil cleats at Boulder Bicycle - $15 for 5 sets!

http://www.renehersestore.com/servle...l--dsh-/Detail

Brent
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Old 02-26-14, 10:06 AM
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Great feedback, all, thanks! And Amazon has that MKS item.
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Old 02-26-14, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by tiger1964 View Post
OK, I promise this is the year I start riding more -- a lot more.
Where are you in MD? PM me and let's do some riding.
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Old 02-26-14, 11:58 AM
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I wonder if he tried fabricating a version with the floating, slotted part of the cleat in plastic (UHMW?) and not aluminum. I think some would like that if they are worried about wear rates on their pedal cages (especially pedals with aluminum cages) that might result with this first version....
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Old 02-26-14, 12:42 PM
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A friend of mine made cleats for himself just by putting Shoe Goo on the soles of his shoes. He made the slots with his pedals.
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Old 02-27-14, 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Chombi View Post
I wonder if he tried fabricating a version with the floating, slotted part of the cleat in plastic (UHMW?) and not aluminum. I think some would like that if they are worried about wear rates on their pedal cages (especially pedals with aluminum cages) that might result with this first version....
He tried various plastics and nylon, but they did not work for various reasons. Believe me, I rode several of the plastic protoypes. Since the back portion of the floating piece is not supported by a bolt or shoe, aliminum or brass were the only materials that worked. The machined aluminum slot actually has a slight V shape to it, so it sort of locks on to the pedal. They don't move back and forth like a nylon cleat at all. I used them on Campy ultralights and they barely scuffed the black anodizing after a whole summer of riding.
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Old 02-28-14, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Bikegeek1968 View Post
I have tried the Yellow Jesey 3 bolt cleats. They work fine, but after having used a floating cleat for the past 25 years, it was a bit rough on the knees.

I therefore present you with this.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/River...3#!/CorsaCleat
A 3 bolt slotted cleat with float. My friend is making the prototype, and we all used them at L'Eroica in 2013. All I can say is that they were amazing.
I outed this on Classic Rendezvous. There seems to be some interest, but your friend is unreachable. Is there any contact info I can pass along?
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