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126mm cassette hubs - rather nubie-like questions

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126mm cassette hubs - rather nubie-like questions

Old 03-04-14, 07:53 PM
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LeicaLad 
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126mm cassette hubs - rather nubie-like questions

First, a gratuitous photo of a nice hubset.



Okay, as a true Rip van Winkle, my bikes have been freewheel based. I also seem to attract nice hubs, as I now have too many. Somehow, as I have several bikes spaced at 126mm. I have impulse collected several 126mm cassette hubsets. SO, I have a couple dumb questions about the cassettes, ‘cause I have almost no experience with them.

This regards mostly the Shimano 105SC series hubs, as in the photo above. I have two sets. That says I should build one sooner rather than later. SO, now to choose a cassette that I can use. The 105SC is HG compatible.

Thus, the dumb question. The 105SC at 126mm will apparently take either 6 or 7 speed cassettes, depending on the spacers. Will ANY HG cassette, including the many more recent HG-20/30/50/70/90 series, fit if it has the correct 6 or 7 speed spacers? What is the difference between all these different HG series, beyond color? I assume the lowest end is made from pot metal, and the most expensive are titanium. What is the happy medium, if these work?

I do understand that the recent cogs meant for 9, 10, 11, and more are NOT under consideration. This would be, generally speaking, 8-speed cogs and below, I believe. y/n?

Among those, are all HG cassette cog sets essentially equal?

I’ll be wanting to build a rather wide spread, say 13-32, although 13-28 is fine, too. The question is about sourcing good cassette sets.

What production run of HG cogs would be the optimum match for the hubs above?

Any attempts, futile or otherwise, to educate me will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.
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1971 Gitane Tour de France (The War Horse) (1 owner)
* 1971 Gitane Super Corsa (The Garage Queen) (crashed out)
1971 Gitane Super Corsa #2 (sweet replacement frame)
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Old 03-04-14, 08:11 PM
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Well these are somewhat obsolete screw cog locking hubs meaning the outer cog screws on to lock the other cogs in place. So modern type cassettes and parts wont really work you will need to find a matching vintage casstte for these hubs.
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Old 03-04-14, 08:15 PM
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Ah. And how does one tell them apart?

And do I understand this rules out the HG-XX series that are often up for auction?
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1959 Hilton Wrigley Connoisseur (still my favorite!)
1963 Hetchins Mountain King (the gravel grinder)
1971 Gitane Tour de France (The War Horse) (1 owner)
* 1971 Gitane Super Corsa (The Garage Queen) (crashed out)
1971 Gitane Super Corsa #2 (sweet replacement frame)
1980 Ritchey Touring (The Grail Bike)
1984 Tom Ritchey Team Competition (NOS show bike)
(replacing the stolen 1981 Tom Ritchey Everest custom)
1985 ALAN Record (Glued & Screwed. A gift.)

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Old 03-04-14, 08:21 PM
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Or, what is a vintage cassette, if it is HG?

Is a "Shimano Deore 7-Speed Hyperglide HG Cassette CS-HG50" vintage?
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1959 Hilton Wrigley Connoisseur (still my favorite!)
1963 Hetchins Mountain King (the gravel grinder)
1971 Gitane Tour de France (The War Horse) (1 owner)
* 1971 Gitane Super Corsa (The Garage Queen) (crashed out)
1971 Gitane Super Corsa #2 (sweet replacement frame)
1980 Ritchey Touring (The Grail Bike)
1984 Tom Ritchey Team Competition (NOS show bike)
(replacing the stolen 1981 Tom Ritchey Everest custom)
1985 ALAN Record (Glued & Screwed. A gift.)

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Old 03-04-14, 08:24 PM
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Those hubs, if HG compatible are a hybrid design. Some of the 1st HG hubs were UG compatible also. There should be threads on the inner surface of the end of the freehub, which you would screw your cassette lockring into. I have a set of XT hubs like that. As for HG cassettes, I think you would be fine with any of the modern 7 speed cassettes from Shimano or Sram. If there is a single large spline on the freehub you'll be all set with modern cassettes.
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Old 03-05-14, 01:24 AM
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Actually, are they HG hubs at all, or are they still UG? I seem to recall that HG came in with the 8sp 1056 hubs, and had a slightly different cassette body, black (instead of bronze), with a small groove that ran around the circumference of the shell, at about halfway down its length:



These hubs will indeed also run UG (and 9sp cassettes, just like the 6402 hubs). I can't remember just offhand if they were already 130mm though, rather than 126; it seems like they were.

I suppose you could use HG (8sp + cogs) to build a 6 or 7sp cassette, with the right spacers, but I agree with Likebike23: unless you have a need for specific gear ratios, why not just use a modern HG 7sp cassette? It'd probably save you a lot of headaches.
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Old 03-05-14, 02:28 AM
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Nice new set of 1055 series hubs! They spin buttery smooth.

What you have there is Shimano's transitional freehub body. It has threads to be backwards compatible with Uniglide cassettes. But is splined and internally threaded for HG cassettes It is meant for 7 speed cassettes. The 6 speed Uniglide bodies are shorter. If you plan to run 6 speed, then a spacer is required.

You can install any STANDARD 7 speed HG cassette. That means no HG-C cassettes with the smaller 11t cog. Since you wish to use a 13t small cog, it's not an issue.
7 speed HG cassettes are still available, and I bet you can find one to suit your needs. Otherwise, you can stack your own combo. It's pretty simple to do, just grind the ends off the pins holding a cassette together.

You mentioned 8 speed cassettes...those require a freehub body which are 4.5mm longer. 8/9/10 speed fit one these bodies.
The 105SC did get one of these and went to 130mm for its last revision.
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Old 03-05-14, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by WNG View Post

You can install any STANDARD 7 speed HG cassette. That means no HG-C cassettes with the smaller 11t cog. Since you wish to use a 13t small cog, it's not an issue.

7 speed HG cassettes are still available, and I bet you can find one to suit your needs. Otherwise, you can stack your own combo. It's pretty simple to do, just grind the ends off the pins holding a cassette together.

The 105SC did get one of these and went to 130mm for its last revision.

Thank you. I believe this is what I needed to understand. First, that a current 7-speed HG cassette will work.

I have been told that the 1056 was the 130 version. The 1055 was the 126 version. I'm happy to have the 126 version(s).

Final question, is there difference to speak of between the HG-20 / HG-50 / etc. model numbers? It seems that new (nos?) Standard 7-speed cassettes come in these different models. I see variation in color. Anything else?

I think I'll be fine with a 14-28 cassette, and I'll just use a 13t threaded lock cog to get the high end I'd like.

I do appreciate the help.

Thank you, again.
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1959 Hilton Wrigley Connoisseur (still my favorite!)
1963 Hetchins Mountain King (the gravel grinder)
1971 Gitane Tour de France (The War Horse) (1 owner)
* 1971 Gitane Super Corsa (The Garage Queen) (crashed out)
1971 Gitane Super Corsa #2 (sweet replacement frame)
1980 Ritchey Touring (The Grail Bike)
1984 Tom Ritchey Team Competition (NOS show bike)
(replacing the stolen 1981 Tom Ritchey Everest custom)
1985 ALAN Record (Glued & Screwed. A gift.)

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Old 03-05-14, 09:46 AM
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Look on the end to see if it has the internal threads for a HG lock ring.
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Old 03-05-14, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by LeicaLad View Post
Final question, is there difference to speak of between the HG-20 / HG-50 / etc. model numbers? It seems that new (nos?) Standard 7-speed cassettes come in these different models. I see variation in color. Anything else?
The notable differences with Shimano's cassettes as you go up, are finish, weight, and finally material. I haven't found much performance difference between the entry up to mid level. The lower end usually come with an oxide finish, powdercoating, and the cogs are less finished (ie. more material, sharp edges). As you go up in number, for example an HG50, the cogs are lightened, more material is machined off, holes are drilled or forged to remove more weight. And they are chrome-plated.
IMHO, HG50 is the best compromise for the price. Nice finish, lighter, wears well, not costly. The higher models now reduce weight by using aluminum carriers that rivet 2-3 cogs together, resembling chainrings more than cogs. (Ultegra level), and top end uses titanium cogs mated to the carriers (DA/XTR).

I also like using SRAM cassettes, which come chrome plated and lightened like the HG50 and better models, but lower priced. But not sure if they offer 7 speed anymore.
Taiwanese Epoch, and Sunrace made HG-spec cassettes with a 13t high and chromed.

And it's my pleasure to help in any way. A C&V Forum tradition.
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Old 03-05-14, 11:07 AM
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And it is a great tradition. I do my best to contribute when if falls within my knowledge spectrum. These hubs are just outside my bandwidth. It was all those years spent in deepest, darkest Asia.

Thanks for those specific tips. I like the middle ground for the improved quality, but certainly don't need the titanium end.

Thanks, again, to each who responded.
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1959 Hilton Wrigley Connoisseur (still my favorite!)
1963 Hetchins Mountain King (the gravel grinder)
1971 Gitane Tour de France (The War Horse) (1 owner)
* 1971 Gitane Super Corsa (The Garage Queen) (crashed out)
1971 Gitane Super Corsa #2 (sweet replacement frame)
1980 Ritchey Touring (The Grail Bike)
1984 Tom Ritchey Team Competition (NOS show bike)
(replacing the stolen 1981 Tom Ritchey Everest custom)
1985 ALAN Record (Glued & Screwed. A gift.)

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Old 03-05-14, 11:39 AM
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These cassettes seem to have the most available gear ratios, and the price isn't too bad:https://www.universalcycles.com/shopp...30&category=42. I personally like running SRAM chains like the PC-850. It shifts great, last a long time, and has a nice connector link (no stinkin' pins like Shimano). Good luck.
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Old 03-05-14, 09:57 PM
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+ 1 for the SRAM chains.
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Old 03-06-14, 09:23 AM
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I am a fan of the SRAM chains, too. PC-850 is another excellent "middle ground" choice.
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1959 Hilton Wrigley Connoisseur (still my favorite!)
1963 Hetchins Mountain King (the gravel grinder)
1971 Gitane Tour de France (The War Horse) (1 owner)
* 1971 Gitane Super Corsa (The Garage Queen) (crashed out)
1971 Gitane Super Corsa #2 (sweet replacement frame)
1980 Ritchey Touring (The Grail Bike)
1984 Tom Ritchey Team Competition (NOS show bike)
(replacing the stolen 1981 Tom Ritchey Everest custom)
1985 ALAN Record (Glued & Screwed. A gift.)

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Old 03-06-14, 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by WNG View Post
The notable differences with Shimano's cassettes as you go up, are finish, weight, and finally material. I haven't found much performance difference between the entry up to mid level. The lower end usually come with an oxide finish, powdercoating, and the cogs are less finished (ie. more material, sharp edges). As you go up in number, for example an HG50, the cogs are lightened, more material is machined off, holes are drilled or forged to remove more weight. And they are chrome-plated.
IMHO, HG50 is the best compromise for the price. Nice finish, lighter, wears well, not costly. The higher models now reduce weight by using aluminum carriers that rivet 2-3 cogs together, resembling chainrings more than cogs. (Ultegra level), and top end uses titanium cogs mated to the carriers (DA/XTR).

I also like using SRAM cassettes, which come chrome plated and lightened like the HG50 and better models, but lower priced. But not sure if they offer 7 speed anymore.
Taiwanese Epoch, and Sunrace made HG-spec cassettes with a 13t high and chromed.

And it's my pleasure to help in any way. A C&V Forum tradition.
the HG20 is another fine example and is my 7sp choice for the Cannondale build I'm doing.
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Old 03-06-14, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by LeicaLad View Post
The question is about sourcing good cassette sets.
I recently bought two 7sp HG50 cassettes from Niagara Cycle at https://www.niagaracycle.com . I got them from there because they had the two sizes that I wanted, 12-21 and 13-30, and I couldn't find any other place that had 12-21.
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