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Take a peek at 2019 NAHBS and the Campy booth with a Della Santa made LeMond.
(scroll down in link) https://m.pinkbike.com/news/orth-ame...show-2019.html https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...64b1d3fd74.jpg https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...aebabcd52e.jpg https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c9c7ac6164.jpg |
Originally Posted by nlerner
(Post 20839203)
I really like riding my '97 Lemond Buenos Aires. I bought it for cheap on local CL, converted it to 650B x 38mm wheels w/ some homebrew chainstay dimpling, set it up with a Shimergo drivetrain and just have ridden the heck out of it in the last several years. One problem at the start, which might be getting worse, is that there might be a crack on the downtube coming from the water bottle braze ons. Here are a couple of photos from both sides, taken a couple of months ago:
I don't know how deep that crack goes or if it's propagated over the time I've had the bike, but now at least I have these pics for reference. I also picked up a Lemond Zurich frameset from around the same year, and the plan is to move all the component over to the Zurich when/if the Buenos Aires experiences catastrophic failure. Ben |
Originally Posted by verktyg
(Post 20838614)
Many of the Italian made Billato Lemonds imported into the US were painted by Ten Speed Drive Imports down in Florida. A woman named Sue supposedly painted a lot of those frames. BTW, the Della Santa built TeamZ frames had dark blue on top, yellow in the middle and red on the bottom. verktyg :50: |
Originally Posted by shoff535
(Post 20842198)
I have a ~'93 Bilato from TSDI, TSX tubing, delta brakes and currently running campy chorus 9sp. Easily one of the nicer riding bikes that I have, though I think I like my CIOCC a bit better... but that could be because it "fits" a bit betterhttps://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...ca6d0ae276.jpg
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Originally Posted by jamesdak
(Post 20842210)
Nice, is that a repaint?
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Originally Posted by shoff535
(Post 20842225)
No, AFAIK it's original. including the TSDI s/n sticker
My TSX Maillot Jaune is single blue color. |
I own a 2002 Maillot Jaune. I don't think I would consider it a classic or vintage but it is a nice ride. I bought two frames for $25. I sold one for $100 and built the other one up mostly with parts I had. I have next to nothing into it.
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...618169c7ac.jpg https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...27a1af0d4d.jpg |
One of the biggest regrets was selling my Lemond Buenos Aires. Some dude get a sweet deal back in the day when my knowledge of bikes was limited. But, the bike gods have repaid many times over with good deals.....so I guess I cannot complain.
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Originally Posted by verktyg
(Post 20838614)
James, there's one more calling your name. It needs love too. :love:
My 1991 Greg Lemond 56cm TeamZ Billato built bike with a 1991 9 Speed Campy C-Record gruppo, Delta brakes and a Columbus TSX frame.. https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c026fc6e6f.jpg Many of the Italian made Billato Lemonds imported into the US were painted by Ten Speed Drive Imports down in Florida. A woman named Sue supposedly painted a lot of those frames. BTW, the Della Santa built TeamZ frames had dark blue on top, yellow in the middle and red on the bottom. https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...4b499a5866.jpg verktyg :50: |
Yes, I really did lock up my Lemond Titanium at work. It was a safe place, and nothing happened.
I need to take new pictures, as it now has 650b wheels on it. https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/ph...w1998-h1498-no |
Originally Posted by shoff535
(Post 20844721)
This raises an interesting question for me. How does one tell the difference between a Della Santa frame and a Bilato? According to some of the comments the Bilatos were painted with red on top and blue on bottom, whereas the Della Santa were blue on top with a smidgen of red on bottom. I always assumed mine was a Bilato but for no real definitive reason (other than it was imported by TSDI). Would s/n indicate, and ... based on my s/n 070435, or the TSDI s/n 05743 any thoughts on the build date?
So, being pics always make the post better, here is a quick and dirty shot of the underside of the brake bridge and on the right side you can make out SLVA....mystery solved! https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...0cb1c8ff82.jpg |
Originally Posted by shoff535
(Post 20845842)
Well, I think I have the answer to my own question. I contacted the guy that I got my bike from and he said that under the rear brake bridge it's stamped SLVA for Silvano Billato.He was the son and he did the brazing on those and other bike frames. He said that AFAHK Roland built the actual team bikes (Z team) and those can be distinguished by the race number holder hanging on the bottom of the top tube. He also said that at TSDI the color pattern varied from year to year with the blue on top transitioning though yellow and red on the bottom was indicative of the later years.
So, being pics always make the post better, here is a quick and dirty shot of the underside of the brake bridge and on the right side you can make out SLVA....mystery solved! https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...0cb1c8ff82.jpg The stamp on the brake bridge being attributed to Silvano is a story that's been going on for years. It's actually a manufacturer of braze on parts for steel bikes. It's a cool story though and one you see over and over on here. Now I'd love a Della Santa bike too but I've got 6 Billato built bikes (3 Lemonds & 3 Giordana's) and they give up nothing in quality or ride feel to any of the bikes in my collection. Everyone one I own rides like a dream and I'm sure yours is a masterful ride out on the road. |
I had a Lemond Zurich sadly it was a 54 and felt small to me so I sold the frame to another gent.
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...32ee173a3e.jpg |
Originally Posted by jamesdak
(Post 20845914)
LOL, not really but. First off if you look closely at the Della Santa one posted earlier and then yours you'll see some detail differences. Your's did throw me at first because of the color.
The stamp on the brake bridge being attributed to Silvano is a story that's been going on for years. It's actually a manufacturer of braze on parts for steel bikes. It's a cool story though and one you see over and over on here. Now I'd love a Della Santa bike too but I've got 6 Billato built bikes (3 Lemonds & 3 Giordana's) and they give up nothing in quality or ride feel to any of the bikes in my collection. Everyone one I own rides like a dream and I'm sure yours is a masterful ride out on the road. I did notice the tag hanger and the absence of the pump peg on the DS, what threw me was looking at the current DS website on their restoration/ID section and they had a shot of the bottom of their BB and I saw the double cut-out which is similar to the triple cutout on the bottom of my bike. Yes, mine does ride like a dream very stable and confidence inspiring especially on steep descents. |
Della Santa BB
Originally Posted by shoff535
(Post 20844721)
This raises an interesting question for me. How does one tell the difference between a Della Santa frame and a Bilato? According to some of the comments the Bilatos were painted with red on top and blue on bottom, whereas the Della Santa were blue on top with a smidgen of red on bottom. I always assumed mine was a Bilato but for no real definitive reason (other than it was imported by TSDI). Would s/n indicate, and ... based on my s/n 070435, or the TSDI s/n 05743 any thoughts on the build date?
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...d325e1abf3.jpg [MENTION=203117]jamesdak[/MENTION] Silva brake bridge used by many builders. I too posted that misinformation about the SILVA stamped into the underside before someone corrected me. https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...5bb683450a.jpg https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...5de9f28794.jpg https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...d46c41fe3c.jpg Any frame that went through Ten Speed Drive Imports was almost certainly made by Billato. There were some mumblings about Greg Lemond's father Bob had some frames built by one or two other builders before they settled on Billato to produce their retail frames which were marketed through TSDI. The colors were most likely chosen by Lemond and or TeamZ so it didn't matter who built the frame. Since most of the Lemond commercial frames were reputed to have been painted in the US, it's easy to see how an early TSDI TeamZ frame could have been painted in the original Della Santa colors. Lemond in the 1990 TdF on a TVT? carbon frame painted in the Della Santa colors. https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...7e59f12637.jpg TeamZ members on red, yellow, light blue frames. https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...b00e6d3c51.jpg https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...927d8d617c.jpg https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1347a5386c.jpg https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c197959c74.jpg verktyg :50: |
What the heck. I have never seen chainstays like that. Anyone know more? Was this something Della Santa did? This had to be a one-off, right?
Originally Posted by crank_addict
(Post 20841509)
Take a peek at 2019 NAHBS and the Campy booth with a Della Santa made LeMond.
(scroll down in link) https://m.pinkbike.com/news/orth-ame...show-2019.html https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...64b1d3fd74.jpg https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...aebabcd52e.jpg https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c9c7ac6164.jpg |
Originally Posted by jyl
(Post 20846554)
What the heck. I have never seen chainstays like that. Anyone know more? Was this something Della Santa did? This had to be a one-off, right? Della Santa Osso Buco |
I love how Calfee cleverly snipped out the "Greg LeMond" decals on this contract frame to promote themselves.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Ut...Q=w539-h758-no https://www.merlincycles.com/blog/wp...reg-lemond.jpg |
Originally Posted by shoff535
(Post 20844721)
This raises an interesting question for me. How does one tell the difference between a Della Santa frame and a Bilato? According to some of the comments the Bilatos were painted with red on top and blue on bottom, whereas the Della Santa were blue on top with a smidgen of red on bottom. I always assumed mine was a Bilato but for no real definitive reason (other than it was imported by TSDI). Would s/n indicate, and ... based on my s/n 070435, or the TSDI s/n 05743 any thoughts on the build date?https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...d0f09c430b.jpg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...88ed79462f.jpg |
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Hello, Great read!
I need another bike like you know what but I am looking at an early Lemond in a week or so....If they are both built in Italy whats the main difference between Della Santa and Billato build, is one more desirable than the other? Why? Whats the fair market if clean ( yes I know no pics)? Best, Ben |
Originally Posted by xiaoman1
(Post 20848607)
Hello, Great read!
I need another bike like you know what but I am looking at an early Lemond in a week or so....If they are both built in Italy whats the main difference between Della Santa and Billato build, is one more desirable than the other? Why? Whats the fair market if clean ( yes I know no pics)? Best, Ben |
Della Santa built quite a few frames for Lemond up through about 1990-91. He and the Lemond clan embarked on a joint venture to produce Lemond branded frames and complete bikes in Reno, NV. Just as Della Santa was ramping up for production the deal fell through.
As I mentioned above, there were reputed to be 1 or 2 other European builders before Billato that produced some of the Lemond frames for sale in the US. (I've never seen one of those frames) BTW, Billato built frames for a lot of European teams including some of the PDM Concord ones so that could be how Lemond and Billato connected. verktyg :50: |
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...dbebb4b01c.jpg
The Team Lemond were the earliest and not built by Billato. They were built by Carnielli or at least the Comp and Team models were. Most of the Pro models are attributed to Della Santa. |
Here is my Lemond. I purchased this out of Reno. The seller was a nice guy that said this was owned by a local rider since new. He was a shop owner and was around when these bikes were sold new. He called this a 1988 Lemond Professional, although it only says Lemond on the frame. It is after the Team Lemond name was used, but still carries the same color scheme. It was said to be made by Scapin. I've read that Scapin did make some Lemond frames, but never found any way to identify it as such. I have seen similar seat stay caps on a Scapin frame though. The lugs are stamped with the Cinelli logo. This is pretty much full Campagnolo Super Record. Brake levers were said to be swapped for an aero model. There is some white touch up paint on the frame including a good bit of the bottom bracket. I don't see a serial number, but the touch up is thick on parts of the bottom bracket. I just took these pics in my garage. They are not the greatest quality, but any input would be helpful.
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...6f6fc2890b.jpg https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...bcb70c3a1f.jpg https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2078c5526e.jpg https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...3b5e9a67b5.jpg https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1a19ba47f0.jpg |
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