Factors that affect saddle tilt?
 

As noted I this lengthy post,
http://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vi...sh-ending.html

I just built up my Schwinn Paramount with a new Brooks Pro. Having read in various places that many people find they need to have the Brooks nose angled upward, I was not surprised to discover same thing, even though my plastic saddles are all level, although I am surprised at how significant the upward tilt is. I have a second bike, with a shallower seat tube angle but more seat-handlebar drop where the upward tilt of the leather saddle is considerably less. In addition, when riding in a more aggressive position-- in drops or on hoods --the saddle feels right as pictured, but if I sit up almost straight, soft pedaling with hands on top of bar or no-handed, I feel like I could use even more upward tilt. So I am sort of curious about what factors folks have found effect leather saddle angle.

Your personal comfort decides. That is a pretty extreme upward tilt though. I'd do some longer rides, 30 miles or so, to assess the tilt.

Factors - how your pelvis is built, how much soft tissue and where, preference for riding position, tension of the saddle.

Whether you plan to have children.

A big factor is how much your slide your butt forward or backward as the terrain changes. If your butt is planted in one position on the saddle all the time, then a slight upward tilt is OK. If you like to slide backwards and forwards to use different muscles at different times, then a more level or even very slightly downward tilt is common.

Also having to tilt a saddle to somewhat extreme angels for comfort usually indicates a worn out or bad saddle choice to small or too big. A good saddle should feel comfy and nice with a good deal of support at the basically correct horizontal angel.

Reach can be a big contributor, I'd try setting the saddle as far back as possible and lowing the height a hair to compensate for the extra setback.

I have unusually long arms and legs (and feet) for a six-footer, and my saddles all tilt nose down just a bit. How much depends on the shape of the saddle. My top tubes are all between 57.5 and 60.5 cm, with seat tubes between 61 and 65cm. Each one of these bikes is set so I could ride it a century in pretty decent comfort.

Just my one data point. :)

Everyone fits a little different.

Agreed. Your grandkids may feel it.

I noted it in your other thread but didn't want to say it. Saddle adjustment is a personal thing.
But, yours is quite far forward too. I would move it back a bit and tilt the nose up just above
horizontal, and start from there.

Its not a comfort thing, in sense of pressure on soft tissue (with either nose down or up) and the saddle is brand new. With both the new saddle and an older one, with saddle set toward level,I feel pitched forward and at risk of sliding toward the front of the bike. Rode 40 miles and felt great on Sunday so I guess I'll keep it there. I had it on a different bike briefly with a slightly shallower seat tube (73 vs 74 on current bike), and it seemed to require saddle be a bit more toward level, although still nose up. As for size, I suppose that could be a factor, but based on my thumbnail sitz bones measurement and preferred riding style, the Brooks Pro seemed about right as compared to the wider B17 and narrower swift.

FWIW, while googling around for I for on the subject, I came across a thread referencing this and other shots of Sheldon Brown bikes with up tipped Brooks saddles. So I guess I am not the only one. it does look weird, though.

A new Brooks Pro can be quite slippery, too.

Agree, newer saddles have you sliding quite a bit more than when they are broken in. Setting a belt or brooks dead flat for break in seems to make it take longer since you don't find a point to "divot" quite as quickly, and being a little slippery also doesn't help settling into a single spot.

With a new to me belt, I usually put the front up a bit more than normal. It lets my sit bones divot the seat (takes a while). Then I'll flatten it out just a bit to allow me to use multiple saddle positions when needed. The divots are still there to do most the riding on, but I have more options for sliding to the front if I want to do a "hammy climb" when the quads are toasted.

I've thought about this a lot, largely because I tilt my saddles in a relatively severe nose-down orientation - enough to make many people cringe.
I used to ride with the saddle just slightly tilted, but now I find I like more downward tilt for several reasons:

1) riding the drops mostly, always pedaling with the foot fully extended, shoulders down, derriere up.
2) using the saddle more as a balance point than a "seat"
3) counteracting rearward forces from mashing
3) the curve of the saddle
4) the size of the bike
5) individual anatomy

It adds up to personal preference, based on how you ride, what you ride, how you pedal, and your own skeleton.

This is sound advise. Right now you are right on top of the BB.

I don't know how much of this has been studied 'scientifically.' I have only vague impressions and suspicions based on personal experience. Based on that, I'm thinking there must be something about the shape of the sit bones, as well as the various factors already discussed. It's commonly observed that ideal saddle width is related to saddle-to-handlebar drop; that is, if you like your handlebar much lower than your saddle, you'll want a narrower saddle. This is partly due, I think, to the way the pelvis is tilted forward.

But anatomy is not the only factor. The lower your handlebar, the more of your weight is supported by your arms. If you're accustomed to supporting much of your weight on your arms and you take your hands off the bar, the redistribution of weight is going to pull your pelvis forward and off the saddle; so you tilt the saddle to offset this.

Taking all this together, I wonder: if you prefer your saddle pointed downward, shouldn't you perhaps be riding a narrower saddle? If you have your saddle pointed severely upward, perhaps you should get a slightly wider one?

Fore/aft positioning of the saddle relative to the pedals, and fore/aft positioning of the handlebar, are of course related factors that I am consciously ignoring at the moment.

Yes, that might be the case that the saddle is too far forward. To really comment one has to see the rider on the bike, and pedaling. Best on a trainer where the trainer is adjusted to get the bike at road level, many do not.
Sometimes it is easy to see what is going on without the rider.
With this bike, there is decent drop from the saddle to the bars. To the point where the rider will probably refer the tops or the hoods as a typical hands position. Not a bad thing at all. If the rider is cramped between the saddle and the bars I could see the saddle being angled to compensate, even the other extreme, angled up to prevent creeping forward.

It was mentioned that other saddles are different. Some are not built for a leather Brooks.

Final thought, even if you set all your saddles to the same setback from the bottom bracket, if the saddles are not all the same make and model, you will not necessarily be in the same position. There are no C&V saddle standards. (There are now some UCI saddle standards, and one is the saddle is to be essentially level)

+1 indeed
Different set-up and fitting on a new generation compact frame vs. classics. Of course its all subjective but there's definitely a different 'base set-up' for body position between generations.

This is a good guideline:
Setup | Selle Anatomica

I have a 40 year old Brooks Pro that is my go to saddle. It is nearly flat for best comfort. On my other bikes, I have tried a number of different saddles based on what was available. None are as comfortable so I started looking for more Brooks saddles. I have have a Pro with large rivits which I don't like as well because I can feel them and a brand new Swift which is not broken in. The Flite is also used with it flat but I can only last about 30 miles on it. I have no idea how long the old brooks is good for.

My other issue is with the post, a Campy SR. It is up against the stop and the saddle is flat! Has anyone else run into the same issue? This is on my Colnago Superissimo so the ST is not exactly relaxed!

May I quote you? I could have written this ...

In the OP's pic, is that the correct seat post cradle pitch for that frame? If so and a mid-1980's, my guess it was originally fitted with a saddle having a plastic sub-base. With the new saddle I probably would swap the post for something with a micro tilt adjustability.

Not a bad saddle set up guide, leaves out quite a bit where a fitter might look at other issues, but for a cyclist not looking to win races, good enough.

Yup! I was riding the tandem with some modern Bontrager saddle that came with the Pinarello. Thought, hey its new it has to be as good as that old sh..... Epic fail! Replaced it with the Brooks. an Ahhhhhhh ride.

I agree that having my Brooks Swift titled slightly upwards helps in the comfort zone!

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=374855

So video does bear out some up tilt for selle saddles. I played around a bit with set back ( not much since Brooks rails permit so little fore-aft movement) and saddle height per various recs and now have saddle closer to level thatn before -- more nose up than the 1/4 inch the video suggests as a staring point, but considerably less than it was before. Feels ok on the trainer but we'll see next time I go for ride.

If I am in the drops, my B-17 is good with upward tilt. If I'm on the horns or the bar tops, a flat setting is much better. On the other hand, my Belgian Lepper set at flat fits me in any position. Perhaps I should ride the B-17 for 5K miles and see if it evolves. Yea right ....!