Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

Japan rims sew ups

Old 01-11-15, 07:46 PM
  #1  
long john
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
long john's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: new york
Posts: 688

Bikes: cuevas

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Japan rims sew ups

Does any one know about these rims they are nos and seem to be filled with something. Worth using or not?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg
image.jpg (96.6 KB, 75 views)
long john is offline  
Old 01-11-15, 08:03 PM
  #2  
FBinNY 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: New Rochelle, NY
Posts: 36,019

Bikes: too many bikes from 1967 10s (5x2)Frejus to a Sumitomo Ti/Chorus aluminum 10s (10x2), plus one non-susp mtn bike I use as my commuter

Mentioned: 121 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4342 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Ukai was a decent quality rim maker, along side Araya, BITD. Thses may be either wood, or urathane plastic filled, but either way are built up the same way as wood filled rims. I remember building a set eons ago, and they were a bit squirrelly, but so were all light rims of the era.

Before building, insert nipples with spokes and see if there's any forward/back drilling in addition to the side to side angles. Filled rims don't allow rim float so you have to follow whatever pattern the drilling wants. You also want a nipple with more of "oval head" shape so they lie closer to the tire bed than a modern button head nipple would. (these are harder to find today, but vintage DT nipples are nice for this). Also check to see how far the nipple extends through the rim, odds are you'll want 12mm vs. 10mm nipples.

Lastly, no 14mm plain spokes. You want DB spokes, keeping the center gauges fairly light. Otherwise you'll need to move to more tension than these rims will like. (BITD, we built them with 15g DB spokes).

All in all, they can build into a very nice set of light tubular wheels, but not the ideal choice for a gorilla.
__________________
FB
Chain-L site

An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.

“Never argue with an idiot. He will only bring you down to his level and beat you with experience.”, George Carlin

“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN

WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
FBinNY is offline  
Old 01-12-15, 05:39 AM
  #3  
ScottRyder 
Senior Member
 
ScottRyder's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: The other Cape, Cape Ann
Posts: 3,036

Bikes: vintagefuji.posthaven.com

Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 43 Post(s)
Liked 5 Times in 4 Posts
Very nice rims, especially sought after by us Fuji freaks .. Standard on the early Newest and Finest models ....

Scott
ScottRyder is offline  
Old 01-12-15, 08:34 AM
  #4  
big chainring 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Wilmette, IL
Posts: 6,466
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 394 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 18 Times in 14 Posts
Are they wood filled rims?
big chainring is offline  
Old 01-12-15, 08:38 AM
  #5  
repechage
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 13,341
Mentioned: 77 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 936 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 13 Times in 11 Posts
Originally Posted by big chainring View Post
Are they wood filled rims?
No, plastic. Perhaps a foamed plastic. The Japanese Scheeren.
repechage is offline  
Old 01-12-15, 09:56 AM
  #6  
noglider 
aka Tom Reingold
 
noglider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: West Village, New York City
Posts: 37,091

Bikes: 1962 Rudge Sports, 1971 Raleigh Super Course, 1971 Raleigh Pro Track, 1973 Raleigh Twenty, 1974 Raleigh International, 1975 Viscount Fixie, 1982 McLean, 1996 Lemond (Ti), 2002 Burley Zydeco tandem

Mentioned: 420 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5388 Post(s)
Liked 91 Times in 70 Posts
Ukai rims were OK, not great. I have a pair of their clincher rims on one of my bikes. If the weight and price are good, buy them.
__________________
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog

“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author

Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
noglider is offline  
Old 01-12-15, 10:16 AM
  #7  
repechage
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 13,341
Mentioned: 77 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 936 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 13 Times in 11 Posts
Originally Posted by noglider View Post
Ukai rims were OK, not great. I have a pair of their clincher rims on one of my bikes. If the weight and price are good, buy them.
The tubular rims have little if anything in common with their clincher rims in my view. They are very good for a pista or 120mm spaced rear road wheel. The issue is that the spoke length must be calc'd very closely. The spoke head is at the tire seat, no protruding spokes allowed.
repechage is offline  
Old 01-12-15, 10:19 AM
  #8  
zonatandem
Senior Member
 
zonatandem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 11,019

Bikes: Custom Zona c/f tandem + Scott Plasma single

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 73 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Ukai rims were also on the first year Fuji Professional.
zonatandem is offline  
Old 01-12-15, 10:23 AM
  #9  
long john
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
long john's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: new york
Posts: 688

Bikes: cuevas

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by noglider View Post
Ukai rims were OK, not great. I have a pair of their clincher rims on one of my bikes. If the weight and price are good, buy them.
The price is right found it in my pile of nos rims I bought last year.
long john is offline  
Old 01-12-15, 11:12 AM
  #10  
FBinNY 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: New Rochelle, NY
Posts: 36,019

Bikes: too many bikes from 1967 10s (5x2)Frejus to a Sumitomo Ti/Chorus aluminum 10s (10x2), plus one non-susp mtn bike I use as my commuter

Mentioned: 121 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4342 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by repechage View Post
The tubular rims have little if anything in common with their clincher rims in my view. They are very good for a pista or 120mm spaced rear road wheel. The issue is that the spoke length must be calc'd very closely. The spoke head is at the tire seat, no protruding spokes allowed.
+1

Ukai, like just about all rim makers makes a range of rims which vary in type, purpose, quality and price. These were just about the top of the line and are a nice example of good rims of the period.

As I said earlier, these days the issue is finding appropriate nipples so you can build them properly. Odds are you'll need 12mm nipples, which may limit the working thread range down to as little as 2mm (ie. 8mm thread on the nipple, vs. 10mm on the spoke). You also want a wide low profile head, since the tire is bedding directly against it, those can be hard to come by, though you can file the heads slimmer (truly a PIA but doable quick with a power drill and/or a bench grinder)

IMO- The rims are fine, but the rest is more of PIA than I'm generally willing to put up with. These days the only way I'd bother building these is if I wanted a nice period piece to match a vintage or otherwise special bike.
__________________
FB
Chain-L site

An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.

“Never argue with an idiot. He will only bring you down to his level and beat you with experience.”, George Carlin

“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN

WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
FBinNY is offline  
Old 01-12-15, 11:23 AM
  #11  
long john
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
long john's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: new york
Posts: 688

Bikes: cuevas

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Spokes and nipple

Originally Posted by FBinNY View Post
+1

Ukai, like just about all rim makers makes a range of rims which vary in type, purpose, quality and price. These were just about the top of the line and are a nice example of good rims of the period.

As I said earlier, these days the issue is finding appropriate nipples so you can build them properly. Odds are you'll need 12mm nipples, which may limit the working thread range down to as little as 2mm (ie. 8mm thread on the nipple, vs. 10mm on the spoke). You also want a wide low profile head, since the tire is bedding directly against it, those can be hard to come by, though you can file the heads slimmer (truly a PIA but doable quick with a power drill and/or a bench grinder)

IMO- The rims are fine, but the rest is more of PIA than I'm generally willing to put up with. These days the only way I'd bother building these is if I wanted a nice period piece to match a vintage or otherwise special bike.
I'll look around in my box of spokes I have about 30 lbs of spokes and nipples of which I have cataloged. Many of which are junk galinized. But many SS and I have a hozen spoke cutter.
For period correct prolly use sunshine shaneshine hubs maybe the pro model?
long john is offline  
Old 01-12-15, 11:27 AM
  #12  
FBinNY 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: New Rochelle, NY
Posts: 36,019

Bikes: too many bikes from 1967 10s (5x2)Frejus to a Sumitomo Ti/Chorus aluminum 10s (10x2), plus one non-susp mtn bike I use as my commuter

Mentioned: 121 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4342 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Yes, SanShin pro hubs would be a nice match. Don't forget to use reasonably light spokes. The max tension on these is limited compared to modern rims.
__________________
FB
Chain-L site

An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.

“Never argue with an idiot. He will only bring you down to his level and beat you with experience.”, George Carlin

“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN

WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
FBinNY is offline  
Old 01-12-15, 04:29 PM
  #13  
long john
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
long john's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: new york
Posts: 688

Bikes: cuevas

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Found the hubs I'll look for spokes another day. Thanks for the advice fbn in ny
Attached Images
File Type: jpg
image.jpg (94.4 KB, 24 views)
long john is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
merlinextraligh
"The 33"-Road Bike Racing
10
03-04-09 04:43 PM
patentcad
Road Cycling
82
01-30-08 04:03 PM
littledjahn
Road Cycling
5
11-02-07 09:00 PM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.