Steel or carbon? Rivendell philosophy or??
 

Looking for some helpful guidance and tips... here's my situation...

A) I'm 56, 6'-2" and 255, in pretty good shape w/no limitations physically.

B) I've been riding a '83 Trek 400 for the past few years. I ride alone generally, once or twice a week as far as 35 miles. I want a bike that's lighter and has better, more modern components.

C) I've read and like a lot of the Rivendell philosophy, yet my 12 year younger brother rides a Felt carbon bike in group settings and LOVES it, so I'm torn... I've ruled an aluminum bike out. I'm gonna either get a carbon or a steel frame bike.

The Rivendell Roadeo weighs around 20 lbs. I don't wanna pay $3,700 for one, though!

Are there any other "light" steel bike alternatives that are less money?

Or should I say the heck with steel and go for a carbon instead? I'm okay with spending $1,200 for the right bike... maybe $1,500 or $2,000 if I was really impressed.

Oh, here's the last part... I live in Albany, GA, not exactly a hotbed of bike activity. We have 2 shops here, both very small... one is a Fuji dealer, the other is a Specialized dealer.

A lot of the bikes I'm looking at are on Craigslist and are anywhere from 90 miles to 200 miles away.

Thanks for your tips and thoughts,

Gary

If you go used, you may be able to find a carbon bike in your price range . I ride alone usually as do you, so I have no need to keep up with others. I'm happy with my steel Surly , but it's not light . Yes there are light steel bikes , but again, they are not inexpensive .

If you want something substantially lighter than your 400 I'd opt for a used carbon bike in good condition. Steel bikes that are that light tend to be more expensive (and my experience with steel durability hasn't been very good).

I was given a beautiful +3500 carbon bike, never really liked it much. Getting rid of it next month, though it is a fine bike for someone.

Love riding my C&V cr-mo bikes.

So, it's a matter of taste..do you really know what you want?

I'd love to have a Rodeo in the stable, but like you I'm not clear on why I need to drop $3700 on it. Especially when you can get a killer C&V bike for under $1500.

Take your time, buy right.

I haven't ridden a carbon bike but my two steel bikes are more comfortable than the aluminum bikes I have.

I rode a 17 lb carbon Cannondale Synapse for 3 years, then upped my game to a Pinarello Opera steel bike with carbon seatstays at 18.5 lbs

not going back to a carbon bike again . The Opera has what i would consider a training wheelset (Mavic Cosmos) yet still rides livelier than the Synapse-- great bike. Also built a nice DeBernardi with Columbus steel tubing and a triple chainset that is more fun to ride than the modern 'Dale.

maybe if i stepped up to a 12k S Works, Colnago C60 or Cipollini i would see what all the carbon fuss is about, --- But when it comes to the "run of the mill" 3-5000$ machines, I'll take steel

heck, in your price range i have seen nice titanium Serottas on ebay and the like

I shopped all kinds of bikes, had a few hard rules. And broke both of them when I bought my 105 super six EVO. The downside is 25c tires max, I also never wanted a mostly white bike but who can explain what will "click". It is also a mid compact crank which was a challenge starting out this year :-).

Something like the Jamis Renegade Explat might be the go for you.

If you're after steel bikes, you're not going to have much luck at Fuji or Specialized dealers. I guess Specialized have the AWOL, but it's heavy and really for touring and gravel grinding. If you're after a light road bike it's not the bike you want.

I'm a guy who likes steel bikes but it comes at a cost, that cost is not always price, but scarcity. From that point of view, it's likely easier for you to find a carbon bike that you like, because you have local places that sell them.

If you really want to try Steel, your best bet is try to find a Jamis dealer (they have a range of steel road and gravel bikes) or bike shop that deals in QBP brand bikes like Surly and All-City. Looks like you're talking about a trip of >50 miles for either of those though.

Your other option is to buy online, but there you always have the issue that you don't really know if you like the bike until you get it, and if you don't like it, I you'll have to get it packaged back up to return it, likely at cost to you.

You need to decide if you buy into the Rivendell philosophy, or not. I read Peterson's book a few years back and like some of it, find some of it (particularly his anti bike kit stance) iconoclastic.

My takeaway from Peterson/Rivendell is, unless you are competing in a race, why worry about shaving off the very last gram off the weight of your bike? Pay for quality, whether or not it is super lightweight. A bicycle can and should be a machine to transport a 250 lb man and whatever gear/groceries/whatever he wants to take with him. And get wheels tires that will hold up to years of riding over a variety of surfaces, since unlike the pros in European stage races, you don't have a mechanic in a team car ready to jump out and change a wheel, or tire for you. Or fix your bike should you run into a mechanical in the middle of a tour.

If you are worried about getting a bike that is lighter than 20 lbs, then go carbon fiber. As for myself, I pretty much buy into some of Peterson's philosophy. Because I weigh over 250 lbs, I am not worried about shaving every last gm off the weight of my bike. It is much cheaper for me to shave 10 or 20 lbs off my body than to worry about a lb or two of bike weight. My back wheel is a touring model with 36 spokes, and I ride on tires that are more robust than they are aero or super lightweight. Why? Because at the speeds I ride, there isn't much aero advantage anyway, and because I would prefer to keep riding than to constantly change flats, or dealing with broken spokes. And while I like technological change, I won't be changing bikes just to have the latest and greatest electronic shifting 11 speed drivetrain. And barring a catasrophe, I fully expect that while I will be changing wheels, tires, brake pads, and drivetrain components eventually, that I will still be riding my current bike 10 or 15 years from now.

I'm riding an 18lb steel road bike, and that's with a 36h Clydesdale wheelset, so you don't need to go CF to be under 20lbs.

Personally, I'm a fan of steel.

If you do buy a used CF bike, be sure and inspect it carefully for ANY frame damage...you don't want to pay for someone else's problem.

I don't know what the Rivendell philosophy is. I can share my experience though. The short story is:

Anyone over 250 lbs that wants to ride on the road and do long miles, but not race, needs to ride a steel bike.

The long story is I've owned carbon, aluminum, steel and titanium bikes and steel is where it is at, imo. What the dealer won't tell you is most of Specialized carbon bikes (if not all) have a weight limit of 240 lbs. Granted, they will support more than that, but the manufacturer says don't ride them if you are over that.

As for where to get reasonably priced, but good steel bikes:

Black Mountain Cycles - Call Mike have him build you one to your specs

Adrenaline Bikes - Call them and tell them your budget and they will put you on a good steel bike (Soma, Ritchey, Gunnar, etc.)

Excel Sports - Online Bicycle Retailer - Call them and ask for pricing on a Ritchey Road Logic build

Bicycle Doctor USA Home - Call them and ask for pricing on a Ritchey Road Logic build

All of these places, you can tell them about you, your type of riding, they will get measurements and build a bike for you at a reasonable price.

On the flip side if you want to buy used, start combing Craigslist for Soma, Ritchey, All-City, Kona, Jamis, Gunnar steel bikes. Post them here and we can help you pick one out.

Welcome and good hunting :)

Fuji carbon bikes seem to be a bit more lenient on weight limits. For their "catagory 1 road bikes" they list 275lbs and for everything else they list 300lbs as the limit.

http://www.fujibikes.com/docs/FUJI+OWNERS+MANUAL.pdf

I agree with everything that @Jarrett2 says above, obviously as I own both a Ritchey Road Logic and a Black Mountain Cycles bike, but I'm also a pragmatist. ;)

True, but the Rivendell philosophy seems to take weight out of the equation, past a certain threshold.you can easily spend $4,000 for a Rivendell bike weighing closer to 30 lbs then 20 lbs.

OK, but I don't buy into the "Rivendell philosophy" which just seems like retro-grouchery to me. For that reason I don't think the choice is between CF and heavy steel.

I like to ride fast on a road bike and I never carry groceries on it. I like the feel of a light bike. I'm OK with my tires lasting only a season. I enjoy running the latest drivetrains and tech, I don't think riding a steel bike means that you're old fashioned. If I had the money I'd be all over installing SRAM Etap on my Road Logic for example. I don't expect to be riding my current bike 10-15 years from now, but that's more likely because I succumb to the N+1 bug than a failure of said bike. The "speeds I ride at" is as fast as possible.

If you're talking with racks and fenders, that's within reason. But a steel frame and fork with modern multi-speed setup shouldn't be over 25 lbs. My all steel Gunnar is about 20 lbs and it's fixed with brakes. So add a couple of lbs for gears and shifters.

My Waterford with Dura Ace is 19 lbs, but that's an all carbon fork.

Those are 59cm, so we're talking larger size bikes here.

I recently looked at the Cannondale 10. An awesome bike... but at my age the geometry was just way too aggressive (I am older).

Your '83 Trek 400.... has an old less aggression geometry... as does the Rivendell Rodeo.

Just based on your age, and the geometry of what you're used to.... if your looking at CF I'd test ride the Fuji Gran Fondo. At least it should be serviceable at your local Fuji bike shop.

Other than that.... and even stay close to the budget you mentioned. Look at a good used steel bike. Maybe even a higher-end old Trek. Take it down to bare metal and build it up light.

Personally, I ride carbon and aluminum frames and love them. I'm not a fan of steel; too heavy and too flexible in my experience. Aluminum frames work well with carbon fiber forks and slightly wider tires. My aluminum touring bike wears 700x32 tires and rides like a dream! Since it sounds like you don't have a whole lot of experience with bikes, I'd encourage you to ride a number of different models including those with different components and frame materials. I always tell my friends that they should ride at least one bike that's way out of their price range. You'll get a feel for what more expensive components and exotic frame materials are like and whether spending more money would provide any benefits you can discern. Since your budget sounds like it's $1200-1500 see if you can get a ride on a $2500-3000 bike. If you can't feel a difference, don't spend the money!

FYI, when you go shopping tell the salesman that you're interested in an "endurance geometry" bike (as opposed to a "race geometry" bike). That will likely make a lot more difference to your comfort than which frame material you choose. In the Specialized line-up, the Roubaix is their endurance geometry carbon fiber bike. The Secteur used to be the aluminum equivalent of the Roubaix, but it looks like it's been dropped. The Diverge is an aluminum frame that accepts wide tires, but the geometry looks a bit racey to me. For Fuji, you want the Gran Fondo (carbon) or Sportif (aluminum).

I am also a fan of the alum frames with carbon forks. And I like the Sportif too.

that is fine. As I said, I agree with some aspects, find others to be retro grouch era, like the aversion to kit. It was OP who brought up Rivendell. I am just wondering if OP really is concerned with weight if he really buys into Peterson's philosophy.

What kind of bike?

Gary

Racks, fenders, bags. Brakes with enough clearance to accommodate 35 mm tires or wider. That is how many, if not most Rivendells are set up. You can, of course build it up any way you want.

Ritchey Road Logic frameset that I built up myself.

I built it with a full 6800 Ultegra groupset, Ritchey WCS Alloy stem/handlebars + Thomson Elite seatpost. Wheelset is 36h Velocity Deep-V with Ultegra 6800 hubs. I could save another pound easily by replacing the wheelset with something light.

Cost to me was ~ $2300, but this was sourcing all the parts as cheaply as I could and doing the full build myself.

EDIT: He's a recent photo of said bike:

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=523291

I'm only throwing this in there because you mentioned 20 lbs. My Lynskey titanium bike weighed in at 20 lbs, with mid-level components and cheap wheels. They can be had for under 2K used.

Wrong size for you, but for reference:
Lynskey R230 Medium | eBay

Mine:

http://i798.photobucket.com/albums/y...y/IMG_3473.jpg